Enclosed Male Communities

[Anselm]

I know that there aren't many male discerners on here, but I would be very grateful for anyone's opinions. I have been drawn to the Benedictine life for several years and now know two different communities very well. I feel that I could be called to either of them but, as they are from different congregations, they live very different lives. One runs a boarding school and several parishes and lives in a rather grand Abbey with a huge church. The other is a much more traditional Benedictine house, much more enclosed. They keep bees and pigs and bind books.

 

I am currently a teacher and so that provides an attraction to the former, but I can't help feeling that such a life is a little too, well, public and worldly at times for me to really live the Benedictine life. I really don't know!

 

Any thoughts?

[Sister Marie]

Anselm, I know you were looking for a male perspective, which I definitely don't have, but I am a religious who is also a teacher.  You are absolutely right that life in the apostolate, especially the apostolate of education, is more public and worldly (for lack of a better word!).  I think its wonderful though that you are really listening and discerning both the talents you have been given (as a teacher) and the desire you have for a more monastic way of life.  

 

In any religious life where there is an exterior or professional work done by the community, an individual religious will feel the tension that exists in balancing prayer, community, and the apostolate.  That tension is very life-giving for someone who is called to it - it is a conduit for grace and growth in holiness.  For someone who is not called to live that way it is more of a stumbling block.  The same is true the opposite way.  

 

I think you also need to be really practical in thinking about what your lifestyle currently entails as a teacher and think about whether you are willing to bring that with you to religious life.  Teaching is a really difficult job and there is a constant noisiness about it (not necessarily sound but the busy-ness, the constant need to adapt and change, constant assessments, working within an educational system, evaluations of your work...etc.) and if you feel called to a more contemplative form of life this may not be something you want to bring with you.

 

I would suggest you try to visualize yourself in both of these places... think about what a day might be like for you and listen to the feelings that surface as you do so.  Do you have a spiritual director?  Bringing the fruits of a prayer like this to his or her eyes might really help you discern this further.

 

If you want to talk more about being a religious and a teacher at the same time... I'd be happy to discuss it.  Prayers!

[Anselm]

Sister Marie - thank you so much, I don't think I could have asked for more of an 'expert opinion'!

 

I do have a spiritual director but unfortunately he has moved to Rome. I really do love my teaching (and it seems to go very well) but when I visit the monastery with the school I often can't quite reconcile the two in my mind - thoughts of my own school and the busy life it requires makes me almost physically tense up as I think about my to do list, even though I love doing it.

 

When I visit either monastery the part of the day I enjoy most and always look forward to is the offices in choir, which again makes me a little nervous about a house with a school as the monks who teach often have to miss some of them. That is the house I have known for the longest and I am very enthusiastic when I am there but then when I leave this tension surfaces again.

 

If I'm honest I also sometimes think that the more 'open' house might seem more attractive at times because it would probably be easier for me to explain joining that one to my atheist family than the more enclosed continental-style monastery, and I know that that's a terrible reason to go anywhere!

[Sponsa-Christi]

Like Sr. Marie said, the question of which monastery to enter is a very personal one. You have to prayerfully discern for yourself which direction God is actually leading you.

 

But to take the question of “can one live a truly Benedictine way of life in a monastery with a teaching apostolate?” in a more abstract, objective way:

 

I think that a more enclosed lifestyle might be a closer approximation of St. Benedict’s original vision in founding his Order, since he originally was a hermit seeking a supportive structure for his retired, wholly contemplative way of life.

 

But at the same time, I think a Benedictine monastery with a teaching apostolate could also be a praiseworthy reflection of the Benedictine spiritual patrimony and charism as it’s been legitimately expressed throughout the centuries. The Benedictine Order did a lot to preserve and advance the culture of the western world after the collapse of the Roman Empire, an apostolate which was largely accomplished through teaching. (I believe that our Holy Father Emeritus chose the name “Benedict” in honor of the contributions which St. Benedict’s Order made to the Church and to human society in general through the intellectual life of the Order.) To me, anyway, it would seem very natural for some Benedictine houses to continue the important work of education in the hope of ameliorating the new “dark ages” into which our modern western culture seems to be heading.

