For Discerners Of Traditional Latin Mass Communities ...

[Lilllabettt]

http://chiesa.espresso.repubblica.it/articolo/1350567?eng=y

 

I generally trust Sandro Magister for balanced reporting.

 

From this article it seems there are/were some serious  internal divisions within the Franciscans of the Immaculate, and the Holy Father has decided that :

 

" every religious of the congregation of the Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate is required to celebrate the liturgy according to the ordinary rite and that, if the occasion should arise, the use of the extraordinary form (Vetus Ordo) must be explicitly authorized by the competent authorities, for every religious and/or community that makes the request.”

 

 

the first part of the sentence would seem to apply to the FFI communities specifically, but I'm not really sure about the last part --- what does "every religious/and or community" mean (every religious and community generally or only every religious and community of the FFIs)  and who are the "competent authorities" (bishop, a superior general? I am leaning towards the latter, since for some time now the extraordinary form has not been subject to request of bishops, whereas friars observe the vow of obedience)

 

Always be careful with new communities, friends. Growing pains are the rule, not the exception.

[reminiscere]

Respectfully, the FI got Pontifical Right approval loooong before Benedict was elected and Summorum Pontificum published. So I don't know if I would classify this as part of growing pains. It seems, sadly, that this was the result of an extreme minority in the FI doing what they knew would result in getting what they wanted. 

 

It's very, very sad. I was at a High Mass offered yesterday by the FI and in less than an hour I'll be going to Rosary and Benediction with the FI. 

 

Many, many prayers for them. 

Edited July 29, 2013 by reminiscere

[Lilllabettt]

well, I'll leave it to others with regards to wrong or right, good/bad etc.

But as far as growing pains ... they were only founded in 1970. They grew very fast and got pontifical status in a very speedy way.

There was a growing move towards the extraordinary form recently in this institute, maybe as a response to the liberty granted by Benedict XVI where that is concerned. And apparently there was some consternation over that movement, enough to require an apostolic visitation and ongoing Vatican supervision. It would seem they are still working out some dimensions of their identity.

So I would still consider them "new."

[inperpetuity]

The FI were founded when Pope John Paul II called Fr. Manelli to Rome and told him to found.  It has nothing whatsoever to do with how old they are.  This is about the OF versus the EF.... period.  It's nothing new.

[reminiscere]

The FI were founded when Paul VI was still pope.

 

But you're right about that, inperpetuity. 

 

The FI were founded when Pope John Paul II called Fr. Manelli to Rome and told him to found.  It has nothing whatsoever to do with how old they are.  This is about the OF versus the EF.... period.  It's nothing new.

 

[MarysLittleFlower]

hmm... do you think that the last part of the quote is only referring to this community, not to all religious communities? Because I would be interested in looking into communities with the Latin Mass...

[Lilllabettt]

I believe it refers to the Franciscans of the Immaculate only.  From what I can tell it is part of a reorganization program; the Vatican is intervening directly in the affairs of these religious in order to maintain discipline.  Supposedly differences between members over the ordinary vs. extraordinary form were a source (only source? primary  source?) of division and this decree is meant to stabilize that.  It's division significant enough for the Vatican to take over the leadership.

 

I don't think it is applicable to other institutes/communities/congregations. The Institute has gone through some significant changes and some members were obviously nonplussed with the direction.  Many newer groups with living/recently deceased founders go through these things. Institute of the Incarnate Word,  Community of St John, the Poor Clares in Hanceville, etc. have had similar sorts of hiccups.

[Chiquitunga]

http://absoluteprimacyofchrist.org/pope-francis-franciscans-of-the-immaculate-vetus-ordo/

[dymphnamaria]

http://maryvictrix.com/2013/07/29/the-fis-and-pope-francis/

[Benedictus]

I had an interest in the Franciscans of the Immaculate, and thought about whether I was called to them.  I have lots of admiration for their ' A day with Mary' ministry in England. 

It seems, from what I've read of those inside the institute and outside, is that the media and bloggers have blown the situation up with some exaggeration and this has led to some misunderstanding by those not directly involved in the life of the institute. 

It seems a good decision to calm some conflict, or local zeal and misunderstanding, by affirming the ordinary form as the standard rite. Maybe it'll allow some space for the ordinary rite to be celebrated even better, be it in Latin or not. The religious of the institute can still ask permission from their superiors to offer the extraordinary form, but can't act with the same freedom as a secular Priest. As they have different duties and responsibilities this doesn't seem particularly unfair, at least in the interim.

Edited July 30, 2013 by Benedictus

[God's Beloved]

http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en/the-vatican/detail/articolo/vaticano-vatican-vaticano-26865/

[Benedictus]

The article reads: 'The decree states that Pope Francis has ordered the friars “to celebrate the liturgy according to the ordinary rite.” This means they will have to celebrate mass in the local languages.' 

The latter isn't true, but maybe popular belief. There's nothing stopping any religious or priest holding the ordinary form in Latin. It's a separate issue that's been missed here. 

[ForeverLillian]

Now, does this mean they will no longer be using the EF unless on rare occasions do you think? Or at least be allowed to say it at least once a week or a couple of days? 

 

Not sure if this is known yet. I was thinking of discerning with them too for this reason & now it's gone :/

 

Of course, it could depend on the location and the community on how traditional the OF.

 

 

Edited August 1, 2013 by ForeverLillian

[dymphnamaria]

Official Statement of Our Founder, Fr. Stefano M. Manelli

(English Translation) 

With reference to the Decree of the Congregation for Institutes of Consecrated Life and Societies of Apostolic Life of July 11, 2013 (Prot. N. 52741/2012), Fr. Stefano M. Manelli, with the entire Institute of the Franciscans of the Immaculate united with him, obeys the Holy Father and trusts that with this obedience there may come even greater graces.

 

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Franciscan-Friars-of-the-Immaculate/100733584481?hc_location=timeline

[Julie de Sales]

Now, does this mean they will no longer be using the EF unless on rare occasions do you think? Or at least be allowed to say it at least once a week or a couple of days? 

 

Not sure if this is known yet. I was thinking of discerning with them too for this reason & now it's gone :/

 

Of course, it could depend on the location and the community on how traditional the OF.

 

From what I understand, they will be able to celebrate the EF of the Mass if they receive an approbation from their Bishops and other Ecclesiastical Authorities. I personally would still think about them regarding a religious vocation, despite this event.