Anastasia13 Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 (edited) If nothing else, PM ME. Tell ME what's really going on and we can talk about how rad it is to be human and LOVED by God. If any of us did that, would you really listen? I don't think everyone here would listen to me. Edited June 22, 2013 by Light and Truth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FutureCarmeliteClaire Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 The 'cliqueiness' on PM is a problem too. I'd really like to post something without feeling like I'm taking a side in a civil war. For my money, though, PM is still the best internet forum I've been a part of. I really like corresponding with a moral, intelligent people, and the vast majority of posters on here seem to be both, at least to me. Exactly. 100 times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrossCuT Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 (edited) I am glad to see that you two are trying to be willing to be willing to be willing. Im always willing. Im ready to be willing to be willing to be willing with anyone who wants to be willing with me. Edited June 22, 2013 by CrossCuT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleWaySoul Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 Thank you for posting this, franciscanheart. Unfortunately I'm outta props :/ However, there is something I'd like to say. Going to Franciscan University, I've had a friend who's asked the exact same question as you: "Why aren't we more genuine? Why do we all pretend to be so holy and righteous? Why can't everyone just be real?" And I understand the questions. Franciscan and Phatmass are both large communities of Catholics, and sometimes I think that can feel... stuffy. Everyone else seems so darn holy, and it feels like no one can admit their faults, weaknesses, or just let their saint-facade down for five seconds. But, while I think there are people who put up these fronts, I think there are also genuinely holy people. Sometimes, it's easy to see people being holy and assume that they're doing it because everyone else is watching. And sometimes that is true. But, I think, there are people who would be that way regardless of who they were around, and that's not a bad thing. I'm not saying that you don't believe these people exist. I'm saying that perhaps what my come across as self-righteousness or a fake holiness may actually be totally genuine. We cannot know the content of another's heart, after all. :) As for me, as I'm sure you all know, I'm FAR from holy, but I will say this: I don't feel like I've ever put up a mask here on Phatmass. Everything I say is genuine, and while I may not tell everyone all the details of my life (that'd be obnoxious), I don't feel like I'm hiding anything from anyone. Does that make sense? I'm not sure if ANY of this makes sense, but I feel like it needed to be said. Again, I'm not disagreeing with you, franciscanheart, I'm sort of just adding a caveat of sorts. ;) God bless you and keep you all! :love: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anastasia13 Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 (edited) What I'm saying is what I said: that I'm not perfect and I miss when phatmass didn't have to be either. I'm not trying to criticize phatmass or her members so much as start a discussion about how we can exist here authentically. How we can have discussions and show support rather than jump to conclusions and judge. To maybe encourage someone else to think about how to be guided by their faith in responses but not necessarily have to be the Truth hammer for a poster who's doing his or her best in faith and in life. See it how you will; everyone does and will. But the things you have already assumed about me? Those are the things that make this an unfriendly and often hostile place. It's fine to tell the ugly truth, but sometimes it is best to do it with gentleness. I don't think many people here realized how much caring anything about what you (PMers) think would have hurt me in the "Why am I not a phatmasser" thread. That was a real question where I was disregarded, given an answer that didn't address the question (like something that was the case when I was wouldn't be enough), or answered sarcastically. I don't want to be open with people like that because if I open up to them, I might get hurt more than helped-I don't feel safe talking honestly and openly with people like that. I wanted understanding when I started it, and most of what I got was distress. (Maybe at a different time/set of circumstances in life, that might not have been so bad, but that doesn't mean it would have been good at all.) That's why it took so long to stop being more emotionally invested in it. I was just beginning to figure out all of this church stuff for real and not just some abstract or Protestantized idea, and I made the mistake of trusting this webcommunity more than I should have just cause it's a legit Catholic website. A little more compassion and sense of being respected would have gone a long way. Wise discretion really does require a very short answer, not a glimpse inside me or my thoughts-you get the truth, but not always the whole truth. I am thankful to those who listened to, and while they may not see perfectly eye to eye on everything, took time to explain things to me, treated me like they saw me for me and not an "in or out" short answer, discussed maybe not always why that then but at least the nature of the church and things about faith when I wanted to talk about it, didn't make fun of me, responded to me when I said something to them... They are the kind of Catholics I would want to go to church with. Those are the kinds of real discussions that change how people see things and help people grow, and helps convert those in need of converting. Authenticity doesn't seem like it is worth much to me if people (self included) don't listen (to each other). I think not listening (dismissing or acting on assumptions) teaches people not to be authentic. Edited June 22, 2013 by Light and Truth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anastasia13 Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 (edited) I may not tell everyone all the details of my life (that'd be obnoxious) If I'm ever obnoxious like that, please tell me. If I have done that too much, I apologize. Edited June 22, 2013 by Light and Truth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleWaySoul Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 It's fine to tell the ugly truth, but sometimes it is best to do it with gentleness. YES. THIS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleWaySoul Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 If I'm ever obnoxious like that, please tell me. If I have done that too much, I apologize. You haven't ever been that I've seen. Don't worry about it! