"child Free" People (maybe A Bit Of A Rant)

[IcePrincessKRS]

note: i didn't say anything about how single people tell married people how they should feel. merely how they should act. :| also, i would generally assume that most married people had been single at some point in their lives, and would know how it feels to be single. most single people (excepting divorced single people) don't really know how marriage works and how different it is to be married than to be single. 

 

:like:

[jmjtina]

people freak when I tell them I come from a family of 8. And my youngest brother is in high school.

 

Yeah.

 

It's totally wierd. You should have more kids so they can have heart attacks and just bypass the whole conversation. But it seems as if one kid will do the trick.

 

Children are a blessing. People think I'm crazy for being a teacher and wanting to be around little kids all day.  :pinch: 

 

Don't forget to offer it up photo. That's some good redemptive suffering for you & your family right there. :pope2:

[jmjtina]

Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but I dont think it is at all selfish to delay having children to fulfill one's personal or professional goals. Furthermore, at my medical school, there are an equal number of my peers who are married with children and who are single, and I dont see any significant social stratification among them, aside from the obvious (happy hour does not involve the Wiggles, sadly). While children are a blessing, the decision of whether and when to have them is personal.

 

Agreed. Within certain limits.

 

Delaying children by use of birth control, etc. to further personal & professional goal = morally unacceptable

 

CCC 2399 The regulation of births represents one of the aspects of responsible fatherhood and motherhood. Legitimate intentions on the part of the spouses do not justify recourse to morally unacceptable means (for example, direct sterilization or contraception).

 

Delaying children by delaying marriage to further personal & professional goal = morally acceptable (I know many people who waited until after college to get married, & lived chastely)

 

just had to clarify. :bible:

[Maggyie]

These people sound super defensive. You said "they assume I'm judging them for not having kids" this indicates they are probably getting judged for it somewhere else. Not by you, but SOMEone is nagging at them. Parent? Grandparent? "helpful" sibling?

 

I am in a support group for 20 somethings who have had their fertility cut short. We are being taught to refer to ourselves as childfree and not childless. The -less suffix focuses attention on the giant gaping hole in your life/heart/soul. The -free suffix is supposed to point up all the possibilities. And it's true when you don't have kids you have a lot more room in your life for other things. But all the other things seem stupid right? Art? Travel? Who cares?

 

Be glad that you have a Catholic bubble where people resemble you and you have something in common. I used to have a Catholic bubble, but now it's 50% people who assume I'm contracepting and going to hell and 50% people who pity me. So it's no longer fun.

 

It's annoying the moms in your Mom Group are all 5 years older than you but hopefully you realize in the scheme of things it's not that big of a deal. I think as you get older the age difference will mean less and less. Especially if you keep having kids, eventually you will be the same age as all those first time moms in their mid 30s - you'll just be on kid 3 when they are on kid 1. Then you you can have the Wise Lady Who Knows Stuff role and they will all be clamoring to be your friend and soak up your expertise.

[AnneLine]

Some of you don't (or can't... being under age...) visit the Raising Small Humans thread, but for those of us who do, we know this is a very sore and very real problem for a lot of us. 

 

I'm in my 50's, and I have gotten over most of the pain of not being able to have children (and yes, it is PAIN we're talking about).  And of having my fertility be gone in my 30's long before anyone would have suspected.   Maggie and Lillliabettt, I can't imagine what it would have been like to have gotten that diagnosis in my 20's... but I have known others who have had it, and it is just a searing thing.

 

I remember all the really insensitive comments about why AREN'T you having any children from family, parish, secular order sisters & brethren, etc.  And all the well-intentioned comments about AVF and adoptions.   I'm pretty sure everyone figured we were on artificial contraception -- we weren't -- or that Mr AnneLine and I really wanted to not have kids. NOT.  Oh, God! NOT.  Can't tell you how hard it is to go to ALL the baptisms, first communions, graduations (kindergarden, elementary, high, college, etc.).  Or hang with everyone telling about all the wonderous things their little ones are doing.  And the photo christmas cards... and all therest.  Yes, I rejoice for them, but it still is hard....

 

Before I was married, I did a lot of Girl Scout leading and CCD teaching - and planned to be a teacher.  But I just couldn't do it after I couldn't have kids.  Just hurt too much.

 

Now I am at the point where I can be around a baby or small child.... but it took YEARS.  Even though I knew it was what it was... and that it was in the Providence of God... but it was so hard... so hard.

 

And I have seen people who probably had a few more children than they should have had, because they just can't handle the ones they got emotionally... or physically.  And sometimes, even one was too many.   And you just wonder, why did they get the little one and not me....   And I've seen marriages ripped up over this.   Again, I'm not judging, just snapping photos here....

 

BUT.... HAVING SAID ALL THAT.... sometimes I am just grateful that people who feel the way the people who were featured in that original post feel... just don't have kids.   That some of the selfish people I encounter in the big wide world are NOT reproducing.  

 

And I am glad that we have the freedom to just move away from the ones that push our buttons.  Temporarily, or permanently, and that it is MY choice.

 

Mr AnneLine told me about a dream he had shortly after we were told I wasn't going to have children.  He said that God told him that He had other things for him to do.   Has proven to be correct.   And that's probably about as true an answer as I can come up with to this problem.

