Boston Bombing News Thread

[Ice_nine]

A few of us were watching the news and found the party-like atmosphere that broke out when the suspect was arrested to be quite strange. Is that kind of thing common in America?

 

Also, it's interesting to note that on the same day as the bomb in Boston, over 120 people died in bombings in Iraq but I only saw one news story about it. I think it says quite a bit about the human psyche.

 

Yeah it's not too uncommon. similar things happened when bin laden was killed (although that had many differences obviously). It's like a "we caught the bad guy" type feeling. It not super rational but human behavior is at most times not rational.

 

And sad as it is, bombs blowing people up in Iraq is not a shocker. A tragedy for sure, but things are sort of expected to go wrong there. Things are not supposed to blow up in America. There's definitely a false sense of security that, when violated, seems to have a more widespread outcry. The media also plays no small part. We have more money and power to spread the message further and for longer than middle eastern outlets.

 

just my two cents

[Noel's angel]

It just seems to me that our brains seem to feed and thrive on the unusual. People get killed in Iraq, we're used to that so it doesn't affect us in anywhere near the same way as the Boston bombing. People were glued to their computer screens and TVs watching it all unfold. We exaggerate the unusual, out-of-the-ordinary things.

[CrossCuT]

Iraq is a location for combat with everything happening over there...we have troops etc as well as civilians.

 

Boston is not a combat zone so why are there mysterious bombs going off?

Of course its unusual!!!

Even so, doesnt make the lives lost any less important.

[Noel's angel]

I'm not sure you understand what I was trying to say. Of course it is unusual, but I think it's important to look at why our brains seem to feast on those more unusual things and why we become de-sensitised to loss of life because it is a more common occurrence.

Edited April 20, 2013 by Noel's angel

[xTrishaxLynnx]

Defense mechanism? If all we ever thought about was the deaths occurring we wouldn't be able to function.

[Ice_nine]

I'm not sure you understand what I was trying to say. Of course it is unusual, but I think it's important to look at why our brains seem to feast on those more unusual things and why we become de-sensitised to loss of life because it is a more common occurrence.

 

I have lots of ideas about why this is, which generally wraps up into "it's human nature." unfortunately

[Era Might]

I just feel like I need to share myself.  I feel a whole mixture of emotions right now in response to everything that has happened.  First of all, I have followed this story all week and, in a way, have become obsessed with it.  I questioned myself, why could I not detach myself from this situation?  I did eventually realize that there was a connection between the violence and the bombs and my own experience of worrying for a loved one in war.  I felt my own anxiety from that time over again as I watched the families suffering and the fear of the people on the news.

 

However, another emotion took hold of me as well.  I feel such a sadness for both of the young men who committed these crimes.  What pain, confusion, suffering, and sin brought them to this moment?  While on one hand I pray that they are brought to justice on the other I find myself praying that they find themselves held in the hands of a merciful, compassionate, and loving God who has never left them... even when they committed a terrible evil.  My heart hurts thinking of both of  them.

 

This year the convent I live in was robbed.  Everyday since then I have prayed for the people who came into our home while we were asleep and violated our home.  There was a connection forged in that moment that cannot be taken away and it is a connection of sin, forgiveness, and love.  I wish I knew who they were so that I could talk to them and love them. 

 

I don't know if any of that makes sense in light of this terrible tragedy but I am praying for both the perpetrators and victims in this situation and am asking God for his transformative and loving presence to change us all.

 

Yes, I am reading Dostoevsky's "Crime and Punishment" as "meditation" on these events.

[Era Might]

I'm not sure you understand what I was trying to say. Of course it is unusual, but I think it's important to look at why our brains seem to feast on those more unusual things and why we become de-sensitised to loss of life because it is a more common occurrence.

 

Yeah, I felt kind of strange the other day, while we were engrossed in our own situation, reading how someone blew up a coffee shop in Iraq and killed 27 people (compared to 4 dead in America). It puts things into perspective.

