If There Is A Vatican 3 .

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

Pax domini bretheren...

 

If there is a vatican 3 what would you like to see come out of it? Like would it be beneficial for the whole church and the world to allow the hail mary to be said after the prayers of the faithful, maybe not compulsory but like the peace be with you optional, as well for the angelus ommited at the start of holy mass? My thought is should we at least have optional maryology( official stuff though decided by the vatican.) allowed in the holy mass of the novus ordo.

 

Onward christian souls.

Jesus is LORD.

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

I would like to see an admission of marian stuff into the holy mass of the novus ordo and a return of including in prayer for our orthodox brothers and sisters in the liturgy if it's not already still there and i have missed it some how, someone told me the orthodox christians have mary included more in there mass. But if not i'm still gunna be a holy roman catholic anyway, i still love the holy mother. :)

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

viva la vaticano. I'm alone but i have the holy trinity,the holy mother, the angels and the saints with me.

[Anastasia13]

I would like to see an admission of marian stuff into the holy mass of the novus ordo and a return of including in prayer for our orthodox brothers and sisters in the liturgy if it's not already still there and i have missed it some how, someone told me the orthodox christians have mary included more in there mass. But if not i'm still gunna be a holy roman catholic anyway, i still love the holy mother. :)

 

Coptic more than Armenian and Syriac. Don't recall Greek well enough.

[An Historian]

If a Vatican III was called tomorrow—or any ecumenical council... Trent II maybe?—then ideally I would hope for the following.

 

 

1) Clarifications and explanations on the documents of the Second Vatican Council in accordance with Pope Emereitus Benedict's hermeneutic of continuity.

2) Condemnations of modern errors including restating the oath against modernism for all clergy both regular and secular.

3) Pro-choice public figures, those that support homosexual "marriage" and civil unions are to be excommunicated by their local ordinary.  By name.

4) The suppression of [b]all[/b] religious orders and their members from public ministry pending visitations from Rome.
5) The abolition of national bishop conferences until such a time as the natural rights of a bishop in his own diocese are safe-guarded.

6) [b]The immediate abolition of the hierarchies in America, Canada (excluding Quebec), England and Wales, Scotland and Ireland, with the nations being declared mission territories and governed by a vicar apostolic.[/b]

7) The establishment of a new Pontifical Institute for developing reverent chant systems compatible with the vernacular languages though Latin Gregorian Chant will still maintain pride of place (as an extension of this Father Faber's hymns will be greatly encouraged).

8) The current Pauline Missal to be suppressed in favour of the 65' Missal.  All Eucharistic Prayers will be suppressed except for the Roman Canon which will be maintained in the original Latin and will be said silently by the celebrant.

9) The suppression of the ministry of the Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion and also the suppression of lay readers, etc.
10) The suppression of communion on the tongue, the suppression of receiving communion whilst standing unless medically necessary, the suppression of girl altar servers and the reinstatement of the traditional Eucharistic Fast from Midnight as well as the reinstatement of Meatless Fridays.

11) All of the days of Lent are to be observed as Fast Days barring medical necessity and age allowances.  Friday's remain meatless.

12) The Rogation and Ember Days are to be observed again.

13) [b]The establishment of the Personal Ordinariate of Saint Gregory the Great that maintains the 1962 Roman Liturgical Life with the minor modification of the pre-62 Matins readings being reinstated.  At the moment of its conception any Latin Rite Catholic may elect to join it and they would fall under the authority of the Personal Ordinariate.  Religious communities may also elect to join the Ordinariate and they will use their respective pre-Conciliar liturgies (Dominican Rite, Carmelite Rite, etc.).[/b]

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

cool, i don't understand everything you just said an historian but i do respect what you have said, but i disagree with the suppression of receiving on the tounge and i don't think we should have to return to the old missal though the latin rites have the authority to be on the old time as they already do,which shouldn't cause division,what is once made holy can not be made unholy, and i definately agree with a push for lenten fasts and friday fasts but i also agree with the new understanding of fasting not just being food wise. That's all i have lol, but hopefully if there is ever another vatican council i will humbly submit to the primacy of the pope and the magesterium of the holy roman catholic church, whatever they decide with the guidance of the holy spirit. :)