 

But I think as we discuss this, we need to remember to love each other and listen to each other and feel the hurt that all these articles, people, and all the said and unsaid comments mask.... and just pray for each other.  And realize what courage it takes for some people to open this thread, much less to read and/or comment on it.   

 

I am praying for each and every one of you....

Edited June 4, 2013 by AnneLine

[photosynthesis]

Welcome back, Photo!

 

This whole thing is actually really alien to my experience.  I'm living in Texas, where it seems that most folks have at least a kid or two, and tend to start having them in their teens or twenties.  People seem to love my little daughter wherever she goes.  (When I lived in rural-ish Virginia, and often among a colony of hard-core Caths, the situation was similar.)

 

I can see getting flack over having a lot of kids, but people giving you poo over simply having a child seems really, really weird.  (It seems here, that if someone actually was opposed to whole idea of having children, they'd generally at least have the common decency to shut up about it.)

 

I suppose it's different cultures.  You live in the Pacific Northwest, right?

 

In many places, and in any time before recent decades, people would be more likely to think a woman a freak for not having kids at age 29.

 

 

Those hypocritical idiots who attack anyone who has a kid for "bringing another consumer into the world" should just altruistically shoot themselves in the head and do us all a favor.

 

I'm in New Jersey, so people here have blue state values.  Some people in my area start having kids when they're in their mid twenties but the vast majority wait until over 35.  At the last Mothers & More meeting they were all talking about their IVF treatments and having to have "selective terminations."    :unsure:  Sometimes I wonder what planet I'm on!

 

You make texas sound amazing, though!  Also no property taxes, right?  

 

These people sound super defensive. You said "they assume I'm judging them for not having kids" this indicates they are probably getting judged for it somewhere else. Not by you, but SOMEone is nagging at them. Parent? Grandparent? "helpful" sibling?

 

I am in a support group for 20 somethings who have had their fertility cut short. We are being taught to refer to ourselves as childfree and not childless. The -less suffix focuses attention on the giant gaping hole in your life/heart/soul. The -free suffix is supposed to point up all the possibilities. And it's true when you don't have kids you have a lot more room in your life for other things. But all the other things seem stupid right? Art? Travel? Who cares?

 

Be glad that you have a Catholic bubble where people resemble you and you have something in common. I used to have a Catholic bubble, but now it's 50% people who assume I'm contracepting and going to hell and 50% people who pity me. So it's no longer fun.

 

It's annoying the moms in your Mom Group are all 5 years older than you but hopefully you realize in the scheme of things it's not that big of a deal. I think as you get older the age difference will mean less and less. Especially if you keep having kids, eventually you will be the same age as all those first time moms in their mid 30s - you'll just be on kid 3 when they are on kid 1. Then you you can have the Wise Lady Who Knows Stuff role and they will all be clamoring to be your friend and soak up your expertise.

 

I'm sorry to hear of your fertility issues.  That is such a tough cross to carry.  I also can empathize with the attitudes from outsiders about not having children, as my daughter is 4 and I've gotten some judgmental comments from other Catholics about not having had another child yet.  And I know what you mean about feeling like people are assuming that you're using contraception.  They don't know the whole story.  People need to mind their own business and worry about their own souls sometimes.

 

I think choosing to dwell on the positives in your situation can be a good thing, so I can understand why they would encourage you to focus on what you have instead of what you lack.  But "childfree" carries a certain meaning because there are many Childfree groups that bash people who have children, calling them "breeders."  One of my best friends from childhood became "childfree" in her late teens and had her tubes tied at 19 years old.  Her husband is also childfree and they always complain whenever they see parents with kids out in public, especially if the kids are having a tantrum.  Once I got pregnant, she wanted nothing to do with me.  Some friends.

[Amppax]

What a guy. :)

Stern? I miss him.

[cmaD2006]

I do need to say that it goes in both directions ... yes, single (childless) people can be thoughtless in what they do, but so can married people towards those who are single/don't have kids.

 

Today I had a situation where a coworker started to say that I have more time ... well, I made a choice to serve the Church in my singleness, and that needs to be respected as well.  Besides -- when I get sick, I have no one around to either pick up meds, or make me dinner, or even get me a glass a water or a bucket to get sick in.

 

At least my cat will come cuddle next to me when she notices that I'm cold!

 

We make our choices, and we need to respect it.  Married life is wonderful, and kids are a precious gift from God.  Those who are single may be single by choice or by default ... and that can be a gift to God too.

[Lil Red]

in conclusion, everyone should treat everyone else as person created in the image and likeness of God, regardless of their state in life. :| this is such a shock to me! :| 

[AnneLine]

Jeeeeeeezzze... Red, you're holding us to an awful high standard.

 

You mean.... we gotta keep our BAPTISMAL VOWS?   :eek:

[Lil Red]

Jeeeeeeezzze... Red, you're holding us to an awful high standard.

 

You mean.... we gotta keep our BAPTISMAL VOWS?   :eek:

 

weird, right? :unsure: 

[AnneLine]

YUS.

[Ice_nine]

in conclusion, everyone should treat everyone else as person created in the image and likeness of God, regardless of their state in life. :| this is such a shock to me! :|

 

Some people are really annoying tho. Do they count?

[Lil Red]

Some people are really annoying tho. Do they count?

 

unfortunately, even the annoying ones count :|