Bible Question

[Gabriela]

Why did Jesus tell Mary Magdalene not to "cling" to Him? This passage really bothers me. It seems so hurtful...

[Nihil Obstat]

I forget which passage that is. Could you remind me?

[Spem in alium]

Nihil: John 20:17.

 

Yeah, it can be a stumper. I was recently at a reflection retreat on the Resurrection narratives, and the facilitator just skipped right over that line because she didn't like it. 

Clinging to someone is a pretty emotional response. It's more than simply touching them; the word "clinging" evokes the idea that Mary was tightly holding on to Jesus or even hanging off him. If we take into account what Jesus says afterwards, "for I have not yet ascended to the Father", he could be reassuring her that he was not ascending immediately, that she'd still have some time with him and so did not need to act so emotionally or hastily. Maybe she didn't fully understand that he had died and that he was to ascend (they are fairly big concepts, after all). 

 

Just my view, maybe someone has a better take :)

Edited April 27, 2013 by Spem in alium

[Basilisa Marie]

Oooh, OOoh, Augustine actually has a homily on this!  

 

I forget which one, but he basically argues that the reason why Jesus wouldn't let Mary touch him but told his apostles to touch him was because what's important is "touching" Jesus with the "hands" of faith.  Mary was fully capable of believing Jesus just by witnessing his post-resurrected presence.  Her faith was strong and she understood.  On the other hand, his disciples doubted, so Jesus allowed them to touch him in order to strengthen their faith. 

 

Maybe if he had allowed Mary to touch him, it would have damaged her faith. OR, Jesus knew he could tell her "No not yet!" and she'd be okay with it.  The disciples, on the other hand, needed the "crutch" of the sensory experience to get them to understand.  

[Nihil Obstat]

Aquinas' Catena Aurea commentary on John 20: 10-18

(It is a bit long.)

 

 

GREG. Mary Magdalene, who had been the sinner in the city, and who had washed out the spots of her sins by her tears, whose soul burned with love, did not retire from the sepulcher when the others did: Then the disciples went away again to their own home. AUG. i.e. To the place where they were lodging, and from which they had ran to the sepulcher. But though the men returned, the stronger love of the woman fixed her to the spot. But Mary stood without at the sepulcher weeping. AUG. i.e. Outside of the place where the stone sepulcher was, but yet within the garden. CHRYS. Be not astonished that Mary wept for love at the sepulcher, and Peter did not; for the female sex is naturally tender, and inclined to weep. AUG. The eyes then which had sought our Lord, and found Him not, now wept without interruption; more for grief that our Lord had been removed, than for His death upon the cross. For now even all memorial of Him was taken away. AUG. She then saw, with the other women, the Angel sitting on the right, on the stone which had been rolled away from the sepulcher, at whose words it was that she looked into the sepulcher. CHRYS. The sight of the sepulcher itself was some consolation. Nay, behold her, to console herself still more, stooping down, to see the very place where the body lay: And as she wept, she stooped down, and looked into the sepulcher. GREG. For to have looked once is not enough for love. Love makes one desire to look over and over again. AUG. In her too great grief she could believe neither her own eyes, nor the disciples. Or was it a divine impulse which