Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted April 24, 2014 Share Posted April 24, 2014 Sometimes I feel like "smart" people don't believe in God and I feel like superstitious and "dumb" people do. I realize that is not true, at all. But it's how I feel sometimes. Believing in the air without the wind is impossible. Pray for the wind, pray that God starts moving in your life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reyb Posted April 24, 2014 Share Posted April 24, 2014 Believing in the air without the wind is impossible. Pray for the wind, pray that God starts moving in your life. To know what is ‘air’ too hard for you to comprehend? Are you saying without wind you will never know if there is air? Do you inhale wind? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted April 24, 2014 Author Share Posted April 24, 2014 What you just said is not ‘foolishness in believing’ but, about ‘smart and dumb believer’. So, which is which you feel of yourself? I sometimes feel foolish and dumb for believing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Credo in Deum Posted April 24, 2014 Share Posted April 24, 2014 Now, why you have a feeling of being a ‘fool’ when you look at that cross? Can you further elaborate your reason to us? (Because, you simply said 'he looked stupid and ridiculous'). I am not very good at elaborating on my thoughts and feelings, but I will try. Nowadays when I am tempted with feelings of foolishness, I look at the cross and remember my journey from that experience I had in the church years ago, back when I was agnostic and leaning more towards being an atheist, and now. The idea that a man on a stick died for my sins seemed stupid and ridiculous to me. On top of that any human that would allow themselves to be crucified for people they would never know -let alone the ones they knew- wasn't something I could fully comprehend and it still isn't. I came to the conclusion that Christ was either a lunatic or God. Once I had ruled out the possibility that He was a lunatic, I was left with one choice. Christ was and is God. Yet because I am a very prideful human being, I still want a God I can fully comprehend. A God who's love I can fully comprehend. Please ask me about it and I will explain it further. No, I am leaving this to prayer. I think further conversion would just lead to more and more confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reyb Posted April 26, 2014 Share Posted April 26, 2014 (edited) I am not very good at elaborating on my thoughts and feelings, but I will try. Nowadays when I am tempted with feelings of foolishness, I look at the cross and remember my journey from that experience I had in the church years ago, back when I was agnostic and leaning more towards being an atheist, and now. The idea that a man on a stick died for my sins seemed stupid and ridiculous to me. On top of that any human that would allow themselves to be crucified for people they would never know -let alone the ones they knew- wasn't something I could fully comprehend and it still isn't. I came to the conclusion that Christ was either a lunatic or God. Once I had ruled out the possibility that He was a lunatic, I was left with one choice. Christ was and is God. Yet because I am a very prideful human being, I still want a God I can fully comprehend. A God who's love I can fully comprehend. No, I am leaving this to prayer. I think further conversion would just lead to more and more confusion. Credo, what you just ‘did’ are doings of teachers who are always trying to impress their listeners on how they become teachers as if their stories will give a little ‘awakening’ to an unbelieving hearts. Let us all ‘be honest’. Okay? Edited April 26, 2014 by reyb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Credo in Deum Posted April 26, 2014 Share Posted April 26, 2014 Credo, what you just ‘did’ are doings of teachers who are always trying to impress their listeners on how they become teachers as if their stories will give a little ‘awakening’ to an unbelieving hearts. Let us all ‘be honest’. Okay? Thank you for these remarks, Reyb. I will avoid answering your questions in the future since you're not really interested in my responses when you ask me questions. No, instead you're just looking for me to respond so you can have your moment to pontificate from your soapbox again. Good day and God bless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted April 26, 2014 Share Posted April 26, 2014 (edited) An angel appears to you and tells you you're having God's child. That would be pretty convincing to me, personally. Edited April 26, 2014 by FuturePriest387 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reyb Posted April 26, 2014 Share Posted April 26, 2014 Thank you for these remarks, Reyb. I will avoid answering your questions in the future since you're not really interested in my responses when you ask me questions. No, instead you're just looking for me to respond so you can have your moment to pontificate from your soapbox again. Good day and God bless. It is up to you and please, do not take it personally, as I have said many teachers are doing it and that is, for their own losses. Anyway….it is up to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouisvilleFan Posted April 26, 2014 Share Posted April 26, 2014 Sometimes I feel like "smart" people don't believe in God and I feel like superstitious and "dumb" people do. I realize that is not true, at all. But it's how I feel sometimes. There are many intelligent believers. You have to seek them out because not many of them are in the media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maximillion Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 Ultimately, we cannot know that there is a God. We come to believe based on the gift of faith freely bestowed by Him. Yes, there is that which is revealed through scripture, through the writings and traditions of the Church, but all that can be pretty meaningless unless one has a personal conviction. How does God reveal Himself? No idea - for you. I only know for me, and it would be pointless talking about that because that Revelation is unique to/for me. (though from what others say here and elsewhere there are some common features.) It is one of His wonders that He is able to be so uniquely spiritually fulfilling to all the unique humans in the world. That's why it is called having a personal relationship. Personally, I think it's a pointless debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4588686 Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 I came to the conclusion that Christ was either a lunatic or God. Once I had ruled out the possibility that He was a lunatic, I was left with one choice. Christ was and is God. Yet because I am a very prideful human being, I still want a God I can fully comprehend. A God who's love I can fully comprehend. No, I am leaving this to prayer. I think further conversion would just lead to more and more confusion. Or maybe the record is not completely accurate. I mean, the record is obviously not completely accurate since the Gospels disagree with themselves. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Credo in Deum Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 Or maybe the record is not completely accurate. I mean, the record is obviously not completely accurate since the Gospels disagree with themselves. :/ How do they disagree with themselves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Ryan Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 Or maybe the record is not completely accurate. I mean, the record is obviously not completely accurate since the Gospels disagree with themselves. :/ I think it is reasonable to assume that Christ Himself thought that He was the Word of God. Messianism and the idea of the Logos was a part of the religious culture of the time. None of the ideas in Christianity were made out of whole-cloth. Philo posited the Logos as the first-born of God. The Logos acted as an intermediary being between God and the World. The genetic similarity between Philo and Christian thought is unmistakable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4588686 Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 How do they disagree with themselves? http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=124572693 But moreover, that really doesn't change the fact that presenting the choice as either Jesus was a 'lunatic' or God is pretty obviously a false dichotomy. You can recognize this while still being a believing Catholic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Credo in Deum Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 But moreover, that really doesn't change the fact that presenting the choice as either Jesus was a 'lunatic' or God is pretty obviously a false dichotomy. You can recognize this while still being a believing Catholic. You're right. Christ was either a liar, a lunatic, or God. Sorry, I missed one. Also thanks for that link. I will check it out. I don't know if it is going to be worth my time though. His "they" instead of "we", and the whole "they didn't write it themselves but someone else did" is not really shocking. Neither is the "John focuses on Christ Divinity more than the others, so something must be wrong", hook. I personally would invite you to pick up a Haydock Bible and read the commentary as well as "Life of Christ" by Fulton J Sheen. There are a lot of things that appear to be contradictions in the Bible, but when researched, they're not contradictions at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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