Feelings Of Intense Frustration

[MIKolbe]

I'll take one.

You got it, man.

[BG45]

OP would unfortunately die of a broken heart if attending a parish I did a few weeks ago while visiting someone.  I forget the vessels, but the EMHC's weren't being proper in their job, I couldn't tell I was at Mass at some points, and no kneelers in the entire building...like, if you wanted to kneel, you literally could not because the pews were spaced too closely together.

 

Btw, how come none of  you bow during the Credo?

 

Much like many others have said, I bow during it, even if the pew cards my parish uses decided not to show that we still do that.  Also, I'd be willing to bet everyone, or almost everyone here, strikes their chest during the Confiteor.  

 

 

[Amppax]

In the US, we have the option of kneeling or standing.  If one's bishop says that he wants everyone to do one or the other, we should obey him out of respect for his authority, even if we don't feel like it.  So while both are good and holy and acceptable postures according to the Church, a bishop is free and able to make the call about what he wants in his diocese concerning things like this. 

 

So, for example, a while ago when my bishop at the time made standing the norm in my diocese, my priest had to ask permission for us to kneel, otherwise we'd be flouting his authority and that's sinful.  My bishop gladly gave it, though it made for some strange looks and interesting conversations when my parish's youth group went to a retreat put on by the diocese.  Everyone was confused as to why we were kneeling, and we were confused as to why they were standing.  :hehe2: Then my priest explained it to us. 

 

My point in bringing it up is that when we're figuring out which liturgical posture we want to do we have to take what our own bishop has said about the matter into account (if he's said anything at all).  You can't just go over his head and do what you want because that's how they do it in Rome. :)

 

Actually, the current addition of the GIRM states that a bishop can't require the faithful to stand.  I'd provide a link, but I don't have time.  I'll try to later.  

[ToJesusMyHeart]

Actually, the current addition of the GIRM states that a bishop can't require the faithful to stand.  I'd provide a link, but I don't have time.  I'll try to later.  

The previous edition said that pastors should correct that super naughty kneeling behavior and give pastoral counseling or something. 

 

But the current 2011 edition says,

 

"160. The Priest then takes the paten or ciborium and approaches the communicants, who usually come up in procession.

It is not permitted for the faithful to take the consecrated Bread or the sacred chalice by themselves and, still less, to hand them on from one to another among themselves. The norm established for the Dioceses of the United States of America is that Holy Communion is to be received standing, unless an individual member of the faithful wishes to receive Communion while kneeling (Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments, Instruction, Redemptionis Sacramentum, March 25, 2004, no. 91)."

 

As you can see, it completely excludes the correctional language and does not require "pastoral correction" or whatever the term was. :)

[Basilisa Marie]

Okay, but your own bishop can still make the call one way or the other.  Lack of pastoral correction language doesn't mean a bishop can't decide that kneeling needs special permission.  Some bishops HAVE made judgments about this, but it seems like most have not.  

[ToJesusMyHeart]

I'd write a complaint letter to Rome and switch dioceses, personally.

[Basilisa Marie]

I'd write a complaint letter to Rome and switch dioceses, personally.

 

But in the meantime you'd have to stand.  :)  Or what if you lived in a place where you couldn't switch dioceses without moving to another state? 

 

I know I'm being annoying by harping on this, but it's important.  Apostolic Succession doesn't stop with Rome.  We effectively deny the authority of Christ by being disobedient to our bishops.  Obedience doesn't just apply when we're talking about crazy liberals. 

[jim111]

But in the meantime you'd have to stand.   :)  Or what if you lived in a place where you couldn't switch dioceses without moving to another state? 

 

I know I'm being annoying by harping on this, but it's important.  Apostolic Succession doesn't stop with Rome.  We effectively deny the authority of Christ by being disobedient to our bishops.  Obedience doesn't just apply when we're talking about crazy liberals. 

 

Or if you have enough people who desire a TLM the bishop has to give you one.

 

Art. 5. § 1 In parishes, where there is a stable group of faithful who adhere to the earlier liturgical tradition, the pastor should willingly accept their requests to celebrate the Mass according to the rite of the Roman Missal published in 1962, and ensure that the welfare of these faithful harmonises with the ordinary pastoral care of the parish, under the guidance of the bishop in accordance with canon 392, avoiding discord and favouring the unity of the whole Church.

Summorum Pontificum

 

The rubrics of the Tridentine are very specific, and your local bishop does not have the right to alter anything major.

[Gabriela]

Or if you have enough people who desire a Traditional Latin Mass the bishop has to give you one.

 

How many are "enough"?

[jim111]

How many are "enough"?

 

I have heard if you have 200 your golden.

 

That's what I over herd at my FSSP parish.

Edited May 1, 2013 by jim111

[ardillacid]

I assumed that this was about Ardill's love life.

 

BAM!

 

Sometimes I feel sad about all the witty comments I must miss when I skip threads. :blush:

[ardillacid]

I assumed that this was about Ardill's love life.

 

BAM!

 

Sometimes I feel sad about all the witty comments I must miss when I skip threads. :blush:

[ardillacid]

I assumed that this was about Ardill's love life.

 

BAM!

 

Sometimes I feel sad about all the witty comments I must miss when I skip threads. :blush:

[Nihil Obstat]

How many are "enough"?

The Vatican has not specified. Simply a stable group. But the instruction is to interpret as generously as possible.

200 is probably significantly more than is strictly necessary. Edited May 1, 2013 by Nihil Obstat

[Gabriela]

The Vatican has not specified. Simply a stable group. But the instruction is to interpret as generously as possible.

200 is probably significantly more than is strictly necessary.

 

"As generously as possible" meaning "as few as possible"?

 

Yeah, 200 seems like it'd be impossible anywhere but a huge city with lots of Catholics. Lafayette has a MEF once a month. When I get there, I want to put a lot of work into getting it more often.