[4588686]

[quote name="Socrates" post="2573081" timestamp="1366474813"]

U mad bro?[/quote]

Not mad. Just giving you some friendly advice before you opened you mouth and looked ridiculous. Sadly you didn't heed that advice. :'(

Seems that just about every time some psycho commits mass-murder, the lefty idiot talking-heads immediately reflexively start the moronic babbling about "right-wingers" or Tea-Partiers, or Sarah Palin or whatever.

Probably because a lot of people are concerned about how the right wing will utilize the attack to support stupid foreign policy. See my previous post about your political cohorts using the last attack to initiate the most disastrous foruegn policy in our nation's history.

Good article by Deroy Murdoch on this topic (written before the Boston bombers were identified).

And here's some pure amesomeness from the great Mark Steyn: "The 'Co-exist' Bombers."
[/quote]


Can't pull them up.

And yes, unfortunately there is a particular faction of Islam which openly supports terrorism, jihad, and the slaughter of Jews and infidels, etc., and has a global network funded by fundamentalist Saudis. The 9-11 attacks were plotted by an organized plot by an organization called Al Qaeda (you may have heard of them). Though no doubt, that's just a rightwing nutjob conspiracy theory.

Right. So I've written a 20+ paper on the rise of transnational terrorism in Chechnya and the Russian government response to it. I've also lived in a Muslim country down the street from a Salafi mosque whose congregants believed that they had a right to attack Kafir and any Muslims who align themselves with them. I'm aware that transnational terrorism from groups that base their ideology on Islam exist.


Nowhere did I imply that 9/11 was a right wing conspiracy. In fact, I explicitly identified it as an attack perpetuates by Muslims. Some basic critical reading skills could really help you here.

What I said, and this is indisputably true, is that a right wing administration used that attack to launch a massive ground war in Central Asia which has no viable end in sight, launch a war in the gulf based on fraudulent evidence, massively expand the national security state, and enact a global program or kidnapping (*hint* I'm talking about extraordinary rendition *hint*) and torture.

Most recent homegrown attacks ("left-wing," "right-wing" or just plain nutty) were in fact the work of lone crazies, rather than the work of larger organizations. Too bad the facts aren't more pc.

Vomit

While looks obvious that they were inspired by radical Imans, whether the Boston bombers were more-or-less lone wolves or part of a larger conspiracy remains to be seen. But in the mean-time, i won't presume or hope for anything other than that the murderer gets justice for his crimes. I'm just happy they caught the little bastard.

Cool story, bro.

[Chestertonian]

So I've written a 20+ paper on the rise of transnational terrorism in Chechnya and the Russian government response to it

 

What class was that for?

 

[4588686]

 

 

What class was that for?

 

 

 

 

Soviet and Post-Soviet Politics.  I did different takes on the same basic thing (why Russia cares about Chechnya and how the war has transformed Russian society) for two additional classes.  I was interested in doing an honor's thesis at the time on the subject so I had to spend the whole preceding summer and semester reading about the conflict in Chechnya and how it had impacted Russian society (Putin's 'power vertical,' the securitization of the bureaucracy, and the abolition of Yeltsin's asymmetrical federalism).  The point being, I am very well aware that transnational Islamic terrorist organizations exist.  And I bet I can name more foreign Arab and local Chechen commanders in said transnational terrorist organizations operating in  Southern Russian than Socrates.  

Edited April 21, 2013 by Hasan

[Apotheoun]

And I bet I can name more foreign Arab and local Chechen commanders in said transnational terrorist organizations operating in  Southern Russian than Socrates.  

That's nice. Russia has controlled the region for over two hundred years, and it is unlikely (regardless of who is head of state in the Russian Federation) that the Russian government will give up control of the region.

[4588686]

First thing I thought when I heard the suspects were Chechnyan? Hasan.

 

Don't be shy, now's your moment to shine, what do we need to know about Chechnya.

