NotreDame Posted January 13, 2014 Author Share Posted January 13, 2014 Actually LDS missionaries do pay their own way, although help is available from the ward (local LDS congregation) if they need it. When I was a member I think it was around $400 a month or so to serve, this was almost 10 years ago though so it might have changed. Most LDS families start saving money for their sons missions from the day they are born, much like most people save for college. It is a good experience for many young men and women, and while it is technically completely voluntary (as in, the church won't excommunicate you if you don't go) there is a lot of social pressure on young men to serve. If you are an LDS man and you don't serve a mission, good luck finding a Mormon wife. LDS girls are taught from a very early age that the number one thing to look for in a man is a returned missionary and current temple recommend holder. Everything else is secondary. Wow, I'm multi-tasking my NFL watching time to do some Mormon googling now... Looks like your $400 figure is still current: http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=505211 More here: http://www.equippingchristians.com/Mormon-Missionaries.php Seer stones? Seems like Joseph Smith could have been involved in some occult practices: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seer_stone_%28Latter_Day_Saints%29#Seer_Stones_and_the_Book_of_Mormon Next I want to google what the justification is not to drink alcohol/caffeine. Is that from the bible or just the book of mormon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ploomf Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) Wow, I'm multi-tasking my NFL watching time to do some Mormon googling now... Looks like your $400 figure is still current: http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=505211 More here: http://www.equippingchristians.com/Mormon-Missionaries.php Seer stones? Seems like Joseph Smith could have been involved in some occult practices: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seer_stone_%28Latter_Day_Saints%29#Seer_Stones_and_the_Book_of_Mormon Next I want to google what the justification is not to drink alcohol/caffeine. Is that from the bible or just the book of mormon? The dietary restrictions are from the Doctrine and Covenants, a book of Mormon scripture that contains revelations from God to Joseph Smith. The only things added to the D&C after he was murdered are the two manifestos banning polygamy and the lifting of the restrictions on black people holding the priesthood. They come from Section 89 of the Doctrine and Covenants, which is known as the Word of Wisdom. Mormons are allowed to drink caffeine, fyi. The Word of Wisdom says that hot drinks are not good for the body, this has been interpreted to mean that coffee and tea are banned, although hot chocolate and herbal tea is fine. Smoking and drinking are also banned. Some members believe coffee and tea are banned because of the caffeine, this was pretty hotly debated when I was a Mormon. :P But I think the first presidency recently came out and said that drinking caffeine is not against the Word of Wisdom. And yes, Joseph Smith was a very interesting character and was involved in many questionable practices. :P Edited January 13, 2014 by ploomf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basilisa Marie Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) The caffeine and alcohol thing is about not using drugs that alter your mind or harm your body. For them, caffeine is more or less in the same category as pot or tobacco. It's worrying about getting addicted to it, too. Edit: Huh, that's interesting. What I put above is what I was told by one of my local Mormon friends. Edited January 13, 2014 by Basilisa Marie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ploomf Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Yeah, it was really really hotly debated when I was LDS. I knew Mormons that wouldn't touch caffeine with a 10 foot pole and I knew some, that if they ever stopped drinking coke, I think the company would go out of business. Here's an article that talks about the church's stance. :) http://www.ktvb.com/news/health/Mormon-church-clarifies-stance-on-caffeine-168321336.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotreDame Posted January 13, 2014 Author Share Posted January 13, 2014 And yes, Joseph Smith was a very interesting character and was involved in many questionable practices. :P Wow, now I'm reading there were masonic influences as well? Did you know about this? Do they talk about this at all? https://www.google.com/search?q=masons+and+mormons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherie Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 That might be partly because you need a certain number of meetings before you're basically invited to be baptized. A good friend of mine found this out the hard way. She thought she was just talking, but apparently it was a little more official than she expected. That'd be my guess as to why you were being "monitored," haha. Yep, that's very likely. When the baptism question came up (as in, "So you think you want to be baptized?") we were like uh, whoa whoa whoa. It wasn't too many visits after that that we decided to end our discussions with them. But we made sure to get as many questions answered as possible (after all, best to get the info straight from the source, right?) and cleared up some really strange misconceptions they had about Catholicism. Lilllabettt that was a HUGE part of our discussions with the missionaries, faith and reason and the fact that you can't base your faith on feelings. That was a HUGE part of it. They couldn't really fathom that, but I really think it did get them thinking. I love our Mormon friends, though, and I think we can learn a lot from them. I've attended quite a few events at their ward and I've always been pleasantly surprised by just how great they've been. For example, I went to a "Emergency Preparedness" class with a friend and learned a lot. I'm not going to have a bunker with two years' worth of food stored, but I did learn some great couponing tips and other frugal advice. Their wards are FULL of lots of activities geared toward families, and they offer tons of events for moms and couples and offer free child care during that time so the parents can attend without worry or cost. They are SO, so family oriented in their church activities (obviously, it flows from their beliefs and theology), but I'd LOVE to see some Catholic parishes do some things similarly. They are so charity and service oriented, too. When we moved almost a year ago, it was the Mormons who came out to help us...we didn't even ask, they offered and came with like 20 people to help us move. I wish our Catholic parish would encourage that kind of service and fellowship! That's another topic entirely, though. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotreDame Posted January 13, 2014 Author Share Posted January 13, 2014 Lilllabettt that was a HUGE part of our discussions with the missionaries, faith and reason and the fact that you can't base your faith on feelings. That was a HUGE part of it. They couldn't really fathom that, but I really think it did get them thinking. Really? They are all about feelings? Can you talk about this a little more? It's really interesting - at least to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilllabettt Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 The below is representative of their approach to prayer, discernment, and epistemology -- all affective. http://mormon.org/beliefs/book-of-mormon How to Know the Book of Mormon Is True? God's method is simple: we read the Book of Mormon; we pray and ask Him to tell us that what we've read is true and He answers us through feelings of peace and assurance given by the Holy Ghost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilllabettt Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 *affective = emotional, mood based Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatherineM Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Lots of Mormons here. My husband and his Dad did a book on Alberta Mormon politicians. What always weirds me out is that I have more in common with Mormons and Muslims in how I live my life than I do with Methodists or Lutherans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheresaThoma Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I only had to deal with the JW once and it was when I was in RCIA. I just firmly told them that I was recieving adequate faith formation through my Church and I was not interested. I have also been approached by the God the Mother people. Those I did have a bit more in depth discussion with. We got into the Trinity (why God uses the plural) and Mary. They were two college aged kids and I kind of felt sorry for them (I have continued to work in RCIA and I'm a bit of a Catholic nerd). My approach is if I feel like I am into doing some apologetics and theological discussion I will do so. Otherwise I just politely but firmly tell them I am Catholic and intend to remain so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLordsSouljah Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) Hehe, one day my brother answered the door and saw it was JWs. He just stood there and smiled and nodded while they rambled on for about a minute, and politely said 'No thanks, not interested. byeeee!!' and shut the door. I have to say, some of them can be super nice and we both feel like praising God by the end of our conversations, (actually sorry no those were Baptists) but most of the time it's just a tad annoying. Just love them and do what Luigi said. :D Edited January 13, 2014 by TheLordsSouljah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Be honest about your relationship with Jesus and your understanding of holy scripture and sacred tradition and love them in all truth, without proselytising . But if you fear talking to them will endanger your salvation than perhaps your not called to share your faith with JW's or Mormons, yet, or perhaps you have a different mission that isn't to talk with JW's or Mormons in regards to matters of faith. :) I talk with Mormons but I'm kind of scared of JW's from a time i was talking with 2 of there missionaries and i flew off the handle kind of and disrespected one of them unfortunately, but now that you have bought it up i will pray this fear be removed that i may talk to them as beloved children of God with justice, mercy, goodwill and the hope of peace whether they know there children of God or not, as i should anyone outside of the holy roman catholic church. I hope that all helps brother. Just how i do my do not necessarily how you should do your do, but don't chuck the good apples out with the bad, any good i have revealed claim it for yourself and use it, you may have to remind me later if i forget. :) God bless you man. Onward christian souls Jesus is LORD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ploomf Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Wow, now I'm reading there were masonic influences as well? Did you know about this? Do they talk about this at all? https://www.google.com/search?q=masons+and+mormons Yes there are masonic influences, Joseph Smith and most of the early founders of Mormonism were masons. They were pretty matter of fact about it when I was in the church. Supposedly the temple endowment ceremony that most Mormons go through is very similar to masonic rituals. I never went through the temple and received my endowments so I really couldn't tell you any more about that, I have no idea what the endowment ceremony looks like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotreDame Posted January 14, 2014 Author Share Posted January 14, 2014 Lilllabettt that was a HUGE part of our discussions with the missionaries, faith and reason and the fact that you can't base your faith on feelings. That was a HUGE part of it. They couldn't really fathom that, but I really think it did get them thinking. The below is representative of their approach to prayer, discernment, and epistemology -- all affective. I was reading this thread I found via google and it had an extreme example of this affective prayer being used at a very wrong time: http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10792584&postcount=102 Then the Bishopric (the bishop is the head lay guy for the ward, which is the local church house and the bishopric consists of the bishop, his two assistants called counselors, and a secretary who records the proceedings for posterity.) get on their knees and pray to god to decide what to do with the sinner in question. They supposedly receive direct revelation from god about how to handle such cases. Apparently, god decided that I was also responsible for my rape, so god recommended to the bishopric that the excomm my stepbro and put me on probationary status. So here is my question... This was a case where reason could have easily been used to arrive at a conclusion. But they 'prayed' instead. Not only did they pray, they prayed to the exclusion of reason. Is this the normal "affective" prayer you've all been mentioning? If this is their approach If one is Mormon, how does one decide if they are going to make a decision using reason vs prayer? They can't pray over everything. Note in case it's not obvious: This isn't like most Christians, who would tend to use reason in combination with prayer, eg. use reason to arrive at conclusion, then pray about it to make sure they are being objective, or use prayer if it's a subjective choice whose answer is not immediately apparent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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