Attn: Catholic Scouts And Former Scouts

[GeorgiiMichael]

http://www.scouting.org/sitecore/content/MembershipStandards/Resolution/results.aspx

 

"For 103 years, the Boy Scouts of America has been a part of the fabric of this nation, with a focus on working together to deliver the nation's foremost youth program of character development and values-based leadership training.

"Based on growing input from within the Scouting family, the BSA leadership chose to conduct an additional review of the organization's long-standing membership policy and its impact on Scouting's mission. This review created an outpouring of feedback from the Scouting family and the American public, from both those who agree with the current policy and those who support a change.

"Today, following this review, the most comprehensive listening exercise in Scouting's history the approximate 1,400 voting members of the Boy Scouts of America's National Council approved a resolution to remove the restriction denying membership to youth on the basis of sexual orientation alone. The resolution also reinforces that Scouting is a youth program, and any sexual conduct, whether heterosexual or homosexual, by youth of Scouting age is contrary to the virtues of Scouting. A change to the current membership policy for adult leaders was not under consideration; thus, the policy for adults remains in place. The BSA thanks all the national voting members who participated in this process and vote.

"This policy change is effective Jan. 1, 2014, allowing the Boy Scouts of America the transition time needed to communicate and implement this policy to its approximately 116,000 Scouting units.

"The Boy Scouts of America will not sacrifice its mission, or the youth served by the movement, by allowing the organization to be consumed by a single, divisive, and unresolved societal issue. As the National Executive Committee just completed a lengthy review process, there are no plans for further review on this matter.

"While people have different opinions about this policy, we can all agree that kids are better off when they are in Scouting. Going forward, our Scouting family will continue to focus on reaching and serving youth in order to help them grow into good, strong citizens. America's youth need Scouting, and by focusing on the goals that unite us, we can continue to accomplish incredible things for young people and the communities we serve."

 

As the title indicates, I'd prefer that only those who are Catholic and have experience in the Scouting movement (or those who share the Church's beliefs on homosexual activity) respond to this thread.

 

My reaction:

 

I'm initially pleased. It has bothered me to no end that boys are denied the rank of Eagle for no reason other than being honest about their sexual attractions. If a boy puts the work in, he deserves the rank. That's it.

 

But it's also made me a bit uneasy. Like the LGBTQ lobby as said, this is only a first step. And I can't see it being anything other than that. 

 

I'm fine with not even addressing sexual ethics other than a flat out "no sex, at all, or you're out" policy. The Scouting movement isn't about sexual ethics. Talking about sexual ethics has no place in the Scouting program. But I can't imagine the LGBTQ lobby not pushing further. And what then?

 

I gained a lot from the Scouting program. I'm an Eagle Scout, and I'm proud of that accomplishment. I want to enroll any future children I may have in Scouts. I hope to start a Scouting unit at my parish for older youth to enjoy, with the faith being at the center of our activities. How can I run a unit that espouses the Catholic faith, if in the future practicing homosexual adults are allowed to be leaders, and one of them requests to join? Having a leader openly and unabashedly living in sin is no way to run a Catholic unit.

 

Obviously, the way things stand now, that's not an issue, but I can see it becoming an issue quite quickly. 

 

I'm nervous for the future, and not sure what to do. I'd hate to abandon Scouting, because it's been such a good in the world, but if it implicitly condones sin, I'll have to.

 

This is rambly and probably doesn't make much sense. I'm sorry.

[Ice_nine]

I know this isn't really a helpful comment but, a lot of times I remember kids in the scouts being called "gay" in a pejorative way . . . for being a scout.

 

 

 

 

 

If you don't want your children to join any orgs that implicitly condone sin, then plan on living in a bubble. Concerning sexual ethics most non-Catholic, and even some progressive "Catholic" orgs, are not in line with Church teaching. Most people are "openly and unabashedly living in sin." It's that the idea that sin is just a quaint remnant of older times that's the real problem imo, but churchy folk have more anxiety concerning sexual sins and sexual scandal (and usually homosexual sins more so, if Jose is living with Alajandro and they both seem a little "weak in the wrists" people would make their assumptions and freak out. However, if a couple is engaged and living together, it's often overlooked. Well they are getting married so at lest they won't be fornicating for long).

 

 

I'm just rambling too and I'm gonna stop myself because I'm devolving quickly into chaos.

Edited May 24, 2013 by Ice_nine

[Roamin Catholic]

As the title indicates, I'd prefer that only those who are Catholic and have experience in the Scouting movement (or those who share the Church's beliefs on homosexual activity) respond to this thread.

Good luck with that...I don't see why other people can't comment.Whatevs

My reaction:
 
I'm initially pleased. It has bothered me to no end that boys are denied the rank of Eagle for no reason other than being honest about their sexual attractions. If a boy puts the work in, he deserves the rank. That's it.

Sexual attractions shouldn't matter when it comes to the kids. Attraction is different than actions.

Rewarding a child for putting in hard work is all this should be about. Sadly, too many of the "parents" are making this more about them than the kids

But it's also made me a bit uneasy. Like the LGBTQ lobby as said, this is only a first step. And I can't see it being anything other than that.

People will always push for more.

I gained a lot from the Scouting program. I'm an Eagle Scout, and I'm proud of that accomplishment. I want to enroll any future children I may have in Scouts. I hope to start a Scouting unit at my parish for older youth to enjoy, with the faith being at the center of our activities. How can I run a unit that espouses the Catholic faith, if in the future practicing homosexual adults are allowed to be leaders, and one of them requests to join? Having a leader openly and unabashedly living in sin is no way to run a Catholic unit.

