Which Spirituality?

[Kayte Postle]

It's a work-in-progress but a friend and I have been working on this guide to discerning your spirituality. It's imperfect, but it's just the things we've found helpful and found in other resources. 

 

Thank you for that resource EmilyAnn, I've been reading through it the past hour and there's so much useful information!

[SilentJoy]

It's a work-in-progress but a friend and I have been working on this guide to discerning your spirituality. It's imperfect, but it's just the things we've found helpful and found in other resources. 

Thank you, I'm interested as well. I think I will really enjoy looking at your site!

[PhuturePriest]

^^^^^

That is what I used to do but now I kind of think I know what I want and am being called to be.

 

It's not a matter of not knowing what you want and are called to be, it's just not knowing what specific established spirituality you fall under. There is a difference. I think I know what I want to do and am planning to go through with it, even though I don't know what spirituality I fall under. I just don't see the need to find a spirituality to label yourself, really. As long as you have a spiritual director that helps you figure out who you are as a person, you'll know what works best for you spiritually and what you should work on, even without knowing what spirituality you fit closest to.

 

I don't dislike the idea of spiritualities and am not attacking the idea, just to be clear. I was just giving my opinion that finding the spirituality you fit closest under is not nearly as important as just finding out who you are as a person and what you are drawn towards. After all, no two people have the same spiritualities. They may have a lot in common, but they do differ on specific points that both find important to them.

Edited January 22, 2014 by FuturePriest387

[beatitude]

I've honestly never bothered myself with finding which "spirituality" I am. I know what appeals to me and what doesn't, and that's what matters the most. There really isn't a rule stating you have to label yourself this or that spirituality, and it's best to just discern what really speaks to you and go with that. It's also really easy to kind of unintentionally strive for one spirituality or another, because your favorite Saint had this one or that one. That's a pitfall I've noticed with some people, and I know myself enough to know I would probably end up being one of those people, so I just avoid the matter altogether.

 

I think this is very solid advice. As I wrote, I fit very closely with the spirituality of Charles de Foucauld, but I never went out looking for a spirituality, thinking, "Which is mine?" The realisation came gradually as I lived my life. De Foucauld placed great emphasis on doing simple work, as Jesus did at Nazareth, and taking the lowest place - something that resonated with me when I heard of it, as my first job after university was minimum wage and classed as 'unskilled'. And I could see how such work had become prayer for me, so what Brother Charles wrote in this respect made sense. Then I found many other things that made sense. It was like a jigsaw puzzle coming together, but I never actively went looking for pieces.

 

I think it is also worth remembering that in other times people had a very different attitude to religious discernment than we have today. Ruth Burrows, the Carmelite nun whose books I love (To Believe in Jesus - try it!!), felt a calling to be a contemplative nun. In her autobiography, Before the Living God, she talks about two monasteries that lay relatively close by - one Carmelite, one Cistercian - and how she consulted a priest friend about which one to enter. He suggested the Carmelites, partly because the idea of the Cistercians seemed more alarming to Ruth's mother. She entered Carmel at seventeen and is now a very elderly lady, and she's never looked back. To us, used to going on discernment retreats and reading all sorts of books about different spiritualities, this approach seems odd. But it does have its merits. Until the age of budget air and train travel, most people entered a convent or monastery nearby, and they did not place such emphasis on spirituality and charism. They simply couldn't afford to. I do not say our modern approach is wrong, or that the old approach was wrong - both have sensible reasons behind them - but we can learn from both and we should be aware that working out our spirituality may not always be the most practical way to find our home.

[PhuturePriest]

I think this is very solid advice. As I wrote, I fit very closely with the spirituality of Charles de Foucauld, but I never went out looking for a spirituality, thinking, "Which is mine?" The realisation came gradually as I lived my life. De Foucauld placed great emphasis on doing simple work, as Jesus did at Nazareth, and taking the lowest place - something that resonated with me when I heard of it, as my first job after university was minimum wage and classed as 'unskilled'. And I could see how such work had become prayer for me, so what Brother Charles wrote in this respect made sense. Then I found many other things that made sense. It was like a jigsaw puzzle coming together, but I never actively went looking for pieces.

