Catholicism

[Papist]

Again, I will repeat what I said many times. Luke's letter is just a 'story' in a form of historical reality. He made that 'story' about the coming of Christ in order for anyone (us who will read his letter) to see Jesus in the same way they (all God's witnesses like Moses, Abraham, Jonah, Apostle Paul, Luke and ...many others) saw Him through God’s revelation and not through our talent in understanding that ‘story’.

 

Now, this Jesus you are telling is just a Character in that story made by Luke but the real one is when 'God reveal His Christ' to you using that  'story'. That is why I said, there is no historical Jesus because that Jesus is just a character in Luke's story and you will never find him in reality.The real one is ‘beneath’ that story. Your understanding of Luke’s letter is at the ‘outside’ of its story but there is a message in its ‘inside’. Again, there is no coming of Jesus Christ 2000 years ago because that ‘coming’ is just a story and not a reality. The true Jesus Christ comes when God reveal his Christ to you.

 

Now regading ‘documentation’ pertaining to this historical Jesus (your Jesus) outside of written testimony of witnessess or scripture. All of them are fabrication made by your early fathers like letter between King Agbarus of Edessa and Jesus, and Josephus’ letter. Now, if you do not believe me that they are fabrication then, tell me what is that ‘documentation’ you are saying. Let us see it together. Promise I am an open minded person and I will accept your Jesus if I can see them without the hint of being altered or fabricated in comparison with the letter of God’s witnessess themselves.

 

This is your infallible interpretation, yes? Why should I believe you when you tell me that 2,000 year old accepted historical writings are fabrications? What authority do you have over my or the Church's interpretation?

.

.

 

The Roman emperor, Tiberius Caesar, who reigned during Jesus’ ministry, has authors who mention Jesus' existence within 150 years of his life.  These include: Josephus, Tacitus, Suetonius, Seneca, Paterculus, Plutarch, Pliny the Elder, Strabo, Valerius Maximum, and Luke.  Let's remove Luke from the list, since he is a New Testament source. Now, these are secular non-Christian sources.  This means that there are just as many non-Christian sources for Jesus’ existence as there are for Tiberius Caesar’s.  And, to compare, the total number of sources between Jesus and Tiberius Caesar is 42:10. So, there are over four times as many sources for Jesus’ life and deeds than for Tiberius Caesar’s. If Jesus truly did not exist, what do these authors gain?

 

I know. I know. Tiberius Caesar did not exist either.

[Apotheoun]

In what way you want me to prove it to you?

You are the one who says that you saw this non-historical Jesus, who ever that is, and so it is not for me to tell you how to prove you have seen this fictitious Jesus; instead, that is for you to determine. Once you have given your "evidence" I can judge it in order to verify its truthfulness. What evidence do you have?

[KnightofChrist]

I will call your attention.But I will do my best as soon as possible. Sorry I am not that competent to do it now.

Still... what I asked were yes or no questions. If you have really met Christ Jesus the Lord, you would know for certain and clearly if you fell at his feet as if you were dead, if your hair became white, and if you saw His face. Your inability to answer clearly and promptly is evidence that you have not actually met Christ Jesus the Lord and you need time to make up some reyb stuff.

[dairygirl4u2c]

maybe the catholic church needs to revamp its image, to reach out to folks like thread starter. a "catholocism wow" campaign, you could say. and instead of the demanding God hanging from a cross imagery, it could go for a "buddy christ" vibe instead...

[dairygirl4u2c]

maybe the catholic church needs to revamp its image, to reach out to folks like thread starter. a "catholocism wow" campaign, you could say. and instead of the demanding God hanging from a cross imagery, it could go for a "buddy christ" vibe instead...

[dairygirl4u2c]

maybe the catholic church needs to revamp its image, to reach out to folks like thread starter. a "catholocism wow" campaign, you could say. and instead of the demanding God hanging from a cross imagery, it could go for a "buddy christ" vibe instead...

[reyb]

You are the one who says that you saw this non-historical Jesus, who ever that is, and so it is not for me to tell you how to prove you have seen this fictitious Jesus; instead, that is for you to determine. Once you have given your "evidence" I can judge it in order to verify its truthfulness. What evidence do you have?

Jesus is not a man who has a body like us. You will never see Him as if you are 'seeing' your friend beside you. Give me time, my friends. I will do it. Okay?

