Private Vows in The Laity/Spirituality

[Guest]

I have a few decision to make, after I see my SD again on 13th July and talking things over with him - well, at least begin or continue to talk things over with him.

1. I am considering a Third Order.  There is a certain type of freedom, however, in remaining as I am under private vows and living alone a secular life in the laity.  Freedom in that the rule I wrote and under which I live ensures that I am completely free in every way to live the lifestyle that I do and to which I feel called - and specifically written to ensure that that way of life remains intact.  Be that as it may, the criterion for any decision is "Is this what God is asking?"........and before one can answer that, it takes a time of prayerful discerning and research/questions, reflection, if necessary in order that one can insight the likely ins and outs of a decision. 
2. My water bill came in (double of that last year) with electricity and gas, ambulance subscription and approval for disability parking permit but first I need pay the subscription.  Our electricity and gas bills will be increasing by quite a bit from my next quarterly account.  I am under financial stress already with mainly food top shelf quality and groceries the object of cutbacks, even Buddie and MIssie are not eating as top shelf as before - hence, I am considering taking on another load of ironing and as a decision mainly of necessity but not only.  I only have one load at this time and by choice.  What I would do is make one week an ironing week and the next for appointments etc.  Just now I have three people with major life problems I am supporting including with visits.  Some I support via email only due to their location and am lagging there too.  I also have people I visit who are long overdue for another visit.  I have a house and garden to maintain.  I also feel that ironing  is a contemplative type of occupation - one cannot do anything else but iron when ironing, and it doesn't take mental application and effort. I would maintain my volunteering with SVP in the parish and other parish involvements on an on/off basis, or as required..................summary: just now I am all over the place and disorganised and hence not time efficient.  I need to manage my time better and increase income if possible.
3. I am still considering on and off whether to post more about my own journey with mental illness with no actual decision as yet.,.....and I may not be making any decisions on any of the above for a while until (with my SD's full advice on board), I personally feel comfortable with any actual decision or decisions I might make - and as indicating the direction to which God is pointing.  I look now and then at blog setups and then get cold feet, even repulsed by the notion..........while acutely aware that the past does not of necessity repeat...v.....those that do not learn from history are bound to repeat it.

My personal vow of obedience is to The Church and to my own rule of life. 

 

[Guest]

Nothing to do with anything at first glance........

Watching on and off the "Fr. Ted" series on FoxtelGo.   The series picks up on life's absurdities and the ridiculous, certain attitudes, concepts and dispositions (as comedy often will) and turns them into the comical and laughter.  By doing so, comedy can highlight just how absurd and ridiculous, general attitudes and concepts, dispositions, can be. At times I recognise that I am laughing at myself.

 

 

In the current episode, the script writers are addressing racism, discrimination, being wrongly judged, gossip, being unhelpfully 'helpful' and probably more issues if I think about it........all in a sitcom of about 30mins or less.

Have found the video on UTube "I Hear your a Racist now Father"

 

[Guest]

13 hours ago, BarbaraTherese said:

Watching on and off the "Fr. Ted" series on FoxtelGo.   The series picks up on life's absurdities and the ridiculous, certain attitudes, concepts and dispositions (as comedy often will) and turns them into the comical and laughter.  By doing so, comedy can highlight just how absurd and ridiculous, general attitudes and concepts, dispositions, can be. At times I recognise that I am laughing at myself.

After watching a couple of episodes, I decided that the "Fr Ted" sitcom is offensive and at times highly offensive.......and I mean REALLY offensive.. 

[WhoamI]

17 hours ago, BarbaraTherese said:

I have a few decision to make, after I see my SD again on 13th July and talking things over with him - well, at least begin or continue to talk things over with him.

