southern california guy Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Are you saying people with homosexual tendencies don't go to heaven? Do you mean people who act on those tendencies, or everyone with them regardless of the lives they lead? Yes I meant people who act on those tendencies. The story of Sodom and Gomorrah and its destruction in book of Genesis is pretty dramatic -- and even a bit disturbing. I hesitate to quote any of it here. I suppose that what bothers me is that the Catholic church says: "...the Church refuses to consider the person as a "heterosexual "or a "homosexual,".." Why can't they say instead: "Today the Church considers a person a "homosexual" if they commit the act sodomy with somebody of the same sex. The Catholic church does not condone or support this behavior which it views as destructive and an abomination. However the Catholic church considers all people creatures of god, and prays for the salvation of those leading a life contrary to the will of God." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southern california guy Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 I sort of wonder if Norseman and I are looking at this from a completely different perspective because we are from a different generation. We're both in our late forties and the Catholic church was quite a bit different thirty - forty years ago, it was in the midst of changes -- which are now established doctrines of the Catholic church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Yes I meant people who act on those tendencies. The story of Sodom and Gomorrah and its destruction in book of Genesis is pretty dramatic -- and even a bit disturbing. I hesitate to quote any of it here. I suppose that what bothers me is that the Catholic church says: "...the Church refuses to consider the person as a "heterosexual "or a "homosexual,".." Why can't they say instead: "Today the Church considers a person a "homosexual" if they commit the act sodomy with somebody of the same sex. The Catholic church does not condone or support this behavior which it views as destructive and an abomination. However the Catholic church considers all people creatures of god, and prays for the salvation of those leading a life contrary to the will of God." Because the Church doesn't label people. Labeling is harmful and destructive. You are not homosexual. You are not heterosexual. You are a human person who may have these tendencies or those tendencies, but that's not who you are or even what you are. Your sexuality doesn't define you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southern california guy Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 (edited) Because the Church doesn't label people. Labeling is harmful and destructive. You are not homosexual. You are not heterosexual. You are a human person who may have these tendencies or those tendencies, but that's not who you are or even what you are. Your sexuality doesn't define you. Yes, but we are talking about homosexuality in a vague sense. It seems like the Catholic church has found a creative way to dodge the issue. When asked about the Catholic churches moral position on homosexuality they act like you are talking about somebody specifically and they argue that they view all members with respect -- which was not the question. It's like asking a politician a question. Questioner: Does the Catholic church view the homosexual lifestyle as sinful? Catholic church: The Catholic church refuses to consider the person as a "heterosexual "or a "homosexual," and insists that every person has a fundamental identity: the creature of God, and by grace, His child and heir to eternal life. Or maybe I am paranoid and looking at this as if it came from a context that it didn't?? Edited December 23, 2013 by southern california guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Yes, but we are talking about homosexuality in a vague sense. It seems like the Catholic church has found a creative way to dodge the issue. When asked about the Catholic churches moral position on homosexuality they act like you are talking about somebody specifically and they argue that they view all members with respect -- which was not the question. It's like asking a politician a question. Questioner: Does the Catholic church view the homosexual lifestyle as sinful? Catholic church: The Catholic church refuses to consider the person as a "heterosexual "or a "homosexual," and insists that every person has a fundamental identity: the creature of God, and by grace, His child and heir to eternal life. The Church also explicitly states this: 2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved. 2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God's will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord's Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition. 2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southern california guy Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 The Church also explicitly states this: 2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved. 2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God's will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord's Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition. 2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection. Then that is not bad at all. In fact that is very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Then that is not bad at all. In fact that is very good. But the Church does refuse to label people at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotreDame Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clare Brigid Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Give me a break. You can't say the bigoted things he said without consequences. Sorry but it's called personal responsibility. For the record he also said things about black people that was just as disgusting. The whole persona is a made up crock. Before they were famous they were a bunch of white bread golfing WASPS. Not hillbillies. This is the truth. I've seen the before and after photos. And here they are: The brothers, "before." Willie and Korie, "before." Jep and Jessica, "before." Jase and Missy, "before." And after $$$: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southern california guy Posted December 24, 2013 Share Posted December 24, 2013 This is the truth. I've seen the before and after photos. And here they are: The brothers, "before." Willie and Korie, "before." Jep and Jessica, "before." Jase and Missy, "before." And after $$$: What happened? Did he get a Harley? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnneLine Posted December 24, 2013 Share Posted December 24, 2013 Fed 'em some beard grower.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
add Posted December 28, 2013 Author Share Posted December 28, 2013 (edited) Never mind Phil Robertson, the patriarch of A&E's Duck Dynasty clan who was suspended from his hit reality series on Dec. 18 following some incendiary comments about gay people, won't be put on hiatus after all The network and the Robertson family announced Friday that Phil will still be part of the series -- and since he didn't miss any filming, his temporary suspension will have no effect on the upcoming fifth season. Why am I not surprised? Edited December 28, 2013 by add Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrossCuT Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 Monies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
add Posted December 28, 2013 Author Share Posted December 28, 2013 (edited) It's all about the money I never heard of duck dynasty before fuzzy Phil made or stated his mean views ... I've noticed a lot of merchandise in the stores The merchants have to get rid of before they dump him The whole thing is a publicity stunt - me thinks Edited December 28, 2013 by add Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cappie Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 Being an adult means you can have your own opinion. Being mature means knowing when it is appropriate to express that opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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