CatholicsAreKewl Posted April 15, 2013 Author Share Posted April 15, 2013 Perfect union with God through co-operation with His grace. "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are "gods"'?John 10:34 Perfect union with God? Doesn't that imply that we "become God"? If not, why is this verse used in reference to Theosis? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatholicsAreKewl Posted April 15, 2013 Author Share Posted April 15, 2013 How does a created being become uncreated? Do you see the problem here? How does an uncreated being have a son? You can't use such reasoning when it comes down to these sorts of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 I fully affirm the traditional doctrine of theosis. It does not mean Mary was divine. I also fully accept the doctrine of theosis, and that doctrine affirms that Mary is not divine by nature, but that - like all the saints - she has been divinized by her participation in the uncreated grace of God. For as St. Irenaeus wrote in his treatise Against Heresies: "It was for this end that the Word of God was made man, and He who was the Son of God became the Son of man, that man, having been taken into the Word, and receiving the adoption, might become the son of God." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Theosis is real in that man becomes a true participant in God's uncreated life and glory (and all of the other divine energies), and so it is not merely a virtual reality. To put it another way, man by grace becomes what God is by nature. The created human person remains in essence a creature, but by participation in God's deifying grace he becomes energetically divine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Click the link below to read through an archived post that contains small collection of texts about the doctrine of theosis: The Doctrine of Theosis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 I was hoping you would get here soon. :proud: You are better at this than I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatholicsAreKewl Posted April 15, 2013 Author Share Posted April 15, 2013 I was hoping you would get here soon. :proud: You are better at this than I am. So Mary is God. We all agree now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 So Mary is God. We all agree now? No. That is heretical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 So Mary is God. We all agree now? Yes, in the sense that Mary - a mere human creature - has been divinized by the graces she received throughout her earthly life, and that she shall continue to grow in her closeness to God as she stretches (epektasis) infinitely into eternity, as is true of all the saints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 No. That is heretical. It is only heretical if one means that Mary is divine by nature. Only the persons of the Holy Trinity are divine by nature (or essence). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 It is only heretical if one means that Mary is divine by nature. Only the persons of the Holy Trinity are divine by nature (or essence). I accept this distinction. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) In the doctrine of the Eastern Church Fathers there are three forms of union within the Godhead: the first form of union is that shared by the persons of the Holy Trinity, who are distinct from each other personally (hypostatically), while being perfectly one in the unity of the divine essence (ousia); the second form of union is what is called the hypostatic union, and this union is experienced only by the second person of the Holy Trinity (i.e., the Son of God made man), who united human nature with His divine hypostasis and became incarnate; and finally, the third form of union within the Godhead is experienced by the saints, that is, by those who emulated Christ in their earthly lives through the power of God's deifying grace, but who will remain for all eternity distinct from God both essentially and hypostatically. This third form of union with the Triune God is achieved by participation in the uncreated divine energies (i.e., the actualized powers of the three divine persons), which make a man into a perfect likeness (homoiousis) of God. Edited April 15, 2013 by Apotheoun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 I smell trolls. C'mon guys, fix your trolldar.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Could be Protestant trolls trying to prove that Catholics worship Mary. :| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Could be Protestant trolls trying to prove that Catholics worship Mary. :| Whatever it is, I have the impression that they aren't interested in legitimate discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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