caused her to look in? GREG. She sought the body, and found it not; she persevered in seeking; and so it came to pass that she found. Her longings growing the stronger, the more they were disappointed, at last found and laid hold on their object. For holy longings ever gain strength by delay, did they not, they would not be longings. Mary so loved, that not content with seeing the sepulcher, she stooped down and looked in: let us see the fruit which came of this persevering love: And sees two Angels in white sitting, the one at the head, and the other at the feet, where the body of Jesus had lain, CHRYS. As her understanding was not so raised as to be able to gather from the napkins the fact of the resurrection, she is given the sight of Angels in bright apparel, who soothe her sorrow. AUG. But why did one sit at the head, the other at the feet? To signify that the glad tidings of Christ's Gospel was to be delivered from the head to the feet, from the beginning to the end. The Greek word Angel means one who delivers news. GREG. The Angel sits at the head when the Apostles preach that in the beginning was the Word: he sits, as it were, at the feet, when it is said, The Word was made flesh. By the two Angels too we may understand the two testaments; both of which proclaim alike the incarnation, death, and resurrection of our Lord. The Old seems to sit at the head, the New at the feet. CHRYS. The Angels who appear say nothing about the resurrection; but by degrees the subject is entered on. First of all they address her compassionately, to prevent her from being overpowered by a spectacle of such extraordinary brightness: And they say to her, Woman, why weep you? The Angels forbade tears, and announced, as it were, the joy that was at hand: Why weep you? As if to say, Weep not. GREG. The very declarations of Scripture which excite our tears of love, wipe away those very tears, by promising us the sight of our Redeemer again. AUG. But she, thinking that they wanted to know why she wept, tells them the reason: She says to them, Because they have taken away my Lord. The lifeless body of her Lord, she calls her Lord, putting the part for the whole; just as we confess that Jesus Christ the Son of God was buried, when only His flesh was buried. And I know not where here they hare placed Him: it was a still greater grief, that she did not know where to go to console her grief. CHRYS. As yet she knew nothing of the resurrection, but thought the body had been taken away. AUG. Here the Angels must be understood to rise up, for Luke describes them as seen standing. AUG. The hour was now come, which the Angels announced, when sorrow should be succeeded by joy: And when she had thus said, she turned herself back. CHRYS. But why, when she is talking to the Angels, and before she has heard any thing from them, does she turn back? It seems to me that while she was speaking, Christ appeared behind her, and that the Angels by their posture, look, and motion, showed that they saw our Lord, and that thus it was that she turned back. GREG. We must observe that Mary, who as yet doubted our Lord's resurrection, turned back to see Jesus. By her doubting she turned her back, as it were, upon our Lord. Yet inasmuch as she loved, she saw Him. She loved and doubted: she saw, and did not recognize Him: And saw Jesus standing, and knew not that it was Jesus. CHRYS. To the Angels He appeared as their Lord but not so to c the woman, for the sight coming upon her all at once, would have stupefied her. She was not to be lifted suddenly, but gradually to high things.