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel's angel Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 So basically, what you seem to be saying is that if you feel like[mod] EDITED~~~LANGUAGE~~~RC [/mod] say whatever happens to come into your mind at that time, and if the person on the receiving end doesn't like it, then it's their fault because you're just 'being real'. OK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ardillacid Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franciscanheart Posted June 22, 2013 Author Share Posted June 22, 2013 If any of us did that, would you really listen? I don't think everyone here would listen to me. Try me. Thank you for posting this, franciscanheart. Unfortunately I'm outta props :/ However, there is something I'd like to say. Going to Franciscan University, I've had a friend who's asked the exact same question as you: "Why aren't we more genuine? Why do we all pretend to be so holy and righteous? Why can't everyone just be real?" And I understand the questions. Franciscan and Phatmass are both large communities of Catholics, and sometimes I think that can feel... stuffy. Everyone else seems so darn holy, and it feels like no one can admit their faults, weaknesses, or just let their saint-facade down for five seconds. But, while I think there are people who put up these fronts, I think there are also genuinely holy people. Sometimes, it's easy to see people being holy and assume that they're doing it because everyone else is watching. And sometimes that is true. But, I think, there are people who would be that way regardless of who they were around, and that's not a bad thing. I'm not saying that you don't believe these people exist. I'm saying that perhaps what my come across as self-righteousness or a fake holiness may actually be totally genuine. We cannot know the content of another's heart, after all. :) As for me, as I'm sure you all know, I'm FAR from holy, but I will say this: I don't feel like I've ever put up a mask here on Phatmass. Everything I say is genuine, and while I may not tell everyone all the details of my life (that'd be obnoxious), I don't feel like I'm hiding anything from anyone. Does that make sense? I'm not sure if ANY of this makes sense, but I feel like it needed to be said. Again, I'm not disagreeing with you, franciscanheart, I'm sort of just adding a caveat of sorts. ;) God bless you and keep you all! :love: Absolutely! Don't disagree with any of that. :) The difference in my mind is not so much those who are holy and those who are not. I don't believe "holiness" is what I'm getting at. Even still, holy people make mistakes. They goof up, slip, have fears and doubts. They are still human. And when we can see humanity alongside holiness (or striving for it), that's when, I believe, we are living our best. I believe authenticity is important not just for the sake of fellow Catholics, but for the WHOLE WORLD. My non-Catholic friends know my struggles and doubts, but they also know where I go with them and why. They know I am imperfect but that I have, deep in my heart, an important and meaningful understanding of God and His love for me. They know that when I am struggling, I do not abandon faith, but lean into it -- though it is often physically invisible. I embrace my humanity and find comfort in spirituality. And they know this because I find peace even in turmoil. I don't have to be perfectly resigned. I still get angry and sad and frustrated. But those things don't consume me. Though I will never be a Saint, I do hope to be a saint. I have never claimed perfection and I pray I never will. But I do claim to be faithful in spite of myself. I'm not saying that's holiness, but I do want to emphasize the value and worth of those who may live differently but whose hearts are as open to God as they can be in those moments. We were all blest with different hearts and minds, and we will always see differently and do differently because of it. When we can see each other as true equals in spite of this, that is when we will find real love living among us -- because it will be Love Himself who is directing our lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franciscanheart Posted June 22, 2013 Author Share Posted June 22, 2013 So basically, what you seem to be saying is that if you feel like being [mod] edited..language...rc [/mod]decide to say whatever happens to come into your mind at that time, and if the person on the receiving end doesn't like it, then it's their fault because you're just 'being real'. OK.:blink: Um, no. Not at all, actually. But this along with several other posts in this thread have revealed for me something I never could have illustrated on my own. The hostility in this community is alarming. I've been guilty of the same, and for that I apologize. But no, that wasn't my point at all. Interesting how our opinions of others prevent us from hearing what's really being said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel's angel Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 Thanks for providing an example :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfink Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 (edited) :blink: Um, no. Not at all, actually. But this along with several other posts in this thread have revealed for me something I never could have illustrated on my own. The hostility in this community is alarming. I've been guilty of the same, and for that I apologize. But no, that wasn't my point at all. Interesting how our opinions of others prevent us from hearing what's really being said. Being articulate can greatly lessen the chances of being misheard. :like: Also, I don't think the hostility is built into this community, but is the result of many recent upsets, and possibly other factors. Edited June 22, 2013 by arfink Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franciscanheart Posted June 22, 2013 Author Share Posted June 22, 2013 Being articulate can greatly lessen the chances of being misheard. :like: :huh: :blink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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