1. I am considering a Third Order.  There is a certain type of freedom, however, in remaining as I am under private vows and living alone a secular life in the laity.  Freedom in that the rule I wrote and under which I live ensures that I am completely free in every way to live the lifestyle that I do and to which I feel called - and specifically written to ensure that that way of life remains intact.  Be that as it may, the criterion for any decision is "Is this what God is asking?"........and before one can answer that, it takes a time of prayerful discerning and research/questions, reflection, if necessary in order that one can insight the likely ins and outs of a decision. 
2. My water bill came in (double of that last year) with electricity and gas, ambulance subscription and approval for disability parking permit but first I need pay the subscription.  Our electricity and gas bills will be increasing by quite a bit from my next quarterly account.  I am under financial stress already with mainly food top shelf quality and groceries the object of cutbacks, even Buddie and MIssie are not eating as top shelf as before - hence, I am considering taking on another load of ironing and as a decision mainly of necessity but not only.  I only have one load at this time and by choice.  What I would do is make one week an ironing week and the next for appointments etc.  Just now I have three people with major life problems I am supporting including with visits.  Some I support via email only due to their location and am lagging there too.  I also have people I visit who are long overdue for another visit.  I have a house and garden to maintain.  I also feel that ironing  is a contemplative type of occupation - one cannot do anything else but iron when ironing, and it doesn't take mental application and effort. I would maintain my volunteering with SVP in the parish and other parish involvements on an on/off basis, or as required..................summary: just now I am all over the place and disorganised and hence not time efficient.  I need to manage my time better and increase income if possible.
3. I am still considering on and off whether to post more about my own journey with mental illness with no actual decision as yet.,.....and I may not be making any decisions on any of the above for a while until (with my SD's full advice on board), I personally feel comfortable with any actual decision or decisions I might make - and as indicating the direction to which God is pointing.  I look now and then at blog setups and then get cold feet, even repulsed by the notion..........while acutely aware that the past does not of necessity repeat...v.....those that do not learn from history are bound to repeat it.

My personal vow of obedience is to The Church and to my own rule of life. 

 

Wow...decisions to be made. I will keep you in my prayers.

Please pray for my discernment as well. Another door may have opened today...time and prayer needed to discern which door the good Lord want me to enter. 

If it makes any difference, I would definitely want to read whatever you decide to write!

[Guest]

35 minutes ago, WhoamI said:

Wow...decisions to be made. I will keep you in my prayers.

Please pray for my discernment as well. Another door may have opened today...time and prayer needed to discern which door the good Lord want me to enter. 

If it makes any difference, I would definitely want to read whatever you decide to write!

Hi there WhoamI  - Thank you and rest assured I am keeping you and your intentions in prayer.

I will be the same as you.  The decisions I do make will take time and prayer beforehand.  I see my SD on the 13th July coming, but that does not mean that I will make a decision then or even immediately after.  It may take a few appointments and talking things over before I feel comfortable and then follow through.  And even after that, it could be that further along the decision road I decide it wasn't for me after all.  The Lord's ways can be indeed mysterious and He can write straight in quite crooked lines I know well,. 

I will post into this thread when I do decide, but that does not mean in the immediate and because I say nothing in this thread over time does not mean that I have decided against and no longer discerning.  Time as the Will of God unfolds daily and sometimes I can be very slow to catch on.

God bless

[Guest]

2 hours ago, BarbaraTherese said:

.  Time as the Will of God unfolds daily and sometimes I can be very slow to catch on.

 

........and sincerely desiring God's Will be done, yet dreadful slow to catch on, I know from experience, that The Lord will nudge, nudge and nudge until I do wake up.....and while most often heard softly in the gentlest breeze.........He can shout if He must...........  ..........

[Guest]

I knew there was some quote that applied but memory failed me. Sitting under the pergola with a coffee before getting into the late afternoon/evening tasks and I remembered: "Trust in the LORD with all your heart, on your own intelligence rely not; In all your ways be mindful of Him, and He will make straight your paths."Vatican Bible: Proverbs Ch3

[Guest]

A few years ago and visiting my Carmelite nun buddies, we decided to sit on the front verandah (fronted by the ocean) on a beautiful day.  Next thing, Sr R said "Be careful of our pal".  I looked up and there was a huge garden spider in a equally huge web.  "It is a beautiful web, isn't it?".  With that, I stopped looking at a horrible huge garden spider and a nasty big web and began to see through Carmelite eyes.  The web was remarkably beautiful and so was the spider.

Many years ago again, my Carmelite pal, Sr A, and I were talking about the garden and I said something about weeds.  She called them "Oh, our uninvited guests?"

There is something really wondrous about seeing things as they are without all the conditioning and expectations that come to us through our culture, without all my own needs and hopes, expectations, best scenarios, political correctness etc. getting in the way and precluding seeing what is actually and truly really present.

