Women As Deacons?

[brianthephysicist]

http://www.uscatholic.org/church/2011/11/woman-altar-can-church-ordain-women-deacons

 

I'd really like to hear some thoughts on this issue.  From just reading this, it seems highly compelling that we should allow this.  Unfortunately, I do have to admit there is too much that I do not understand about the office of the diaconate, so I would have trouble understanding the nuance of this issue.

 

For the time being, I'm cautiously hopeful.

[Apotheoun]

Women have never been ordained as deacons in the Church, but the Church has ordained women as deaconesses in the past.

[Nihil Obstat]

Women cannot receive orders, ever. The so called deaconesses that existed in the early church were not ordained. So if someone is calling for female deacons today, they mean something quite different, and impossible.

[Nihil Obstat]

Her arguments are very poor. I am on my phone now, but I can post more later tonight.

[Apotheoun]

The following quotation from the article is problematic: 

 

"These are professional women between the ages of 35 and 50 with children, supportive husbands, some of them working in Catholic ministries or locations, and some of them volunteering in their churches, being put forth by their parishes in one case."

 

In the Eastern Churches, which have ordained deaconesses in the past, the only women eligible to enter the order of deaconesses came from the order of virgins (and possibly the order of widows). Moreover, a deaconess was required to live a life of perfect continence after her ordination, and would be deposed if she married.

[OnlySunshine]

It is my understanding that deaconesses were never ordained.  The universal prevalence of baptism by immersion in the nude and the anointing of the whole body which preceded it, rendered it a matter of propriety that in this ceremony the functions of the deacons should be discharged by women when women were being baptized.  While they were given special functions, they were never ordained in a sense like deacons today are.  They could not assist at a Mass or preside over weddings/funerals.

 

"The deaconess gives no blessing, she fulfills no function of priest or deacon." -- (Const. Apost., VIII, 27)

 

Once anointing the entire body went out of practice and women were fully clothed at baptism, deaconesses fell out of use.  There is no need for them now so I don't know why some women feel the need to bring this ancient practice back.

Edited April 12, 2013 by MaterMisericordiae

[Apotheoun]

According to the Byzantine tradition deaconesses received ordination (cheirtonia), but their ministry was not to service at the altar; instead, they were ordained to a ministry of service to women in the Christian community. The only function of a deaconess during the liturgy itself was to maintain order among the women present; while outside of the liturgy they were supposed to assist a priest in baptizing and chrismating adult women, who at the time were baptized naked, or to assist the priest in anointing women who were ill and needed the mystery of unction. The prayers of the baptism, chrismation, or anointing of the sick where chanted by the priest, who alone is the proper minister of those holy mysteries, while the deaconess acted as the priest's hands by performing the ritual act upon the woman receiving the mystery.

[Papist]

This is a good explanation.  

 

http://catholicdefense.blogspot.com/2011/09/can-catholic-church-ordain-female.html

 

[Papist]

Brian, I highly recommend staying away from that website.

[brianthephysicist]

Thanks guys :)

[qfnol31]

Brian, I highly recommend staying away from that website.

I second what Papist said.

http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/reviews/view.cfm?recnum=1521

[Ice_nine]

The only function of a deaconess during the liturgy itself was to maintain order among the women present;

 

What? Like when the women got a little rowdy the deaconess would bring the hammer down? lol

[Quid Est Veritas?]

All of these functions that people are mentioning for ancient "deaconesses" seem as though they are/could be filled by religious sisters with absolutely no conflict of theology or practicality.
And yes, please stay away from that website. That article alone was riddled with innaccuracy and logical fallacies.
If you're interested in questions about Holy Orders and have time to spare, read Paul VI's 1967 encylical Sacerdotalis Caulibatus:
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/paul_vi/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-vi_enc_24061967_sacerdotalis_en.html
It covers everything you ever wanted to know.

[Basilisa Marie]

I once did a paper on orders of deaconesses in the Church.  Basically the question of "ordination" comes down to whether or not the "laying on of hands" happened. They had their own special "commissioning" type rites, but it's unclear at best as to whether or not the laying on of hands happened, so the Church tends to say it didn't.  They were service orders, women going out and serving the poor, widowed (often widows were deaconesses), and the orphaned.  They "maintained order" among the women at mass, but they also had a special role during initiations.  Really early on it used to be that people were baptized naked by full immersion, so baptisms were segregated by sex.  You had deaconesses assisting the baptism of the women, whom were then clothed with the white garment, and then everyone came together to be sealed with oil by the bishop. 

Edited April 12, 2013 by Basilisa Marie

[Basilisa Marie]

According to the Byzantine tradition deaconesses received ordination (cheirtonia), but their ministry was not to service at the altar; instead, they were ordained to a ministry of service to women in the Christian community. The only function of a deaconess during the liturgy itself was to maintain order among the women present; while outside of the liturgy they were supposed to assist a priest in baptizing and chrismating adult women, who at the time were baptized naked, or to assist the priest in anointing women who were ill and needed the mystery of unction. The prayers of the baptism, chrismation, or anointing of the sick where chanted by the priest, who alone is the proper minister of those holy mysteries, while the deaconess acted as the priest's hands by performing the ritual act upon the woman receiving the mystery.

 

Or, ya know, I could have just propped this post.  :)