 

I think it is also worth remembering that in other times people had a very different attitude to religious discernment than we have today. Ruth Burrows, the Carmelite nun whose books I love (To Believe in Jesus - try it!!), felt a calling to be a contemplative nun. In her autobiography, Before the Living God, she talks about two monasteries that lay relatively close by - one Carmelite, one Cistercian - and how she consulted a priest friend about which one to enter. He suggested the Carmelites, partly because the idea of the Cistercians seemed more alarming to Ruth's mother. She entered Carmel at seventeen and is now a very elderly lady, and she's never looked back. To us, used to going on discernment retreats and reading all sorts of books about different spiritualities, this approach seems odd. But it does have its merits. Until the age of budget air and train travel, most people entered a convent or monastery nearby, and they did not place such emphasis on spirituality and charism. They simply couldn't afford to. I do not say our modern approach is wrong, or that the old approach was wrong - both have sensible reasons behind them - but we can learn from both and we should be aware that working out our spirituality may not always be the most practical way to find our home.

 

Exactly. As long as you properly discern and learn about who you are, you'll know which spirituality you are simply by watching it happen before your eyes. I've noticed a trend of people who want to get their hands on what spirituality is theirs right off the bat, and I'm not sure if this is wise. If you asked me what I thought my spirituality was when I was an annoying and ignorant 14 year old, I probably would have said Franciscan, because out of all of the zillions of communities I looked at, at least 75% of them were Franciscan. But I don't feel a deep calling to dedicate my life to the poor for the rest of my life, nor do I feel called to live an extremely austere lifestyle, both of which are at the heart of a Franciscan spirituality. I find the idea of teaching in a classroom or even evangelizing in a different country far more appealing than dedicating my life to the poor. I'd even find living in a cloistered monastery more appealing than that, and I'm one of the most extroverted and talkative people I know. I don't know which spirituality that indicates (Though I do know which ones it doesn't), but I'm not going to worry myself with knowing what it is, yet. My personal spirituality is still developing and maturing, and as long as I listen to my spiritual director and keep a close relationship with God, my spirituality will unfold before my eyes, rather than be told to me by an online quiz.

Edited January 22, 2014 by FuturePriest387

[beatitude]

I find the idea of teaching in a classroom or even evangelizing in a different country far more appealing than dedicating my life to the poor. I'd even find living in a cloistered monastery more appealing than that, and I'm one of the most extroverted and talkative people I know. I don't know which spirituality that indicates (Though I do know which ones it doesn't), but I'm not going to worry myself with knowing what it is, yet. My personal spirituality is still developing and maturing, and as long as I listen to my spiritual director and keep a close relationship with God, my spirituality will unfold before my eyes, rather than be told to me by an online quiz.

 

I think you are blurring the lines a bit between ministry and spirituality. After all, a contemplative Dominican nun and an apostolic Dominican sister have very different ministries, but they share a spirituality. Some Franciscans teach at a high level (my university chaplain was a Franciscan friar, and the Franciscan Sisters of the Eucharist have a reputation for being quite intellectual), while others minister to people living on the street in a very practical way (like the CFRs). Whether they are university lecturers or soup kitchen cooks, they have that same spirituality. The spirituality is something deeper than the ministry. A Franciscan university lecturer may live out poverty by always being aware that she has no knowledge of her own, nothing to give except what comes from God - and she rejoices in that fact, as St Francis taught. She is not working in a homeless shelter, but she still has the Franciscan understanding of poverty - to live "poor in fact but rich in spirit" -  that remains no matter which ministry she is involved in.

 

Early in my discernment, I looked for a community with a ministry that I liked. But there is no guarantee that I could have taken part in that ministry had I entered the community - they might have asked me to assist the cook or something totally different! Ministry is one factor in finding out where you belong, but not the only one. I hope this is clear. I am in a caffeinated sleep-deprived haze and I may not be making much sense today. :P

Edited January 22, 2014 by beatitude

[PhuturePriest]

I think you are blurring the lines a bit between ministry and spirituality. After all, a contemplative Dominican nun and an apostolic Dominican sister have very different ministries, but they share a spirituality. Some Franciscans teach at a high level (my university chaplain was a Franciscan friar, and the Franciscan Sisters of the Eucharist have a reputation for being quite intellectual), while others minister to people living on the street in a very practical way (like the CFRs). Whether they are university lecturers or soup kitchen cooks, they have that same spirituality. The spirituality is something deeper than the ministry. A Franciscan university lecturer may live out poverty by always being aware that she has no knowledge of her own, nothing to give except what comes from God - and she rejoices in that fact, as St Francis taught. She is not working in a homeless shelter, but she still has the Franciscan understanding of poverty - to live "poor in fact but rich in spirit" -  that remains no matter which ministry she is involved in.