Today, I needed to go out and in the rain.  I was able to get to my destination without getting caught in quite heavy rain and thanked The Lord for it.  On the way home, however, it began to rain rather heavily and I was able to thank God for the heavy rain knowing full well that all comes about through His Divine Providence: Luke 12 "Are not five sparrows sold for two small coins? ⁴ Yet not one of them has escaped the notice of God.Even the hairs of your head have all been counted. Do not be afraid. You are worth more than many sparrows"

I thanked Him for the heavy rain even if I did get caught in it (with my umbrella turning inside out in the wind) because it was His rain and He had good reasons for it as I struggled home, even if my umbrella was problematic with me pulling along my full trolley behind me (had to call in for groceries on the way home)........ and trying to hold the umbrella right side up to stop me getting drenched, as the jolly umbrella continually turned right side down, with me hiding underneath my poncho a wrap of paper (for a Baptismal gift) so it wouldn't get wet either.  I only have two hands for goodness sake!  Now I am quite prone to fine Aussie adjectives and phrases -and very often ......but all I could do this afternoon was laugh and thank God for my predicament - there was a good reason for it all I know, it just evaded me...........and I told Him so.  The Lord knows what I am thinking without being told, so I may as well come forth and be honest with what I am thinking and getting in touch with my own inner reality, rather than deceiving myself (never Him!) with the nice and good thoughts that I am supposed to have or ideally should have, or would have.

The above made me smile and laugh today.

I am thankful and grateful for the fact that much of my 'formation' has been a Carmelite one - my Carmelite nun pals the source over many years now.  I was first accepted to enter Carmel when I was 16, but not until I turned 21.  Life and me too got in the way.  Do I regret not entering? Well, I suppose I could with an experience like this afternoon sometimes maybe tempted to regret - but I never really do. "Jesus said, "No one who sets a hand to the plow and looks to what was left behind is fit for the kingdom of God." - and not to interpret that with nonsensical scrupulosity.  I never actually invest in regret at not entering monastic life or religious life itself when I allow reality to speak and not the delusions and illusions that can rise up from within.  After all, life out here in secular life in the laity might have its tough times and far tougher than heavy rain and being out and about in it juggling with only two hands.  But then I know that monastic and religious life can get tough and tougher too in other ways possibly.  Or perhaps in different clothing we all experience the same tough and tougher challenges.

No matter the vocation and call in which we serve and love God and neighbour, He will provide more than sufficient to make great saints of us.  It is all a question of our response to His Graces always present - absolutely guaranteed.  Sometimes a response can be immediate and generous, perhaps even touched by the heroic.  Other times, I can fail and miserably so.....or I am just dragging myself reluctantly along the way.  Other times still, it is going to take me on a journey to learn just how to respond and as I should, nothing generous or heroic about it at all.  All is ok with Him***, He keeps working to make great saints in every single life and vocation, states of life all of them and without exceptions.......and at all times everywhere.

_____________

***  "For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has similarly been tested in every way, yet without sin. So let us confidently approach the throne of grace to receive mercy and to find grace for timely help." Vatican New American Bible translation ..........after all, Jesus Himself said that He has come for sinners, that the righteous have no need of Him.

[Guest]

Excerpt: "Creighton Univ. Daily Gospel Reflection. 7th July 2016"
 

Quote

 

"All of us are called to be gardeners in our lives and relationships.   As God’s partners in this world, we too must be sowers.  Paul Molinari SJ said it the best:  You must not be concerned about the fruit of what you do.  You must be generous in throwing the seed with open hands, without becoming discouraged when the fertile soil seems scarce… God, on the other hand, would have us sow generously, extravagantly, even wastefully—wherever we may find ourselves.  We can afford to, too, knowing full well that God is the keeper of the harvest.  We are mere sowers.  As such, we need concern ourselves solely with this: 

"How wide is the arc of our throw, how open our hands?" 

 

The above is in the spirit of the Parable of The Sower.

[Guest]

Excerpt from Pope Francis's Prayer for the Year of Mercy: Full text HERE

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"You willed that your ministers would also be clothed in weakness
in order that they may feel compassion for those in ignorance and error:
let everyone who approaches them feel sought after, loved, and forgiven by God. "

 

I think that realising my own weaknesses and failures, I am not so quick at all to castigate those who may be in ignorance and error.  Having asked and received compassion and forgiveness from God for my own many weaknesses and failures, it is that same compassion and forgiveness that I, in its' abundance, have to share with others.

