4588686 Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Akward moment when the guy who is trying to prove the woman wrong dosn't read Persons with children is 3/5. last time I checked that's 60%. Single people with children is 25% women, 7% men, making for only 1/3 being single parents. I guess I missed the part where 60% of 'x' stopped constituting most of 'x.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4588686 Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Im not even going to answer this. It has been addressed so many times in the thread however I understand that giving people a "humane wage" automatically makes members in this thread think (for some reason...) that I mean EQUAL across the board. Thats not it at all. Start reading what Im saying. The Federal minimum wage is $7.25/hr and hasnt been changed for 6 years. It should be increased to help keep up with inflation. I would be fine abolishing the minimum wage if we were to institute Universal Basic Income Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappo Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Im not even going to answer this. It has been addressed so many times in the thread however I understand that giving people a "humane wage" automatically makes members in this thread think (for some reason...) that I mean EQUAL across the board. Thats not it at all. Start reading what Im saying. The Federal minimum wage is $7.25/hr and hasnt been changed for 6 years. It should be increased to help keep up with inflation. 7.25 increased by 3% each year for 6 years comes to $8.65. 40 hour weeks for 52 weeks would mean that is a $2912 increase in wages before deductions. Assuming the people making minimum wage pay no income tax and only social security and medicare, that would drop to about $2702 total extra income or $225 a month. Just FYI for the numbers. My guess would be you wouldn't think $8.65 is high enough either though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) 7.25 increased by 3% each year for 6 years comes to $8.65. 40 hour weeks for 52 weeks would mean that is a $2912 increase in wages before deductions. Assuming the people making minimum wage pay no income tax and only social security and medicare, that would drop to about $2702 total extra income or $225 a month. Just FYI for the numbers. My guess would be you wouldn't think $8.65 is high enough either though. I think your goverments charity to those in actual poverty, the social security benefits is what is not high enough perhaps. What you do to the least of these you also do to me and all that jazz. And crosscut i hear there a plenty of hectic clothing stores, food stores and miscellaneous that are cheap as chips in the u.s for those on minimum wages. Edited November 23, 2013 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Normile Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Guys you seem to miss the point here, minimum wage is what has been decided upon by the state, not Wal-Mart or any other employer. Its not going to get better anytime soon either as more and more employers are cutting hours that everyone works to avoid the unfair healthcare mandate, but I bet that will raise the ire of the more liberal types and those who believe in handouts. The UAW has recently lambasted the unconstitutional healthcare mandate stating that it will be the demise of the 40 hour work week. I know of several local employers who have went out of business due to this law too. Another thing, what could these minimum wage workers afford without that underpaid job? The handicapped get checks from the government SSA in addition to their minimum wage jobs, while others take these jobs to supplement their income from other sources. If a business like Wal-Mart were forced to pay a higher wage for their product would you be willing to pay the extra monies as that would be added to the cost of each item, or are you one that feels the company should just eat their losses? Minimun wage allows employers to hire the underskilled for jobs that they can do while supplying them not only with monies, also with the pride of being able to earn a wage. Give a man a fish..... ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Normile Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Im not even going to answer this. It has been addressed so many times in the thread however I understand that giving people a "humane wage" automatically makes members in this thread think (for some reason...) that I mean EQUAL across the board. Thats not it at all. Start reading what Im saying. The Federal minimum wage is $7.25/hr and hasnt been changed for 6 years. It should be increased to help keep up with inflation. Actually the minimum wage was last updated in 2009, 4 years ago. Since then there has not been enough economic advances to justify raising it. ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Normile Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 The level of derp in this thread has risen to a level that is melting my brains. I have to step out. :sos: Speaking of derp, where do you get off making that rascist remark to try and belittle someone with a differing viewpoint from you? Wow! ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) Guys you seem to miss the point here, minimum wage is what has been decided upon by the state, not Wal-Mart or any other employer. Its not going to get better anytime soon either as more and more employers are cutting hours that everyone works to avoid the unfair healthcare mandate, but I bet that will raise the ire of the more liberal types and those who believe in handouts. The UAW has recently lambasted the unconstitutional healthcare mandate stating that it will be the demise of the 40 hour work week. I know of several local employers who have went out of business due to this law too. Another thing, what could these minimum wage workers afford without that underpaid job? The handicapped get checks from the government SSA in addition to their minimum wage jobs, while others take these jobs to supplement their income from other sources. If a business like Wal-Mart were forced to pay a higher wage for their product would you be willing to pay the extra monies as that would be added to the cost of each item, or are you one that feels the company should just eat their losses? Minimun wage allows employers to hire the underskilled for jobs that they can do while supplying them not only with monies, also with the pride of being able to earn a wage. Give a man a fish..... ed I liked everything except the pride bit and calling people whom need need social security benefits as being handouts. Do you think it is easy being unemployed ed with hardly any money and plenty of time, i'm on social security benefits and it is boring as hell, but perhaps your one of the types fr pontifex warns about that says to the homeless man " Go and get a Job you lazy bum, that's the deal.", if you do your seriously mistaken, what do you think there doing sipping on pinacalades on malibu beach with George Armani flip flops eating at restaurants? Edited November 23, 2013 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) Sorry that was a bit callous but hopefully you get my point ed. Not everybody has the capacity to work for varying reasons, that's what i think anyway. Edited November 23, 2013 by Tab'le De'Bah-Rye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Normile Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Table, ok I understand this is a subject that can raise emotions. I did not write that people on SSA are receiving handouts, I said those that believe in handouts using it as an inflammatory remark, shame on me, to include those who game the system for either SSA or those who abuse the SNAP program to get the free debit cards for food. I feel that anyone who has an actual disability should be taken care of by the confiscated state monies, the freely donated monies given to charities religious or secular and those who can freely give of their time and or talents to help. This falls under loving your neighbor as yourself. I understand having hardly any money and plenty of time, especially right now. Being self employed is wonderful when the weather or the economy allows for it, right now I have been in a two month slump due mainly to weather and its tearing me apart emotionally and spiritually as well. I am having a hard time meeting my obligations. That is tough for someone who is used to taking care of his family as well as on his family too, its also hard on your sense of self worth. ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrossCuT Posted November 23, 2013 Author Share Posted November 23, 2013 where do you get off making that rascist remark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabriela Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) Is the only way up for these people for the government to increase the minimum wage? Is it impossible that WE, as citizens and consumers, would place pressure on companies to pay a living wage? Edited November 23, 2013 by curiousing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotreDame Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 The minimum wage law is actually a pretty simple subject to tackle if you understand how to draw and analyze a supply and demand curve, but you don't need that to understand what Friedman is saying: http://www.aei-ideas.org/2013/02/milton-friedman-responds-to-president-obamas-proposal-to-raise-the-minimum-wage-the-most-anti-black-law-in-the-land/ And for those that think that people have a right to a minimum income (which is really what they are saying when they talk about a living wage), you might be surprised that Friedman also supported this idea (forseeing the "IQ economy" or the "end of fordism" as Curiousing called it) via the negative income tax, which he introduced in the US: http://www.adamsmith.org/blog/welfare-pensions/milton-friedman-on-the-negative-income-tax Funny enough, Megan McArdle tackled just this subject recently in Bloomberg: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-11-15/they-ll-pay-you-to-live-in-switzerland-.html As for why, if you are going to implement some sort of minimum income, it should be done via direct payments (private or public) instead of via gov't regulation on business, there are many reasons, but they are really just fundamental arguments and I'm not sure if this is the place to list them. Guys and gals... Why is a living wage a good idea? What problem does it solve? What are it's externalities? Is increasing the cost of hiring an employee actually good for poor people, who likely lack marketable skills or they wouldn't otherwise be "poor people"? What about mother's re-entering the workforce that just want extra money? What about teens getting their first jobs? Are more costs/regulations going to help them? I understand the desire to help people and at first a "living wage" might seem like a good idea at first, but do economics and experience agree? What has historically been the best solution to bring people out of poverty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4588686 Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Guys and gals... Why is a living wage a good idea? What problem does it solve? What are it's externalities? [/quote] It helps solve the problem of poor people not having enough money I understand the desire to help people and at first a "living wage" might seem like a good idea at first, but do economics and experience agree? What has historically been the best solution to bring people out of poverty? A market economy buttressed by Keynesian spending programs and a strong social safety net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotreDame Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 A market economy buttressed by Keynesian spending programs and a strong social safety net. Right... Which have resulted in this: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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