 
If homosexual leaders are allowed in BSA in the future, I hope that BSA has the foresight to allow religious sponsored troops to opt out of that portion of the policy if they have a religious objection.

I'm nervous for the future, and not sure what to do. I'd hate to abandon Scouting, because it's been such a good in the world, but if it implicitly condones sin, I'll have to.

Why worry about something that isn't happening yet? Perhaps you should use that worry as motivation to lobby the leaders to not give in further? Or focus on the current pro-life battles that are happening?

[Nihil Obstat]

What does it mean, to implicitly condone sin? What do you think of when you say that?

[Basilisa Marie]

I don't have personal experience in any scouting groups, but I know about a dozen Eagle Scouts, and it's obvious the pride and hard work that goes into the project, and into being scout.  I like your idea of the "no sex, at all" rule for non-leaders (or non-married, or whatever) - that way they're still enforcing the values that are at stake without unjustly excluding anyone.  Plus everyone, gay or straight, is held to the same standard. 

[jazzytakara]

Although I was never in Scouts, I was a member of Girl Guides in Canada which is similar. I don't think any organization should exclude anyone for reasons such as race,culture, religion, orientation, heritage, etc. Everyone deserves equal treatment. I know that some are worried that its condoning sin, but from my perspective sexual orientation does not stop anyone from being a good person or leader capable of guiding children. This isn't a part of a 'LGBTQ Lobby', this is about individuals fighting for the right to participate in an organization that they love without prejudice. For instance take a look at George Takei, he has a lot of passion for the Scouts and it had a huge impact on his life, so it was disheartening for him to be excluded by them. This choice is more about equal treatment than an agenda, I am unsure of any of my Girl Guide Leaders' orientations and it didn't matter to me as a child; they were fun people and I learnt a lot of great things. Like the phrase 'love the sinner, hate the sin', allowing LGBTQ individuals in Scouts and other organizations is a matter of treating people respectfully and not discriminating an entire group of people. The Church doesn't ban people from mass, so why should an organization ban people from participating?

[CatherineM]

I'm the mom of an Eagle Scout 2003. It would not bother me to have my son in a troop with another scout who was openly gay. Scoutmaster, another issue. Also an issue for counsellor spots at summer camp.

[BG45]

Ignoring the fast brewing theological debate...

 

My first reaction to hearing about the decision was, "Wait, this wasn't already allowed?"  The first person I met who self identified as gay, was in scouting and no action was ever taken to remove him from the troop.  He was just D., he was gay, but it wasn't his entire identity.

[Brother Adam]

Orientation is a lot different than behavior and that is something that was not addressed at the national meeting. Unfortunately we cannot assume that scouts will not now be pressured into accepting homosexual behavior as moral and normal. I have no problem with someone who struggles with SSA being in a troop. I don't see why it would even be brought up in scouting anymore than someone who struggled with pornography and masturbation. Simply being tempted with that sin should not exclude anyone from scouting.

 

However, that is not what is going on here.

[Winchester]

I don't think an organization that puts grown men in short pants with shirts tucked into them, while wearing neckerchiefs and patches has any room to throw stones.

[Basilisa Marie]

So my former parish priest wrote a thing objecting to the Scouts, and it's starting to get some traction.  I'm reading it now.  What do you guys think? 

http://www.starofthesea.net/index.php/our-parish/blog/626-fr-lappes-response-to-new-boy-scouts

 

Edited May 29, 2013 by Basilisa Marie

[Basilisa Marie]

Personally I think his reasoning is really...faulty and outdated...when it comes to the origins of homosexuality.  It's offensive and bigoted at worst (thought he does recognize that), and at best I have to wonder if he actually knows any gay people personally.  The list of "causes" for homosexuality from the CMA has a multitude of problematic implications, and doesn't reflect recent studies.   

BUT.  I do think he's doing a great job with how he's applying his position to his parish, and in that sense is acting from a place of charity, even if his position on the issue itself might not exactly be.  

[CatholicCid]

The thing I have always found interesting with the Scouts is that they are dedicated to making morally sound individuals and generally have no qualms saying so. In this decision, as Brother Adam mentioned, there does not seem to be a distinction between orientation and behavior. At the same time, it makes one wonder how such a topic would come up concerning a Scout. 

 

The point of scouting is to form individuals. In this regard, all individuals should be welcomed as members so that they might be formed. But, this also means that they must be accepting of that formation. If they are not open to that formation, I am not sure why they would want to be a scout in the first place. 

[4588686]

At the same time, it makes one wonder how such a topic would come up concerning a Scout. 

 

 

 

Clearly, you were never a scout.  Because the ONLY flooping thing that scouts talk about is sex.  You have a bunch of hyper horny 13,14,15,16,17 year old boys all together in the woods.  Honestly, what else do you think they would spend ALL of their time talking about?  Knots?  Sailing?  Floopy that.  They talk about sex, girls, new curse words, sex, sex, sex, sexual jokes, sex, masturbation, sex.  

[CatholicsAreKewl]

An organization that is partially funded by taxpayers' money has no right to tell some of those taxpayers (gays and atheists) that they can't join that organization. Boy scouts + gov support of them = immoral.

Edited May 30, 2013 by CatholicsAreKewl