Edited March 12, 2013 by reyb

[reyb]

Still... what I asked were yes or no questions. If you have really met Christ Jesus the Lord, you would know for certain and clearly if you fell at his feet as if you were dead, if your hair became white, and if you saw His face. Your inability to answer clearly and promptly is evidence that you have not actually met Christ Jesus the Lord and you need time to make up some reyb stuff.

 

I already told you 'when he comes I died and yet I am living'. Do you think it is that easy to impart such thing to others without being misunderstood? That is why I said, it is much better for you to see it yourself and then tell me how can it be 'said' plainly without being ridiculed by others. So, please give me time. 

Edited March 12, 2013 by reyb

[reyb]

This is your infallible interpretation, yes? Why should I believe you when you tell me that 2,000 year old accepted historical writings are fabrications? What authority do you have over my or the Church's interpretation?

.

.

 

The Roman emperor, Tiberius Caesar, who reigned during Jesus’ ministry, has authors who mention Jesus' existence within 150 years of his life.  These include: Josephus, Tacitus, Suetonius, Seneca, Paterculus, Plutarch, Pliny the Elder, Strabo, Valerius Maximum, and Luke.  Let's remove Luke from the list, since he is a New Testament source. Now, these are secular non-Christian sources.  This means that there are just as many non-Christian sources for Jesus’ existence as there are for Tiberius Caesar’s.  And, to compare, the total number of sources between Jesus and Tiberius Caesar is 42:10. So, there are over four times as many sources for Jesus’ life and deeds than for Tiberius Caesar’s. If Jesus truly did not exist, what do these authors gain?

 

I know. I know. Tiberius Caesar did not exist either.

Thank you for your info. By the way, who among them accept Jesus as the Christ of God? Do not tell me all your 'witnesses' are non believer? Anyway, TY again I will search for them in internet.

[reyb]

You are the one who says that you saw this non-historical Jesus, who ever that is, and so it is not for me to tell you how to prove you have seen this fictitious Jesus; instead, that is for you to determine. Once you have given your "evidence" I can judge it in order to verify its truthfulness. What evidence do you have?

My word is my proof. (I will give it to you and I will post it here in phatmass but please later.).

[KnightofChrist]

I already told you 'when he comes I died and yet I am living'. Do you think it is that easy to impart such thing to others without being misunderstood? That is why I said, it is much better for you to see it yourself and then tell me how can it be 'said' plainly without being ridiculed by others. So, please give me time.

I've asked similar questions in the past, and you have I am almost certain stated you would answer, but then in the end you did not.

[dairygirl4u2c]

im surprised so many people particularly so many reputable people keep entertaining reyb's ideas etc. it seems like he'd just be making a bunch of noise, people would ignore him, and he'd eventually just go away. (but then again... ive been ignored and neglected for years here, yet im still around..... jk

[KnightofChrist]

im surprised so many people particularly so many reputable people keep entertaining reyb's ideas etc. it seems like he'd just be making a bunch of noise, people would ignore him, and he'd eventually just go away. (but then again... ive been ignored and neglected for years here, yet im still around..... jk

At least you have more than one topic. Though some are quite odd, lolol.

[reyb]

Knight and all phatmassers,

 

I am now thinking the structure of my letter regarding your concern, so can you please remind me of these unanswered issues you are saying?  What you are asking of me is really not an easy task – proving that I am a witness of Christ.  If my actions and my words are not enough to prove to anyone that I am a witness of Jesus Christ then, there is one thing left for me to do although I am running away from doing it and that is, to testify about my Lord.

 

Testimony of a witness is not done hastily because of its purpose – it must lead them to Christ and it must act as a letter of confirmation to anyone who will eventually saw Him. And that is what you are practically asking of me. It will not give you any good if I just say ‘I saw Him’ or ‘I am a witness’ or ‘I see God in my flesh’ or ‘my body turns into another glorified body which is not mine.’ ...and other things. It will not give you any better with that kind of testimony. So please give me enough time and I will do it. I have to do it because I am now commiting sins against God in not doing it. So, thank you for reminding me, brothers.  

Edited March 13, 2013 by reyb

[havok579257]

simple questions were asked by me reyb and you say you will hold those answers till later.  You really don't want to answer questions do you?    This is probobly why no one really wants to give your posts the time of day anymore.  What's the point if your refuse to answer simple questions and say you will hold them till later.