Scrupulosity...

[MarysLittleFlower]

If a person has scrupulosity (only about sin, not general OCD about other things too), struggles with intrusive thoughts, etc, would that mean that no convent would accept them? let's assume for this case that the person doesn't have other things like depression, bipolar, etc.

 

thank you!

Edited May 18, 2013 by MarysLittleFlower

[Lilllabettt]

a serious case of scrupulosity does not mean a person will be forever rejected from every convent. An ongoing struggle with that is a warning flag for many congregations.

[inperpetuity]

Generally speaking I've always heard the advice given to people I've known who have struggled with it by their confessors/sd's that it should be dealt with before entering a community or even getting married.  The thing is to find a good confessor who knows how to deal with it and then listen to him.

Edited May 18, 2013 by inperpetuity

[EmilyAnn]

If one suffers from severe scrupulosity, I would say it would be most sensible for that person to work with a spiritual director/confessor before any kind of discernment - for their own spiritual well-being above all else. 

[MarysLittleFlower]

I agree about getting help with it... thanks for the replies

Edited May 19, 2013 by MarysLittleFlower

[FFI Griswold]

Ave Maria!

 

I don't know to what degree you're having problems with scrupulosity, but I think St. Alphonsus says it's better to be a little on the scrupulous (cautious) side than to be on the tepid (indifferent) side in regards to sin. In either case, a good spiritual director should be able to help you through this and I don't think a minor case would be an obstacle to religious life. In fact it's common to have some scruples when you're a new postulant/novice because you're still learning the ropes.

 

Pray much, and don't worry. Consecrate yourself to Our Lady and She'll take care of you. Ave Maria!

 

fra John Paul

[Sister Marie]

Just a little background (very little and incomplete!) on Alphonsus (my community follows Alphonsian spirituality)...

 

Alphonsus lived during a time and place in the Church where the rich were "ministered" to while the poor were left with little to no catechesis, very few opportunities for any spiritual and religious experiences, and a feeling that they were not good enough for God. 

 

Alphonsus worked tirelessly to catechize, provide missions and liturgies, and to give love to God's abandoned people and subsequently founded the Redemptorists to do that work.  While Alphonsus is a great moral theologian I do not think he would ever want anyone to suffer the scruples he himself did.  His message was always of God's bountiful and redemptive love.  His focus was on our lives being a response to a relationship of love with God, not a checklist of good and bad. 

 

Scruples and caution are not synonymous.  Scrupulosity keeps us from God because it causes us to doubt the great and boundless love of God and his power to forgive us.  Often it has very little to offer in terms of growing closer to God because it strains the relationship of a soul with God with fear and anxiety.  Caution is certainly warranted and virtuous in many situations so that we try to always do the will of God (another big thing for Alphonsus!) and love him with our actions as well as our words.  Usually caution and prudence keep us from sin while giving us a sense of peace.  

 

Alphonsus himself suffered from scruples but his message and his work in moral theology stayed the same; it was a message of mercy, forgiveness, and love.  While he clearly taught about sin, his pastoral nature offered people comfort and love in the midst of any sins and he actively argued against the very legalistic nature of many theologians of his culture and time.

[MarysLittleFlower]

Thank you for the replies! I agree that being indifferent to sin is very dangerous. I think with me, it's kind of more than just caution (which I agree is a good thing) - I often get intrusive thoughts for some reason and I have anxiety over them, and then I'm unsure if I've consented to them or not, etc. I've also been told I'm scrupulous. So - it seems like I have some issues I need to get help with.

 

This doesn't tend to happen to me with other things... for example, the intrusive thoughts are always something to do with sin that i'm afraid of committing, or are experienced as temptations to the sins. This makes it very difficult for me to examine my conscience and I get confused easily. I don't think I have anything else like depression, 'general' OCD (like how people need to constantly wash their hands, or check something, etc), bipolar, or other disorders. I have spoken to my priest about all this and I do want to get help for this problem.

 

I'm just worried about this meaning that I can't ever enter a religious order, because i've been trying to discern that. If the problem goes away eventually, that's another thing. I guess maybe I should just open up to God more so He can guide me where He wants, and trust Him more, so I don't get so anxious about vocations.

Edited May 19, 2013 by MarysLittleFlower

[Sister Marie]

MarysLittleFlower,

 

I think what you need more than anything is a spiritual director who can companion you through this struggle.  Recognizing it is difficult for you is probably the hardest part and you have already done that!  Maybe you could try to think about your vocation now being to overcome this scrupulosity.  Everyone in the world has the vocation to live a holy life - this is one part of your journey in your vocation.  Instead of thinking of the particular vocation and how this struggle fits in maybe you can place it in the context of the universal call to holiness. 

 

I don't know if this is possible for you but if you don't have a spiritual director and need to find one, make sure it is someone who is actually trained in spiritual direction and someone who has first hand knowledge of religious life lived in community like a brother, sister, or religious priest.  I know that seems like a tall order but try contacting communities near you and I bet many of them will have someone who has the background necessary to help you.  I can't stress enough though to find someone who has gone through some education specifically for spiritual direction.  It isn't something that any "religious" figure can do, even if they are holy and knowledgeable.  It requires a set of skills and intuition that comes from study and practice.

 

I'll be praying for you.  God loves you!  He desires for you to be happy and holy above all else.

 

SM

[MarysLittleFlower]

Thank you Sr Marie :) I think what's been making this painful for me is that the past few years, I've been feeling really drawn to religious life or another type of consecrated life (but I understand this needs to be discerned and I'm praying to be more open to what God would have me do), but when I realized that the scrupulosity/etc is a big problem in my life, I became afraid about vocations. At first I really struggled against the idea of being a religious, but eventually I began wanting this too and responding to it in my heart, and now I got afraid that it could never happen. Since I have spent so long (since even before becoming Catholic) thinking of this, wondering and reading about it, and getting certain indications that I decided could mean a potential vocation, - I'm having difficulty dealing with the realization that I might have some problems like this especially if psychology is involved cause I don't know if this would make a religious vocation impossible. I guess I feel a little lost.. and need to pray a lot about it, but I'm planning on continue getting help. Thanks again :)

[Sister Marie]

Everything I'm about to say is totally my opinion only...but, I don't personally see this as a serious problem that would keep you from religious life if you deal with it now... if you entered with it I think it could be a serious problem for your vocation.  It could turn into something that gets in the way of you being at peace and happy in your vocation, not because you don't have one but because you might not have the tools to live religious life if you are struggling with this scrupulosity.  I don't think a vocation is impossible for you.  It seems to me from what you have said that you need help navigating this issue with a spiritual director... once you and your spiritual director feel confident in your progress I don't think it would affect your vocation in any way other than being something you are aware of for the future. 

 

I think if you focus on your call to holiness in the universal sense while you are dealing with this you can diffuse some of the anxiety about whether or not you can be a religious.  Once you and your director feel like you've progressed to a good place with the scrupulosity there shouldn't be any reason why you couldn't answer a call to religious life. 

 

Many of us need help with something in spiritual direction -  I know I do! 

 

SM

[MarysLittleFlower]

Thanks Sr Marie! :) I'll continue getting help with this. I hope I'll be able to understand and respond to the vocation that God has for me. God bless you!

[EmilyAnn]

If you can find it, Mother Mistress recommended I read Gertrude of Helfta's Herald of Divine Love. If I remember correctly, it was Chapter 18 that she bookmarked for me. Annoyingly, where I can find the book online that chapter is the only one not available - typical! Anyway, if you have it or can get your hands on it I found it immensely helpful with scrupulous tendencies. 

[Lumiere]

Is this the book you are talking about?