 

One of the major causes of the collapse of the USSR was the resurgence of nationalism across the Soviet world and the countries of the Warsaw pact.  Basically a lot of former communist officials saw the writing on the wall and pivoted to present themselves as champions of X groups nationalist cause.  The most infamous example would probably be Slobadon Milosevic of Serbia but this trend was seen all over.  The current Presidents of Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan are great current examples of this.  In Chechnya we saw this with a former Soviet Air Force Officer named Dudayev.  He flew missions against the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan but, being a good political entrepreneur he saw his chance and, despite never having lived in Chechnya and not speaking Chechen (Stalin shipped the Chechens to Kazakhistan during WWII, killing about 30% of the population in the proccess) managed to present himself as the champion of the Chechen nationalist cause.  

 

What should have happened is what happened elsewhere:

a) Russia just let's Chechnya go

 

or

 

b)Russian negotiates an asymmetrical federal relation with Chechnya.  This is what happened with the Tartar region.  The people get a lot of autonomy and pay a unique tax rate et cetera.  

 

That didn't happen.  It's not clear why.  Russian officials were worried about the USSR's fate befalling Russia.  They were worried that Russian would dissolve due to nationalistic tensions as the USSR did.  It seems like Yeltsin basically ok'd an operation against Chechnya to scare all these provinces now negotiating with Moscow.  An operation that was supposed to last three weeks has lasted years.  The war was awful   The Russian arms killed tens of thousands of Chechen civilians and ethnic Russians living in Grozny in the first few days of the conflict (By Russian estimates).  

 

At this point everything gets even more complicated.  Shamil Basayev led a raid into Russia that basically got Chechnya de facto independence. Things get tricky because after that it becomes very difficult to tell who is working for who.  Rumors are the Basayev is getting paid by the FSB, and he does lead a weird raid into Dagestan which, along with a suspiciously bombed apartment building blamed on Chechen insurgents, helped launch Putin, who was basically a nobody, into the undisputed center of Russian political power.  Moscow elites have funneled some money to Chechen insurgent leaders, but it's hard to tell exactly what sort of collusion is going on.  Basically the war became awful from a humanitarian standpoint but very politically and economically profitable for some major actors.  The phrase 'entrepreneurs of violence applies here.'  

 

The war was originally nationalist.  Shamil Basayev at one point went to Georgia to laud a pan-Caucasian army against the Russians and he was once a political supporter of Yeltsin.  But sometime in the 90's it transformed into a largely Islamist fueled campaign with the influx of Arab fighters.  Anyway, the Russians basically escaped from the nightmare without escape that is this war by installing this genuine sack of horse poo named Ramzan Kadyrov.  

 

It's a pity that there won't be a hell for him to once somebody finally manages to put a bullet in his head.  Russia gives him billions to buy support and rig elections for himself and Putin and in return he makes sure that Russia doesn't experience terrorist attacks (like torturing the families of separatist fighters until they come down from the hills and turn themselves in).  

 

 

 

That was one big stream of consciousness that I dumped out and I'm exhausted.  But if that wasn't clear I'd be happy to clarify later.  

[4588686]

That's nice. Russia has controlled the region for over two hundred years, and it is unlikely (regardless of who is head of state in the Russian Federation) that the Russian government will give up control of the region.

 

 

That's true.  Russia did violently conquer the region some time ago and has had varying degrees of control over it during that time.  It doesnt matter who controls Chechnya.  That war has basically left a power vacuum that is only going to be filled by the absolute worst human scum imaginable.  The only thing that would change would be whether said human scum would have Russian or Chechen surnames.  

[Apotheoun]

Yeah, I know about the resurgence of nationalism, but Russia is not going to give up Chechnya because of its location in the Caucasus as a buffer with Iran and Turkey. Russia has controlled Chechnya longer than the United States has controlled the Southwestern States we took from Mexico. 

Edited April 21, 2013 by Apotheoun