Edited July 15, 2013 by Sponsa-Christi

[Anselm]

Thank you Sponsa-Christi. You're right; the English Benedictine's kept Catholic education in this country alive for almost 300 years by educating Catholic boys at their monasteries in exile in Flanders, which is why they still run schools today.

[Luigi]

Anselm - 

 

There's an English Benedictine monastery & school near me. I'm friendly with one of the monks and I sometimes go to evening Mass and vespers at the monastery. I don't know the life from the inside, but from what I've been able to observe.... 

 

The monks are (WARNING: Lame Pun coming) very orderly in their prayer schedule, in their teaching schedules, in their prep/grading time - in everything. I do occasionally see a monk slip into church late, so I guess things aren't perfectly balanced, but most of them seem to manage the competing demands well. I'm sure you would, too. (In fact, I wonder if they teach a full schedule of classes or if they have a reduced teaching load so they can be free for church.). 

 

One really disruptive event I"m aware of is the annual Pull Out All The Stops Big Fund Raiser. I guess all private schools have something similar. But it's just once a year. 

 

I've thought about whether I could live that life - I'm not in a position to join a religious order at the moment, but given the opportunity... And I've decided that I could teach; I'd love the regular prayer; I'd love the stable community (the other monks, but also the boys who come back to get married there, who send their own sons to the school, etc.). But this school is extremely expensive/elite, and I would NOT like to teach rich boys. Now, someone needs to teach them and inculcate Catholic values in them - (I often wonder whether rich people don't face more temptations than poor people). So these boys need sturdy theological teaching and training. But I wouldn't be good at that. If you are suited to doing that - if you could relate to them, if they could relate to you, if you can prepare them to retain their faith in this wide wicked world they're preparing to enter, to practice humility & charity, to support the church - then spending your time with pigs would be something of a disservice to the boys who need you.

 

And from what I've seen or overheard from the monks, they bring the tensions of school life into church with them, pray about them during the liturgies, and find peace in that. Tensions come, but tensions also go. 

 

I don't know you, and I'm not passing judgment on either choice you might make. But to me, the question would be: Do you want to be a man of faith and prayer, or do you want to be a man of faith and prayer who also forms boys into men of faith and prayer? With the follow-on question being whether you have the ability to form boys into men of faith and prayer. 

 

I have assigned your case to some saint-friends of mine. Rest assured of their prayers and mine. 

[Anselm]

Hi Luigi, thank  you for your response. I think I meant more that it feels like teaching would intrude into the religious life for me in a mental rather than physical or chronological way, as if switching from 'teacher persona' to 'monk persona' several times a day would be a very hard thing to do, for me at least. I am rather an excitable, enthusiastic and noisy teacher and when I visit monasteries that disappears completely and I become a lot more serene and prayerful. I can't quite see how I could fit both of those approaches into the same day.

 

If I did join the more enclosed house then the school at the other would still have good teachers; I don't think I would be depriving them. Also, the Novice Master at the former has sounded rather enthusiastic about my academic background, as well as my practical skills as an amateur cook, gardener and car mechanic.

 

I really am very grateful for your prayers.

 

Anselm

[Luigi]

AH! That makes a great deal of sense - the part about swtiching gears several times a day. I've never seen the local monks teach, but some of them don't seem like they'd be all that energetic in the classroom.

 

 

[CorJesu]

Have you heard of Conception Abbey in Missouri, USA? I know a couple people there and it is a great community...not sure if you would be interested, but I'll post the link here in case you want to see their website!

 

http://www.conceptionabbey.org/

 

Prayers,

 

CorJesu

[Anselm]

Thank you, but I'm in England!

[Gabriela]

I know that there aren't many male discerners on here, but I would be very grateful for anyone's opinions. I have been drawn to the Benedictine life for several years and now know two different communities very well. I feel that I could be called to either of them but, as they are from different congregations, they live very different lives. One runs a boarding school and several parishes and lives in a rather grand Abbey with a huge church. The other is a much more traditional Benedictine house, much more enclosed. They keep bees and pigs and bind books.

 

I am currently a teacher and so that provides an attraction to the former, but I can't help feeling that such a life is a little too, well, public and worldly at times for me to really live the Benedictine life. I really don't know!

 

Any thoughts?