The Love and Mercy of God and all it contains does not go out without returning fruitful to yet again set out.  I cannot love God without from that self same love, at the self same time, love all others.  Love of God and neighbour are one.

[Guest]

There are many sacrifices a lay person in secular life called to private vows is going to have to make (to use an example with which I am nowadays quite familiar).  Sacrifices one would not have needed to make in religious life.  However, if one enters religious life, then there are sacrifices one will have to make not asked in private vows in the laity.

A bit of reflection will reveal what sacrifices might apply in either vocation ......... but there are some sacrifices only evident in actually living out the vocation in the day to day as God's Will unfolds daily.

The criterion for any vocation at all, of course, is that to which I am called by God...........whatever sacrifices asked along the way are incidental and fringe benefits (The Cross) - be the sacrifices major or quite minor.  One makes those sacrifices in order to live out one's vocation - and without which one could not be truly faithful to one's personal vocation in the day to day unfoldings........ i.e.  God's Will daily unfolding in every and all vocational states.

In every vocation and call from God, and without exemptions at all, there are going to be sacrifices and The Cross along the way.......because in every life and vocation, God grants sufficiency in an abundance (and more) of every Grace to make great saints.. This is inbuilt into all and every vocational call from God.

What is perhaps not commonly understood possibly is that one has a vocation and call from God at every moment of every life.  Prior to moving out of the celibate laity and entering into another state in life, one has the vocational call from God to celibate laity or the single life.  Private vows (to evangelical counsels) could be said to be one category within celibate laity in secular life.
 

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Vatican Translation "New American Bible"

2 Corinthians Ch 9 "Each must do as already determined, without sadness or compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.Moreover, God is able to make every grace abundant for you, so that in all things, always having all you need, you may have an abundance for every good work".

 

 

Edited July 8, 2016 by BarbaraTherese

[Guest]

@dUSt

See ........... Thread Title in Open Mic: "Seeing up an easily located blog"

[Guest]

Just trying to do some research and came across this old thread -..............and responding here (in accordance I hope with Phatmass rules i.e. refrain posting into an old thread - rather  link to the old thread) :

Question on Private Vows (December 2012)

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On 28.12.12  Chiquitunga said "She ( Sr. Marie-Angelique)was saying how many graces followed after making her vows"

 

Certainly many Graces have followed my renewing life private vows at a Home Mass for the purpose - and obvious entirely humbling Graces since the Home Mass on 14.8.14 Solemnity of The Assumption.

On ‎28‎/‎12‎/‎2012 at 7:00 PM, Chiquitunga said:

However, I did ask a good priest this once and pointed him to this CA thread, plus the example of saints like Blessed Elizabeth and St. Maravillas who did not first seek the advise of a priest/make their vows with a priest to witness, as St. Teresa of the Andes did and Sr. Marie-Angelique. Here is his reply:

 

Some of the saints were moved to make private vows without speaking to a confessor, but I think these are the exception. And they later submitted everything to the confessor. There are many rea-sons for this. Here are some.... It prevents the devil from getting into our acts of religion. It prevents us from making a mistake. It subdues our pride. It prevents scruples too. Our Lord always works through His Church.

My journey with private vows must be over 35 years now I think - actual dates are retained in my files here somewhere.

I made private vows quite privately on a temporary basis, renewed every year and at the time a potential vocation to religious life was also on the back shelf of my mind - I discerned against.  That was years before I sought advice and discerned re making the vows for life.  At the time I was aware of my track record in the past under the vows renewed yearly and realizing I had no idea what would unfold in the future no matter the past - including serious repeated episodes of psychotic bipolar at that time.  What I needed advice about (from a priest who knew me exceptionally well including my bipolar condition and the related episodes back then) was his opinion re my making the vows for life and he replied in the affirmative, tacking on "providing they are for life of course". Which they would be and are, of course.  I then very privately made the vows for life.  Further on down the line (after many years of being unable to find a SD willing to direct a lay woman under private vows who suffered a bipolar episodic condition), I came across a priest religious willing to direct me (my current SD and confessor).  After a few visits to get to know each other including showing him past spiritual references from priests and a nun as well as a neighbour and senior mental health workers, I spoke to him about the potential for a Home Mass for renewal of life vows....... and before I knew what was happening really, he advised me that he had spoken to our Archbishop who had given his permission.

