Gay: Born That Way?

[Basilisa Marie]

How can we expect Catholic gay people to be able to find resources and support if it's not okay to talk about being gay in Catholic circles?  If we treat people like they're a dirty secret, of course people are going to look for other places of support. 

[franciscanheart]

I, unfortunately, have known a few people who introduce themselves as gay people. Literally, "Hello! My name is Amy and I'm a lesbian." It was alarming and off-putting. It would have been the same, I'm sure, if the same person had announced themselves as straight upon meeting them. It puts a little too much emphasis on their sexuality. If I'm not looking to date you, I don't really need to know that right off the bat. You know?

Maybe that's me being a hypocrite; I'm honestly not sure.

[vee]

I kinda hope we can get to a point where we have openly gay priests (who remain celibate, of course). The whole gayness being a taboo isn't really helping anyone. 

 

good thing youre buddhist

[CatholicsAreKewl]

good thing youre buddhist

Is it really that out of line for a priest to admit to his congregants that he is gay? I don't really see the problem. 

[CrossCuT]

How can we expect Catholic gay people to be able to find resources and support if it's not okay to talk about being gay in Catholic circles?  If we treat people like they're a dirty secret, of course people are going to look for other places of support. 

I definitely agree with this.

Right now I feel like a lot of gay teens or adults or anyone who are either Catholic or looking into the Catholic faith may find themselves at a loss.

The church is very outspoken about their views on homosexuality and its sinfulness, however I dont think they do a good job helping/supporting those Catholics who find themselves in a situation where they are either questioning their sexuality or already know that they are homosexual.

 

What resources do we actually have for these people?

Do you think the majority of homosexuals look at the church and go "now THATS a place where I can easily fit in"? Absolutely not.

 

We need to make a conscious effort to stop treating them like they have a disease.

Edited May 20, 2013 by CrossCuT

[dUSt]

What resources do we actually have for these people?

Do you think the majority of homosexuals look at the church and go "now THATS a place where I can easily fit in"? Absolutely not.

 

http://couragerc.net/

 

They're everywhere: http://couragerc.net/Chapter_Listings.html

[CrossCuT]

I cant view that website at work apparently  :sos:

[cappie]

Personal Story:

 

I remember when I was confronted with my opinions up to a point of time when I found myself helping some friends of mine whom I had known a long time. The old lies that would have me believe it was “dangerous” to hang out with a loving, affectionate gay couple – two passionate Christians, at that! – kept replaying because wouldn’t life be simpler if you isolated yourself from anything that would complicate your beliefs?  Wouldn’t it be easier if you spent all your effort on drawing lines and defending yourself and pushing away those who disagree? You’re going to crumble if you keep this up.

I carried these bitter thoughts with me to church the next morning to celebrate the Holy Mass.  The decision to enter into this whole emotion and politically charged area seemed increasingly foolish in light of the mounting tension and you won’t be strong enough to help anyone, much less –

“This is my Body which will be given up for you”

– yourself and the controversy will consume you and you’ll be –

“This is the chalice of my Blood....which will be poured out for you .....for the forgiveness of sins”

– ridiculed and misunderstood  and –

The accusations ended abruptly as I watched the piece of host dropped into the chalice  slowly turn crimson. 

“Epiphany” is the only word I can use to describe that moment: a sudden burst of clarity that overwhelmed me and my whispering fears. The confusion of the preceding moments dissolved and in its place there appeared a calm certainty: this is the shape my life must take.

The Eucharist rendered my life intelligible again.

We follow a Christ who was, and is every day, torn to pieces. He was misunderstood and ridiculed, or sometimes understood perfectly well and hated for what he said and did. He was nailed to a low-hanging plank and slowly suffocated outside the city gate. And this is how we are told to remember him.

Because this is our story. This is who we are becoming. People who love so fiercely that we throw ourselves into the midst of things so that there may be peace, so that the unloved would know the touch of a friend, so that the hopeless would see with new eyes and the neglected would discover what it means to have a family. We proclaim Christ, and him crucified.

And people may tear us apart for it. The tension will pull at our seams and always feel as if it is a second away from undoing us. We will have to struggle against the impulse to move back to safety, relieve the tension, remain untroubled, and bury our weakness.

But Eucharist is the utmost display of weakness. The cross is weakness.

And this is the beauty of it.

