Fellow Discerner Reports

[Graciela]

Yes, communities are very concerned about weight- perhaps moreso with overweight, but also with underweight and weird eating habits (concerns about eating disorders?).  I guess the wider society's fixation is reflected in these religious communities. That has always been true- religious communities' preferences about physical attributes change with the times.  If one looks at pictures of the foundress of the Maryknoll sisters, they will find that she was quite big. Today, she might well be refused for being too big, but her size was considered a positive attribute at the time, indicating robust good health, sturdiness and strength!

 

The sense of being under surveillance about food and weight (and almost everything else, for that matter) can be very real in formation-  I guess it is the "forming" part of formation, but not all communities have the skills and emotional maturity to do so with respect and compassion for adult women in formation.  This may be a holdover from the vocation boom days when high school aged girls or new high school grads of 17 or 18 made up the majority of the novitiate.

 

What is most sad to me is the sense of being judged negatively based on appearance by those supposedly committed to manifesting God's love in the world.  And knowing about such attitudes on the part of  a community before one enters is a great grace, rather than finding out after one enters.  So, on balance, I would prefer communities to just be upfront about their weight concerns during initial visits.

 

 

[NotreDame]

Do you have some source for this?  I wouldn't agree with everything here... Losing weight is basic math of calories in and calories out. All diets basically follow this rule but in different ways which different people find helpful.  I run, which is cardio, and I have never found it to do what you say it does and I've lost 30 pounds from my highest weight.

 

I would just be careful to promote information that follows only one path to weight loss.  Everyone enjoys different types of food and diffferent types of exercise and they have to find the right mix to create a healthy lifestyle for themselves.  Diets are really not what you want anyway... a lifestyle that supports healthful living is what the goal should be.

 

It's hard to lose weight but the difference one feels once they do is priceless.  I second the suggestion to use spark people.   

 

I never said it was the only way.   I said those are the main ways (more than one) that actually work for people. 

 

You are in your 20's, right?  As you get older the running won't be as effective and your body won't tolerate caloric deficit without more severe hormonal changes.

[Pia Jesu]

Yes, communities are very concerned about weight- perhaps moreso with overweight, but also with underweight and weird eating habits (concerns about eating disorders?).  I guess the wider society's fixation is reflected in these religious communities. That has always been true- religious communities' preferences about physical attributes change with the times.  If one looks at pictures of the foundress of the Maryknoll sisters, they will find that she was quite big. Today, she might well be refused for being too big, but her size was considered a positive attribute at the time, indicating robust good health, sturdiness and strength!

 

The sense of being under surveillance about food and weight (and almost everything else, for that matter) can be very real in formation-  I guess it is the "forming" part of formation, but not all communities have the skills and emotional maturity to do so with respect and compassion for adult women in formation.  This may be a holdover from the vocation boom days when high school aged girls or new high school grads of 17 or 18 made up the majority of the novitiate.

 

What is most sad to me is the sense of being judged negatively based on appearance by those supposedly committed to manifesting God's love in the world.  And knowing about such attitudes on the part of  a community before one enters is a great grace, rather than finding out after one enters.  So, on balance, I would prefer communities to just be upfront about their weight concerns during initial visits.

 

[Pia Jesu]

Sorry...the quote appeared a bit early!  You make some very important points, Graciela!  Not only is the wider's society view on weight reflected in religious communities--but there is a tradition of the "disciplined body" seen throughout church history.  Perhaps it is conflated with asceticism, fasting, etc., I'm not quite sure.  It may, however, be the reason we see the "beautiful young nun" image in so many vocation brochures.  It is an ideal that, from all the posts here, is difficult to attain (or sustain)!  For the overweight candidate to religious life, any unexpected negative treatment by his/her community could lead not only to disappointment but to a potentially tragic situation.  I would hope, like you said, that part of the application process would include a discussion of such issues.  I've always felt that the sign of a true vocation is the ability to function well and live the life in a responsible way.  I know many religious women who

have never let a few extra pounds stand in the way of responding to grace!

[OnlySunshine]

I remember when I was living at a convent as a "live-in" experience which was supposed to last 6 weeks but only lasted 3 days.  There were many reasons for the experience ending so soon but one that stands out in my mind, apart from anxiety, was the fact that the Superior was very critical of my eating habits.  A few months before, I had been to the doctor and was told I really needed to lose weight.  I started taking Alli and wasn't able to eat very fatty foods because of the problem of excreting excess fat at really inconvenient times (rather embarrassing!).  When I was accepted for the live-in, I didn't even take the meals into account because I had no experience living at a convent aside from visiting at retreats.  When I got there, my nerves were frazzled with the stress of caring for the children and working/living in a new environment away from family and friends so I was unable to eat which is quite common with social anxiety.  I kept thinking it would pass in a day or so, but each meal was the same - I'd take a few bites so I wasn't rude but I could not finish the meal.  Ultimately, much food went to waste which I was upset about but I chalked it up and hoped the Sisters would be lenient since I was new.  The 2nd day I was there, the Superior asked to talk to me in private and asked why I wasn't eating and if I had ever been diagnosed with an eating disorder.  I think 2 days was much too soon to be so critical of someone's eating habits.  I told her I was nervous and I was also taking a diet supplement that suppressed my appetite (I continued the Alli because I didn't think it would be a problem).  She was upset with me because I didn't ask for permission to use the supplement and told me that the Sisters are required to eat what is put in front of them because food is measured out since the Sisters work all day with no breaks for snacks so she didn't want anyone going hungry.  I apologized and promised to try to eat more.  However, the anxiety increased after that discussion because I felt like I was letting the Superior down and it was nervewracking.  The 3rd day, I asked to leave because I felt I was under tremendous pressure in many different ways.  The order was just not a good fit and I felt the Superior was demanding too much of me too soon - especially since I had not entered and was only there for a live-in.  To ask permission about a supplement when you are still a layperson seems absurd to me as I was just doing as my doctor had ordered me to.  In my defense, she had not explained the meals beforehand so I had no idea what was expected of me.  Very frustrating!  :(