GREG. Jesus says to her, Woman, why do you weep? He asks the cause of her grief, to set her longing still more. For the mere mentioning His name whom she sought would inflame her love for Him. CHRYS. Because He appeared as a common person, she c thought Him the gardener: She, supposing Him to be the gardener, says to Him, Sir, if you have borne Him from here, tell me where you have laid Him, and 1 will take Him away. i.e. If you have taken Him away from fear of the Jews, tell me, and I will take Him again. THEOPHYL. She was afraid that the Jews might vent their rage even on the lifeless body, and therefore wished to remove it to some secret place. GREG. Perhaps, however, the woman was right, in believing Jesus to be the gardener. Was not He the spiritual Gardener, who by the power of His love had sown strong seeds of virtue in her breast? But how is it that, as soon as she sees the gardener, as she supposes Him to be, she says without having told Him who it was she was seeking, Sir, if you have borne Him from here? It arises from her love; when one loves a person, one never thinks that any one else can be ignorant of him. Our Lord, after calling her by the common name of her sex, and not being recognized, calls her by her own name: Jesus says to her, Mary; as if to say, Recognize Him, who recognizes you. Mary, being called by name, recognizes Him; that it was He whom she sought externally, and He who taught her internally to seek. She turned herself, and says to Him, Rabooni; which its to say, Master. CHRYS. Just as He was sometimes in the midst of the Jews, and they did not know Him till He pleased to make Himself known. But why does she turn herself; when she had turned herself before? It seems to me that when she said, Where you have laid Him, she turned to the Angels, to ask why they were astonished. Then Christ, calling her, discovered Himself by His voice, and made her turn to Him again. AUG. Or she first turned her body, but thought Him what He was not; now she was turned in heart, and knew who He was. Let no one however blame her, because she called the gardener, Lord, and Jesus, Master. The one was a title of courtesy to a person from whom she was asking a favor; the other of respect to a Teacher from whom she was used to learn to distinguish the divine from the human. The word Lord is used in different senses, when she says, They have taken away my Lord, and when she says, Lord, if you have borne Him away. GREG The Evangelist does not add what she did upon recognizing Him, but we know from what our Lord said to her: Jesus says to her, Touch Me not. Mary then had tried to embrace His feet, but was not allowed. Why not? The reason follows: For I am not yet ascended to My Father. AUG. But if standing upon the earth, He is not touched, how shall He be touched sitting in heaven? And did He not before His ascension offer Himself to the touch of the disciples: Handle Me and see, for a spirit has not flesh and bones? Who can be so absurd as to suppose that He was willing that disciples should touch Him before He ascended to His Father, and unwilling that women should till after Nay, we read of women after the resurrection, and before He ascended to His Father, touching Him, one of whom was Mary Magdalene herself, according to Matthew. Either then Mary here is a type of the Gentile Church, which did not believe in Christ till after His ascension: or the meaning is that Jesus is to be believed in, i.e. spiritually touched, in no other way, but as being one with the Father. He ascends to the Father mystically, as it were, in the mind of him who has so far advanced as to acknowledge that He is equal to the Father. But how could Mary believe in Him otherwise than carnally, when she wept for Him as a man? AUG. Touch is as it were the end of knowledge and He was unwilling that a soul intent upon Him should have its end, in thinking Him only what He seemed to be. CHRYS. Mary wished to be as familiar with Christ now, as she was before His Passion; forgetting, in her joy, that His body was made much more holy by its resurrection. So, Touch Me not, He says, to remind her of this, and make her feel awe in talking with Him. For which reason too He no longer keeps company with His disciples, viz. that they might look upon Him with the greater awe. Again, by saying I have not yet ascended, He shows that He is hastening there. And He who was going to depart and live no more with men, ought not to be regarded with the same feeling that He was before: But go to My brethren, and say to them, I ascend to My Father, and you Father; and to My God, and your God. HILARY. Heretics, among their other impieties, misinterpret these words of our Lord's, and say, that if His Father is their Father, His God their God, He cannot be God Himself. But though He remained in the form of God, He took upon Him the form of a servant; and Christ says this in the form of a servant to men. And we cannot doubt that in so far as He is man, the Father is His Father in the same sense in which He is of other men, and God His God in like manner. Indeed He begins with saying, Go to My brethren, But God can only have brethren according to the flesh; the Only-Begotten God, being Only-Begotten, is without brethren. AUG. He does not say, Our Father, but, My Father and your Father: Mine therefore and yours in a different sense; Mine by nature, yours by grace. Nor does He say, Our God, but My God - under Him I am man - and your God; between you and Him I am Mediator. AUG. She then went away from. the sepulcher, i.e. from that part of the garden before the rock which had been hollowed out, and with her the other women. But these, according to Mark, were seized with trembling and amazement, and said nothing to any man: Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples that she had seen the Lord, and that He had spoken these things to her. GREG. So the sin of mankind is buried in the very place whence it came forth. For whereas in Paradise the woman gave the man the deadly fruit, a woman from the sepulcher announced life to men; a woman delivers the message of Him who raises us from the dead, as a woman had delivered the words of the serpent who slew us. AUG. While she was going with the other women, according to Matthew, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. So we gather that there were two visions of Angels ; and that our Lord too was seen twice once when Mary took Him for the gardener, and again, when He met them by the way, and by this repeating His presence confirmed their faith. And so Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples, not alone, but with the other women whom Luke mentions. BEDE. Mystically, Mary, which name signifies, mistress, enlightened, enlightener, star of the sea, stands for the Church, which is also Magdalene, i.e. towered, (Magdalene being Greek for tower) as we read in the Psalms, you have been a strong tower for me. In that she announced Christ's resurrection to the disciples, all, especially those to whom the office of preaching is committed are admonished to be zealous in setting forth to others whatever is revealed from above.