 

I am a teacher who is discerning religious life and I feel exactly the same way. I love teaching, and it keeps "creeping back in" to my discernment, and yet, I really don't see (for myself) religious life as compatible with teaching. It is precisely the "worldliness" of it that makes me uncomfortable with the idea.

 

Anselm, I know you were looking for a male perspective, which I definitely don't have, but I am a religious who is also a teacher.  You are absolutely right that life in the apostolate, especially the apostolate of education, is more public and worldly (for lack of a better word!).  I think its wonderful though that you are really listening and discerning both the talents you have been given (as a teacher) and the desire you have for a more monastic way of life.  

 

In any religious life where there is an exterior or professional work done by the community, an individual religious will feel the tension that exists in balancing prayer, community, and the apostolate.  That tension is very life-giving for someone who is called to it - it is a conduit for grace and growth in holiness.  For someone who is not called to live that way it is more of a stumbling block.  The same is true the opposite way.  

 

I think you also need to be really practical in thinking about what your lifestyle currently entails as a teacher and think about whether you are willing to bring that with you to religious life.  Teaching is a really difficult job and there is a constant noisiness about it (not necessarily sound but the busy-ness, the constant need to adapt and change, constant assessments, working within an educational system, evaluations of your work...etc.) and if you feel called to a more contemplative form of life this may not be something you want to bring with you.

 

I would suggest you try to visualize yourself in both of these places... think about what a day might be like for you and listen to the feelings that surface as you do so.  Do you have a spiritual director?  Bringing the fruits of a prayer like this to his or her eyes might really help you discern this further.

 

If you want to talk more about being a religious and a teacher at the same time... I'd be happy to discuss it.  Prayers!

 

Thank you (AGAIN!), Sr. Marie. This post really helped me, too. Your posts are always so helpful! :-D

 

 

Sister Marie - thank you so much, I don't think I could have asked for more of an 'expert opinion'!

 

I do have a spiritual director but unfortunately he has moved to Rome. I really do love my teaching (and it seems to go very well) but when I visit the monastery with the school I often can't quite reconcile the two in my mind - thoughts of my own school and the busy life it requires makes me almost physically tense up as I think about my to do list, even though I love doing it.

 

When I visit either monastery the part of the day I enjoy most and always look forward to is the offices in choir, which again makes me a little nervous about a house with a school as the monks who teach often have to miss some of them. That is the house I have known for the longest and I am very enthusiastic when I am there but then when I leave this tension surfaces again.

 

If I'm honest I also sometimes think that the more 'open' house might seem more attractive at times because it would probably be easier for me to explain joining that one to my atheist family than the more enclosed continental-style monastery, and I know that that's a terrible reason to go anywhere!

 

I feel exactly the same.

 

Hi Luigi, thank  you for your response. I think I meant more that it feels like teaching would intrude into the religious life for me in a mental rather than physical or chronological way, as if switching from 'teacher persona' to 'monk persona' several times a day would be a very hard thing to do, for me at least. I am rather an excitable, enthusiastic and noisy teacher and when I visit monasteries that disappears completely and I become a lot more serene and prayerful. I can't quite see how I could fit both of those approaches into the same day.

 

If I did join the more enclosed house then the school at the other would still have good teachers; I don't think I would be depriving them. Also, the Novice Master at the former has sounded rather enthusiastic about my academic background, as well as my practical skills as an amateur cook, gardener and car mechanic.

 

I really am very grateful for your prayers.

 

Anselm

 

And here, too, I feel exactly the same. One of the personal character traits that makes me think I'm called to contemplative life is this inability to "switch back and forth" between various tasks. I mean, I can, but it takes a long time to get one task out of my mind and body and another long time to really get into the other task. When I'm expected to switch quickly, I feel like I'm "spinning out", like I'm frazzled and torn in a hundred directions. I do not do multiple things well. But if I am allowed to do one thing—and ONLY one thing—I can get into it, go extremely deep, and do it exceptionally well. I bear a great deal more fruit doing only one thing than I do doing multiple things.

 

That being said, I do recognize (and you should, too) that even contemplatives switch back and forth between multiple tasks all day long. They also work, and rather harriedly at times, I've seen. Still, to me, the contact with other people while working, that aspect of having to allow others to draw you out of yourself just for the sake of social interaction—that is what makes all the difference to me. I can't extrovert and introvert on demand. I am an introvert, and interacting with others—though often very fulfilling, like in the classroom—is draining for me. I feel that I am much more centered in God when I am alone, or at least, when I don't have to be constantly "going out of myself" to interact with others. I feel I reach my real spiritual potential when I can at least remain in one "state of mind" all the time, even if I am doing different tasks, rather than having to switch out constantly because the various tasks demand various "states of mind".