I think with that I probably went into shock.  So many years with refusals of one kind or another and now I was not being turned down.  A shock to conditioning.

Profound and humbled gratitude and thanksgiving........and tears for something I had resigned myself to would be another refusal.

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Previously quoted by Chiquitunga: The Maxims and Sayings of St Philip Neri - these are a series of truly excellent and profound short and concise advice on the spiritual life.

My comment:  These maxims and sayings are absolutely worthwhile reading.

[Guest]

Membership of St Vincent de Paul Society is a process of formation

 -  a rule for the journey.

 

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Vincentian Family Daily Reflection: http://famvin.org/reflections/daily-reflection-july-8/

 

“O, my Heavenly Father, I know that these contradicting events are permitted and guided by Thy wisdom, which alone is light.”
– St. Elizabeth Ann Seton

– In the confusion of this present age, it is often difficult to discern the best path to take in dealing with troublesome situations. Lord, I need the wisdom of your Spirit to guide my decision making so your holy will can be accomplished through me.

 

 

[Guest]

Reading the maxims of St Philip Neri HERE and see Maxim #13 (all of them are worth a read!).  He advises initially making temporary vows which I did for quite a few years, renewed yearly.  The advise in question of St Philip also advises conditional temporary vows - and this advice was a memory jog and is what I did also because of bipolar episodes.  My condition was that in the event of an episode, my vows and my rule of life were suspended until after the episode when normality and reality returned.  I just never knew in any way whatsoever what might occur during an episode and so I though the condition was the best and safest way for me to travel.  I had no problems with making the vows conditional under some circumstances since I thought it was an application of common sense and prudence...even wisdom - I did think possibly others might not understand, not that I have ever shared it till now nor even remembered it indeed***; however, I knew beyond question that The Lord understood completely in Compassionate Mercy and Understanding.  That I never doubted as long as I was in touch with reality that is.  Reality can be a weird thing with a sufferer of mental illness.  Others, including mental health professionals might state similar to: "You know it isn't real." Now that is a weird thing to say when the sufferer experiences their psychotic world as THE reality and it is the other person who is out of touch with reality.  Private vows are between self and God alone.  While "private" (as in private vows) is a Canon Law term to distinguish from public vows in consecrated life -  and therefore does not of necessity mean that one must keep private vows to oneself. 

I recall one episode much too vividly in which my sense of loneliness and absolute aloneness was truly crushing.  The world was still going round, but I was not in it - excluded. Not only that but all my comforting concepts about God crashed completely and I had no idea whatsoever about God other than fears.  This experience was so profound to me that I cried profusely: "No one should never ever be this lonely, this alone".  It wasn't anything of The Dark Night, since I slipped into a state of overwhelming anxiety, terror actually - almost despair, and was hospitalized.  But what travels with me today is that some people actually do journey in life terribly alone, isolated and lonely, with a crushing sense of hopelessness and meaninglessness, a sense of exclusion from the world going on around them.  They do not feel they belong. 

_______________________

*** Some bipolar episodes I can recall, some even vividly, others I cannot - although some sort of memory jog can occur and a memory floods back into consciousness.............most often totally unwelcome.  I simply do not want to remember some things that happened during episodes.  I call memory "a filing cabinet" with drawers that will fly open for no particular reason and sometimes most unwelcomingly.  Bipolar can be a difficult illness to understand as all mental illness is to some degree or other to a non sufferer.  What is really strange about bipolar is that one can be totally off the plant and out of touch with reality for a quite short or even a quite lengthy period.  After the episode passes, one returns to a normal state - well, whatever normality actually is - and not even psychiatrist nor psychologists know......or any other "ist" or "er" either.

I went through a very long stage indeed of not knowing who I was.  Was I the ill person and the reality I experienced when ill true reality?  Or was I the well person and my when-well-reality really the true one.  I simply did not know which was really me nor actual reality.  How did I survive?  I knew I had to survive in the world as it was experiencing itself and it's reality and so I began observe the thinking and behaviour of others and what they believed and I imitated.  As that journey progressed and I learnt to feel comfortable in their world, I learnt to experience my own inner reality which is not of necessity the reality that others think about re oneself.  I learnt to invest in my own inner reality and allow others to experience theirs.  Sort of: two ships passing in the night and if we should meet, it is beautiful.

I read somewhere that in an insane world, the sane will be considered insane.  How true that is when one thinks about it.

All is Grace.