Edited January 20, 2014 by MaterMisericordiae

[ChristinaTherese]

Christina, please don't think that I judge anyone who compliments me or other sisters. I know they mean it from a place of goodness even though it makes me personally uncomfortable. I just wanted to share from my perspective how it feels to have so much attention placed on looks as a young sister. I think it is especially difficult when you are in an active ministry and people make assumptions based on looks quite often that negate professional ability or capability of ministry. Sometimes it is more difficult to minister when you are viewed primarily by the physical aspects. Again, it depends on the situation and I just wanted to share how it sometimes makes me feel.

Oh, I totally understand your reasons. (And whether or not I have good reasons, I kind of hate being complimented on my appearance. It might depend though. But how does one respond to compliments anyway? No, I'm not grateful. I would sometimes like to take to saying "Praise God!" in reply.) I just wanted to state what I know I would be thinking, as another side of the coin. But I'm a strange girl who's never put much stock in physical appearances, so my comments probably don't apply to other, actually normal, people. (By the way, does that do anything like explaining myself, or is it just confusing?)

[Antigonos]

I'd like to make two points:

1) anyone who ingests more calories than they expend will put on weight, and vice versa, irrespective of the diet they are on. Simply aking a half portion of everything is often all that is needed. All foods are needed for healthy living, but usually not quite as much as we'd like to eat.

2) The problem of communities is obviously not universal. There's a phormer phatmasser who just took her temporary vows who is not the thinnest person I've ever seen, and she seems to be doing just fine! Keep thinking positively!

[Freedom]

Being fat is not just based on outside appearance, it is a health issue.  If her SD and the religious community says that she needs to lose some weight, then she probably does.  If she's obese because she's a glutton, that isn't good.  If she is big because she has a thyroid problem, that too isn't good.

 

I've seen fat Sisters in different religious communities, but they were professed.  Not sure how they could become overweight since they're supposed to fast...

[SilentJoy]

Update: Nothing I do can diminish the hurt my new friend felt when she was told she was too obese to enter either of the 2 orders she was seriously considering.

 

It must be so difficult to receive this kind of blow. If she is still open to considering either of these communities in the future, however, they might see weight loss as a good sign of a vocation, of obedience and determination.

 

I met a nun who belonged to a penitential Order; initially, her superiors were concerned about her weight and food intake because, to them, she seemed very small, and they wanted to be sure she didn't get any smaller. They were very cautious about allowing her to participate in the community fast. Although she didn't say so, I imagine this was very difficult too.

[emma8201986]

Thanks again for all the kind thoughts and helpful suggestions. I am taking this slow with Mary - I want her to succeed and feel better about herself. I will help her work on her weight with changing her eating and exercise habits but it has to be a two way street. If she truly has a vocation, she will want to get herself healthy enough so that she can pass a physical - we're not talking about just a few pound. I will keep you posted and will encourage Mary to post here as well.

Em

[SilentJoy]

I remember when I was living at a convent as a "live-in" experience which was supposed to last 6 weeks but only lasted 3 days.  ...  To ask permission about a supplement when you are still a layperson seems absurd to me as I was just doing as my doctor had ordered me to.  In my defense, she had not explained the meals beforehand so I had no idea what was expected of me.  Very frustrating!  :(

Scary! :shock: I'm sorry it was such a dreadful experience.

[OnlySunshine]

Scary! :shock: I'm sorry it was such a dreadful experience.

 

There were many other factors at play but they all culminated into the conclusion of my leaving and withdrawing my application for entrance.  I really don't think it was an appropriate environment for me and was not my vocation.  It was upsetting to leave because I felt like I let the community and my family down but if it wasn't healthy, then it wouldn't have lasted long anyway.

[Pia Jesu]

Yes, please tell Mary that we look forward to her joining the forum!  The National Religious Vocations Conference has posted the following desirable attributes in evaluating candidates for the religious life/priesthood:

 

--Membership in the Catholic Church

--Generally good health (sounds like there is a little "wiggle room" here!)

--Adequate intellectual ability (more "wiggle room"!)

--Healthy relationships, including good friends

--Sense of humor

--Ability to make a positive choice for celibacy

--Faith and a sense of integrity

--Relationship with God

--Responsiveness to others

--Leadership ability

--Collaborative worker

--Ability to live simply

--Ability to share a common life

--Ability to compromise for the common good!

 

God bless you for being such a good friend!

 

 

[SilentJoy]

There were many other factors at play but they all culminated into the conclusion of my leaving and withdrawing my application for entrance.  I really don't think it was an appropriate environment for me and was not my vocation.  It was upsetting to leave because I felt like I let the community and my family down but if it wasn't healthy, then it wouldn't have lasted long anyway.

I think you made the right decision (not that I know anything!) and it took courage to make such a change of plans.