 

Early in my discernment, I looked for a community with a ministry that I liked. But there is no guarantee that I could have taken part in that ministry had I entered the community - they might have asked me to assist the cook or something totally different! Ministry is one factor in finding out where you belong, but not the only one. I hope this is clear. I am in a caffeinated sleep-deprived haze and I may not be making much sense today. :P

 

It was my understanding that certain spiritualities are drawn towards certain things and ministries. Is this not so?

[JulianofLdn]

I know what appeals to me and what doesn't, and that's what matters the most. 

 

Thanks for the replies, everybody, and for the whole conversation, which is both extremely interesting and helpful.

 

I could have quoted all of FuturePriest's and Beatitude's posts: I've just propped them instead  :winner:  There's good advice in there, for which I'm grateful.

 

I've quoted the above, though, because it perfectly highlights the gap between where you guys are and where I am. I don't know what appeals to me because I don't know enough about them.

 

(I do realise I'm falling into a familiar trap of trying to control things that aren't mine to control; I'm actively telling myself not to worry about the future and what I might do or not do when I'm best concentrating on today. And your posts are keeping me honest in that regard, so once again: thanks!)

 

But I don't have a favorite saint - apart from the person I've named myself after, lol, and she wasn't a member of any order at all! - and only the barest sense of what the different spiritualities have to offer.  It's just looking for guidance from the experienced to see where to start, if you see what I mean :hehe2:  I'll get where I'm going - God'll see to that - but I do like the learning that's offered along the way  :scholar:

[PhuturePriest]

Thanks for the replies, everybody, and for the whole conversation, which is both extremely interesting and helpful.

 

I could have quoted all of FuturePriest's and Beatitude's posts: I've just propped them instead  :winner:  There's good advice in there, for which I'm grateful.

 

I've quoted the above, though, because it perfectly highlights the gap between where you guys are and where I am. I don't know what appeals to me because I don't know enough about them.

 

(I do realise I'm falling into a familiar trap of trying to control things that aren't mine to control; I'm actively telling myself not to worry about the future and what I might do or not do when I'm best concentrating on today. And your posts are keeping me honest in that regard, so once again: thanks!)

 

But I don't have a favorite saint - apart from the person I've named myself after, lol, and she wasn't a member of any order at all! - and only the barest sense of what the different spiritualities have to offer.  It's just looking for guidance from the experienced to see where to start, if you see what I mean :hehe2:  I'll get where I'm going - God'll see to that - but I do like the learning that's offered along the way  :scholar:

 

Some of the ways to figure out your spirituality are asking yourself questions like "What kind of prayer am I drawn towards?" I'm a big fan of the Rosary and of reading prayers out of prayer books, and I also love just talking to God and the Saints. That being said, I know many people who as soon as they get to the Apostles Creed during the Rosary are completely distracted by something else and can't focus whatsoever during it, and are the same with prayers out of prayer books. Some people find praying while they work is where they are the best, but for me, I might as well not pray at all while working. I can't focus on doing something and focus on praying at the same time. I can't even work and talk at the same time, in all honesty. Every time I work with someone, when I start to speak, I subconsciously stop whatever job I'm doing. From what I understand, the type of prayer you are drawn to is a large part of what kind of spirituality you have. There are some who love praying in silence, and you'll typically find these people prefer the EF Mass, because it is silent for so much of it. I can't stand a lot of silence, because if there is no priest speaking or praying, my mind wanders everywhere but the Mass.

[beatitude]

It was my understanding that certain spiritualities are drawn towards certain things and ministries. Is this not so?

 

In one sense, I think you are right. Benedictines place a great emphasis on hospitality, for example, so giving retreats and running a guesthouse fit very well with their spirituality. And as Dominicans are the Order of Preachers, teaching seems like a natural thing for them to do. But there are many other, less obvious ways in which hospitality can be extended and preaching carried out: say if a Benedictine monk is on the train, wanting to read quietly, and someone insists on plunking themselves down next to him and talking to him, he might see having a friendly conversation as an expression of Benedictine kindness and welcome. A Dominican sister in the same situation might see it as an opportunity to learn from the other passenger and to help the other person learn something too. The sister and the monk are both doing the exact same thing (maybe even saying the exact same things!) but their approach is shaped by the tradition that has shaped them. This is what I meant when I said that I think spirituality goes deeper than the ministry. I could be wrong - it would be interesting to get the perspectives of some of the PM religious on this. This is just how I understand it.