 

[MissScripture]

Personal Story:

I remember when I was confronted with my opinions up to a point of time when I found myself helping some friends of mine whom I had known a long time. The old lies that would have me believe it was “dangerous” to hang out with a loving, affectionate gay couple – two passionate Christians, at that! – kept replaying because wouldn’t life be simpler if you isolated yourself from anything that would complicate your beliefs? Wouldn’t it be easier if you spent all your effort on drawing lines and defending yourself and pushing away those who disagree? You’re going to crumble if you keep this up.
I carried these bitter thoughts with me to church the next morning to celebrate the Holy Mass. The decision to enter into this whole emotion and politically charged area seemed increasingly foolish in light of the mounting tension and you won’t be strong enough to help anyone, much less –
“This is my Body which will be given up for you”
– yourself and the controversy will consume you and you’ll be –
“This is the chalice of my Blood....which will be poured out for you .....for the forgiveness of sins”
– ridiculed and misunderstood and –
The accusations ended abruptly as I watched the piece of host dropped into the chalice slowly turn crimson.
“Epiphany” is the only word I can use to describe that moment: a sudden burst of clarity that overwhelmed me and my whispering fears. The confusion of the preceding moments dissolved and in its place there appeared a calm certainty: this is the shape my life must take.
The Eucharist rendered my life intelligible again.
We follow a Christ who was, and is every day, torn to pieces. He was misunderstood and ridiculed, or sometimes understood perfectly well and hated for what he said and did. He was nailed to a low-hanging plank and slowly suffocated outside the city gate. And this is how we are told to remember him.
Because this is our story. This is who we are becoming. People who love so fiercely that we throw ourselves into the midst of things so that there may be peace, so that the unloved would know the touch of a friend, so that the hopeless would see with new eyes and the neglected would discover what it means to have a family. We proclaim Christ, and him crucified.
And people may tear us apart for it. The tension will pull at our seams and always feel as if it is a second away from undoing us. We will have to struggle against the impulse to move back to safety, relieve the tension, remain untroubled, and bury our weakness.
But Eucharist is the utmost display of weakness. The cross is weakness.
And this is the beauty of it.

:love: Thank you, Father. That was beautiful.

[cappie]

This is the conclusion to the post above, I had to go do something in a hurry and did not conclude;

 

The celebration of Holy Mass is a sacrificial, destructive act. But the miracle of it is that as the body of Christ, the Host is broken to pieces the body of Christ, the Church, is made more whole. We are nourished and drawn together and given the strength to carry on. We are empowered to boldly live in weakness.

 

This is how the power of Christ is made perfect in weakness: that although we are vulnerable we press deep into the suffering of the world and make it our own, although we may receive blows from every direction we refuse to let our capacity to love and forgive be beaten out of us, and although we are silenced and misunderstood we never disdain the sacred act of listening to another and seeking to understand. It seems like I will never cease having to relearn this most basic of truths, and I imagine that is why celebrating the Eucharist will never cease to astonish and amaze me.

 

The fears that plagued me on my friend’s couch are still with me.   And yet I’ve never felt so at peace about this process nor so confident that the Church will be there for me in and through it all. I will be more grounded in the living grace of my God with whom I’ll have sat in blessed silence and more in love with his Church that will sustain me and inspire me to act in truth and humility. Living in Australia  I may never have the pleasure of getting to meet any of you, but I take comfort  in knowing that our many voices sing together in awe of our Saviour and our weary souls dance together toward the table of charity and grace.  :dance3:

 

Edited May 21, 2013 by cappie

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

Dust I like your example about the adultry but here's where it fails in my mind....If someone is born gay and that's the way they really are then it doesn't seem right to say you can't be with a person you love or you're going to hell...

 Who mentioned hell ?

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

Just to drop another point of view. If the condition of homosexuality is a state that a person is born into than surely as christians we must believe there given the grace to also understand they can't marry or have children, you can't procreate if your homosexual. Also i don't believe it is a state persons are born with, but if it was or is ?  Nore do i condemn anyone to ghenna in the temporal nore the perpetual, though it is a real place in both spheres, i will leave that up to God.

[add]

It is simply a choice and there loss.   It doesn’t necessarily make one a bad person

 

 

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

It is simply a choice and there loss.   It doesn’t necessarily make one a bad person

 

Not bad in every aspect, but sin is bad. Unsure if it's official church teaching, but my experience with sin is it reduces my ability to be truly charitable. In a state of sin my ability to be charitable in faith and works is diminished, the more sin the more diminished. .

[add]

first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.