 

 

[LouisvilleFan]

Nihil: John 20:17.

 

Yeah, it can be a stumper. I was recently at a reflection retreat on the Resurrection narratives, and the facilitator just skipped right over that line because she didn't like it. 

Clinging to someone is a pretty emotional response. It's more than simply touching them; the word "clinging" evokes the idea that Mary was tightly holding on to Jesus or even hanging off him. If we take into account what Jesus says afterwards, "for I have not yet ascended to the Father", he could be reassuring her that he was not ascending immediately, that she'd still have some time with him and so did not need to act so emotionally or hastily. Maybe she didn't fully understand that he had died and that he was to ascend (they are fairly big concepts, after all). 

 

Just my view, maybe someone has a better take :)

 

My thoughts when hearing this passage have always been along the same lines, perhaps with more emphasis on looking foward to the Resurrection, as Jesus himself alludes to it. To me he's speaking to Mary, and to all his followers through her: He knew that He would ascend to the Father, and that the purpose of his 40 days on earth was to prepare his followers to receive the Holy Spirit and evangelize. Just as parents sometimes need to push their children away when it's time for them to leave the house and enter the "real world," he was pushing Mary and his disciples away so they would be ready to love and die for the world.

[Spem in alium]

My thoughts when hearing this passage have always been along the same lines, perhaps with more emphasis on looking foward to the Resurrection, as Jesus himself alludes to it. To me he's speaking to Mary, and to all his followers through her: He knew that He would ascend to the Father, and that the purpose of his 40 days on earth was to prepare his followers to receive the Holy Spirit and evangelize. Just as parents sometimes need to push their children away when it's time for them to leave the house and enter the "real world," he was pushing Mary and his disciples away so they would be ready to love and die for the world.

It's an intriguing verse and reading. I also like the references that have been made to Augustine. Very thought-provoking words.

[Gabriela]

 

Aquinas' Catena Aurea...

 

OH.

 

MY.

 

GOSH.

 

What is this document?! It's like a Catholic Gemara! Does it provide commentary on the whole Bible in that way? Where can I get a copy of this? Is it online? This should be in every Catholic home!

[Gabriela]

Oooh, OOoh, Augustine actually has a homily on this!  

 

I forget which one...

 

Does anyone know which homily this is? Can someone find a link/reference to it?

[Nihil Obstat]

OH.

 

MY.

 

GOSH.

 

What is this document?! It's like a Catholic Gemara! Does it provide commentary on the whole Bible in that way? Where can I get a copy of this? Is it online? This should be in every Catholic home!

It is a Gospel commentary that St. Thomas Aquinas compiled, based (obviously) on the best patristic sources. It is available online if you Google "Catena Aurea", but it is also available in print as well. I have been thinking about getting this one for a while. A bit pricey, but you would expect it for something like this.

 

Edit: if you want commentary on the entire Bible, rather than just the Gospels, the Hayodock commentary is also really good. I use it all the time. Although probably nothing can quite equal the Catena Aurea.

Edited April 28, 2013 by Nihil Obstat

[Gabriela]

It is a Gospel commentary that St. Thomas Aquinas compiled, based (obviously) on the best patristic sources. It is available online if you Google "Catena Aurea", but it is also available in print as well. I have been thinking about getting this one for a while. A bit pricey, but you would expect it for something like this.

 

Edit: if you want commentary on the entire Bible, rather than just the Gospels, the Hayodock commentary is also really good. I use it all the time. Although probably nothing can quite equal the Catena Aurea.

 

See, Nihil? My "affirmation" was right.  :blowkiss:

 

Jesus needs to resurrect Aquinas ASAP so he can finish this thing for the WHOLE Bible.

[Basilisa Marie]

Does anyone know which homily this is? Can someone find a link/reference to it?

 

Lemme dig it out...

 

okay, It's sermon 229K, preached on the Thursday after Easter sometime after 412.  It was in a photocopied packet I got in class, so I don't know how easy it'll be to find it online. 

Edited April 29, 2013 by Basilisa Marie

[Nihil Obstat]

I checked in The Faith of the Early Fathers, and while it is possible that it is buried in there somewhere, I could not find it.

[Nihil Obstat]

I think I have found it. One second.

[Nihil Obstat]

Hm, or perhaps not. I found a book that has "Sermon 229", but no indication of further division, and it is very short.

Here is the link, anyway. Starts on page 201 of the book, which is page 225 of the website, so you can jump forward.