 

Ultimately loving God is what matters most and you don't have to be able to label yourself to your satisfaction in order to do that. These different spiritualities and charisms within the Church just represent all the ways in which people have loved Him, and I think there are more similarities than differences - the greatest one being Jesus' presence. I think it's beautiful that we have such a lot of variety in the Church as we need it so much, but we mustn't lose sight of the unity and the simplicity too. :)

[JulianofLdn]

Ultimately loving God is what matters most and you don't have to be able to label yourself to your satisfaction in order to do that. These different spiritualities and charisms within the Church just represent all the ways in which people have loved Him, and I think there are more similarities than differences - the greatest one being Jesus' presence. I think it's beautiful that we have such a lot of variety in the Church as we need it so much, but we mustn't lose sight of the unity and the simplicity too. :)

 

A million times yes! Absolutely.

 

Yet I had no idea of the rich variance found here. I loved the description of how the Benedictine and Dominican would both approach the stranger on the train and the consideration of spirituality and ministry and how the two work together. 

[ChristinaTherese]

I've found that after I basically stopped thinking/worrying about where I was called things started to get clearer, to a point where I found myself looking about a month ago in prayer and just saying, "Why is it so clear now?" And I didn't have much idea of what different spiritualities are either. So, I don't know, but if you are open and maybe just hang around and learn about yourself and various orders, I'll bet things will get clearer. And I also think that discerning with places where you are NOT called is maybe a good thing just to find out who you are and where you're called. So don't be afraid of taking a while and exploring in lots of directions. It will help you learn more about yourself, which will be a good thing in the long run and help you find where you're really called. (And I didn't grow up Catholic either.)

[beatitude]

Thanks for the replies, everybody, and for the whole conversation, which is both extremely interesting and helpful.

 

I could have quoted all of FuturePriest's and Beatitude's posts: I've just propped them instead  :winner:  There's good advice in there, for which I'm grateful.

 

I've quoted the above, though, because it perfectly highlights the gap between where you guys are and where I am. I don't know what appeals to me because I don't know enough about them.

 

(I do realise I'm falling into a familiar trap of trying to control things that aren't mine to control; I'm actively telling myself not to worry about the future and what I might do or not do when I'm best concentrating on today. And your posts are keeping me honest in that regard, so once again: thanks!)

 

But I don't have a favorite saint - apart from the person I've named myself after, lol, and she wasn't a member of any order at all! - and only the barest sense of what the different spiritualities have to offer.  It's just looking for guidance from the experienced to see where to start, if you see what I mean :hehe2:  I'll get where I'm going - God'll see to that - but I do like the learning that's offered along the way  :scholar:

 

Little Sister Magdeleine (founder of the Little Sisters of Jesus, a religious community inspired by Blessed Charles de Foucauld) wrote for her sisters, "Before being religious, be human and be Christian in all the strength and beauty of those terms."

 

By 'religious', she could have meant being religiously observant or being in the religious life as a sister or brother. Either way, it's excellent advice. I think it's particularly appropriate for you. I am a cradle Catholic and I am still learning my faith. In fact, I'm barely wetting my toes. We have a huge rich heritage in liturgy, in prayer, in customs, in languages, in so much - no one knows it all! There's always something new to discover. It's not a question of you having to catch up. Jesus comes to us all where we are, as we are, so there is no catching up to be done - he's already caught us and providing we are utterly trusting in him, he will walk with us to where we need to go. Those people who say "I am a Carmelite at heart" or I am a Dominican" haven't got something that you haven't.

 

Your favourite saint was a remarkable woman (I'm assuming it's Mother Julian of Norwich?) and I can think of few books better than her Revelations of Divine Love for any Christian, new or old. Remember her prayer:

 

God, of Thy goodness, give me Thyself;

For Thou art enough for me,

and I can ask for nothing less

that can be full honour to Thee.

And if I ask anything that is less,

ever shall I be in want,

for only in Thee have I all.

 

This is what we are all asking for - the gift of God. We don't ask for the gift of God only to get too concerned about the packaging and the postal van it comes in, and this is what happens if we get preoccupied with questions like, "Which spirituality?". ;) Don't worry about what you're going to be or do in the future, focus on living in the present moment and recognising God in each day, and everything will become clear. This is all any of us ever needs to do because that present moment is all we're ever going to have. I am a terrible one for worrying about the future (I have suffered from clinical levels of anxiety in the past, a recurrent problem) and it took me a very long time to realise the truth of this. I kept trying to calm myself down with things like, "I'll get there in the end, I have to trust God" - without pausing to think that I don't have to think about 'there' at all. Here is more than enough to be going on with, and you have everything you need for this moment. Jesus takes care of that.

Edited January 22, 2014 by beatitude

[nikita92]

This is all wonderful insight! Thank you

[SilentJoy]

Thank you for a beautiful post, Beatitude!