 

I will say one thing that has sometimes consoled me: There are opportunities to teach even in contemplative life. Some people become Vocations Director/-ress, Novice Master/-ress, or some people just write (on spiritual subjects, obviously) in contemplative life. So it may be that this personality trait of yours (and mine) is a clear sign of a call to contemplation, and that in that life, our gift for teaching will be transformed to another purpose.

 

Hopefully. :-)

Edited July 16, 2013 by curiousing

[Anselm]

What a coincidence that we both feel the same way! I have spoken to the Novice Masters at both houses and the one at the more contemplative house did say that, in time, there's no reason why I should not teach within the house or the congregation. On top of that I do find it very attractive for a monastery to be as self-sufficient as possible, so eating pork from their own pigs and eating their own vegetables is infinitely preferable t eating meals cooked by the school kitchens and sent up to the monks' refectory. I know that that may sound a little like I am concentrating on the superficials of monastic life, but as the Rule says, "Truly are they monks, if they live by the work of their hands, as did our Fathers and the Apostles." (RB Ch 48)

[salveregina10]

Here's another word from a female...  I am very familiar with three men's communities that are both healthy and serious about prayer.  One is our brother monks in Schuyler, Nebraska. 

Missionary Benedictines - Christ the King Priory

http://www.missionmonks.org/

The second is Conception Abbey in Missouri

http://www.conceptionabbey.org/

The third are the Discalced Carmelite Friars of the Washington DC province:

The link to their vocation page is - http://www.ocdfriarsvocation.org/

I would say that the friars are the most contemplative, but the other two dedicate much of their passion and time to the Divine Office, lectio divina, and spiritual reading.  I can tell you their faithfulness inspired my own monastic vocation and I am happy to answer any questions you have about them.  Blessings on your journey!

[Anselm]

Thank you! I did once consider the Carmelite Friars and spent a weekend with them. They were wonderfully hospitable but I do feel that my vocation would be better lived out in one place with a vow of stability. The two Benedictine houses that I know well are very different - one is of the English Congregation and the other is Solesmes. Very different ways of life!

[Benedictus]

I know that there aren't many male discerners on here, but I would be very grateful for anyone's opinions. I have been drawn to the Benedictine life for several years and now know two different communities very well. I feel that I could be called to either of them but, as they are from different congregations, they live very different lives. One runs a boarding school and several parishes and lives in a rather grand Abbey with a huge church. The other is a much more traditional Benedictine house, much more enclosed. They keep bees and pigs and bind books.

 

I am currently a teacher and so that provides an attraction to the former, but I can't help feeling that such a life is a little too, well, public and worldly at times for me to really live the Benedictine life. I really don't know!

 

Any thoughts?

Anselm,
I've been browsing the site and saw your post. I've had similar questions regarding the Benedictines, in my case whether to go with a monastery in the English Benedictine Congregation (EBC), also has a boarding school and parish, or one in the Subiaco Congregation which is more continental in its style. (My discernment is also complicated in that I also feel a draw to the Franciscans)

I think it's worth bearing in mind that even though a monastery runs a boarding school and parishes it doesn't necessarily mean you'd be called to do these things, even as someone who has teacher experience. It's fairly likely that an Abbot would discuss any assignment with you, and the wider community, rather than simply mandating it. But it is possible that at some point the task could be given, so I guess it's worth thinking about how it would make you feel. 

Many of the boarding schools have set times for teaching and, usually, these don't clash with monastic offices as a rule. The schools tend to be in close proximity so this is less of a burden also. But it's possible you'd have to, on occasion, say the office privately if it's missed. I think that this is sometimes unavoidable, even in communities that are more enclosed i.e if caring for other sick monks, you need to travel or guests suddenly arrive. 

Maybe consider looking at other EBC communities as they may orientate things slightly differently, even though they do similar ministries. This is what I tended to notice anyway -  there were definitely a couple of EBC communities that I felt no draw towards at all.