 

P.s. I think i also agree with number 3 too, i think the hammer possibly isn't used enough anymore but i also think someone should be able to be re communicated at any time if the authorities that can do such a thing with enough evidence to do so. And i have heard that some saints where excommunicated for a period of time then re instated, perhaps that is different though, but also i hear there was a big debate over something similar 100's of years ago or perhaps more recently over those christians who left the church during times of persecution being allowed back into communion or not being allowed back in. Anyhow these are all just my thoughts and i'm no church theologian,nore am i in any place of authority within the holy roman catholic church.

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

<edit>  Perhaps i would also like to see a push for catholic christians only marrying other catholic christians again, but if a catholic christian marries a non catholic christian they are not to be ostresised or looked down upon by other members of the holy roman catholic church, that a catholic christian marrying another catholic christian to be highly advised and a common practice but no begrudging if it happens the other way around for someone for whatever reasons. And you don't have to be catholic to be married by a catholic priest, so i guess that proves that the other way does happen and holy mother church understands.

[An Historian]

cool, i don't understand everything you just said an historian but i do respect what you have said, but i disagree with the suppression of receiving on the tounge and i don't think we should have to return to the old missal though the latin rites have the authority to be on the old time as they already do,which shouldn't cause division,what is once made holy can not be made unholy, and i definately agree with a push for lenten fasts and friday fasts but i also agree with the new understanding of fasting not just being food wise. That's all i have lol, but hopefully if there is ever another vatican council i will humbly submit to the primacy of the pope and the magesterium of the holy roman catholic church, whatever they decide with the guidance of the holy spirit. :)

 

P.s. I think i also agree with number 3 too, i think the hammer possibly isn't used enough anymore but i also think someone should be able to be re communicated at any time if the authorities that can do such a thing with enough evidence to do so. And i have heard that some saints where excommunicated for a period of time then re instated, perhaps that is different though, but also i hear there was a big debate over something similar 100's of years ago or perhaps more recently over those christians who left the church during times of persecution being allowed back into communion or not being allowed back in. Anyhow these are all just my thoughts and i'm no church theologian,nore am i in any place of authority within the holy roman catholic church.

 

My apologies, I meant the suppression of communion in the hand, people only being permitted to communicate with the mouth.  This would drastically reduce irreverence towards the Blessed Sacrament as well and decreasing the risk of the Blessed Sacrament's desecration.  The '65 Missal was the missal promulgated after the Second Vatican Council was was basically the traditional Latin Mass in the vernacular.  The Latin Canon wouldn't be a problem for the faithful as it would rightfully be said silently, or more accurately, whispered.

 

Of course the principle of fasting does not only concern food, but that is primarily what fasting is about.  Besides which, so many people have lost the idea of exactly how the economy of grace, merit and satisfaction works.  By following a Church-ordered fast you not only gain merit and grace by the actual sacrifice but also from your obedience towards the Church.  Besides which the reality is that concupiscence does not allow for most people to truly practise penitential lives.  People need to have something solid before them.

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

I agree with the more solids. I am a sheep and i need to be able to follow my shepherds or i will get lost.

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

I must disagree with one pint though, i think we should have extra ordinary ministers taking the most holy eucharist to the sick, elderly and dying.

[An Historian]

I must disagree with one pint though, i think we should have extra ordinary ministers taking the most holy eucharist to the sick, elderly and dying.

 

We have priests and deacons for this. Sure I'll grant that there may be exceptional circumstances where it may be necessary but EMHCs are a crutch now.  If a job needs done, send the priest or the deacon.  Or we can reinstate the sub-deaconate as well!  Actually, that would my #14.  The restoration of the minor orders.

[ToJesusMyHeart]

I like your ideas, AH.