4588686 Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 You can't help but feel that this tragedy is somehow related to the removal of God in our schools. Yes you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 You can't help but feel that this tragedy is somehow related to the removal of God in our schools. no. God isn't smiting children because schools removed references to God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 Regardless of our beliefs or disbeliefs in God, fundamentally one of the special abilities or traits humans have is empathy. Though empathy, we can identify with and share in the feelings of pain, rage, loss, anger, suffering, desires for revenge, desires for justice, desires for solace, desires for comfort. Regardless of our belief or disbelief that God will comfort or bring peace, we do know that it is our job, as fellow humans or as fellow children of God, to bring that comfort and share that pain in each other's lives. From zealous atheists to zealous theists, developing our ability to be empathetic, is what enables us to be better humans.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
add Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 no. God isn't smiting children because schools removed references to God. This was not an act of God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4588686 Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 This was not an act of God I agree. I'd even say that God was conspicuously absent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 This was not an act of God no poo, really? :rolleyes: thank you, Captain Obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PadrePioOfPietrelcino Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 no. God isn't smiting children because schools removed references to God. I didn't read it as God smiling as the post said related to removing God...Most of our society gets it's education from public schools, many people spend more time in public institutions such as school than with their own families especially when you start adding sports, plays ect. So when God gets removed and instead a cultural. Dvidual relativism starts getting taught it make sense that it is related to the removal of God from school with many of these tragedies whether at a Mall or a School. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 This was not an act of God And the guy who did it wasn't a student. He wasn't some disaffected student treated like government property, thrown into a warehouse that no longer has a ridiculous moment of prayer thrown in with worship of the State. Horrible things happened--including the murder of children in school, while we still had "God in schools". In fact, the rate of violence in school is declining. Individual rejection of God is a problem--State failure to give some grudging reference to God? Hardly. It sounds like the shooter was nuts. Loony. Mental illness exists, and there are people who cannot overcome what the chemicals in their heads tell them to do. I know a lot of prayerful people who have died horribly of hideous diseases, so we couldn't really claim that more prayer would just rid us of the criminally insane. The shooter wasn't a vampire, so I don't think crucifixes on the door would have stopped him. Barring a miracle, he was going to kill people. The prayer of one child (since kids taught to pray are more than capable of accomplishing the task under the watchful eyes of their teachers) would have been heard by God--even without State approval. You think no one prayed? During our years of praying to God and acknowledging God in the US, we had people who owned other people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4588686 Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 And the guy who did it wasn't a student. He wasn't some disaffected student treated like government property, thrown into a warehouse that no longer has a ridiculous moment of prayer thrown in with worship of the State. Horrible things happened--including the murder of children in school, while we still had "God in schools". In fact, the rate of violence in school is declining. Individual rejection of God is a problem--State failure to give some grudging reference to God? Hardly. It sounds like the shooter was nuts. Loony. Mental illness exists, and there are people who cannot overcome what the chemicals in their heads tell them to do. I know a lot of prayerful people who have died horribly of hideous diseases, so we couldn't really claim that more prayer would just rid us of the criminally insane. The shooter wasn't a vampire, so I don't think crucifixes on the door would have stopped him. Barring a miracle, he was going to kill people. The prayer of one child (since kids taught to pray are more than capable of accomplishing the task under the watchful eyes of their teachers) would have been heard by God--even without State approval. You think no one prayed? During our years of praying to God and acknowledging God in the US, we had people who owned other people. Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 (edited) I didn't read it as God smiling as the post said related to removing God...Most of our society gets it's education from public schools, many people spend more time in public institutions such as school than with their own families especially when you start adding sports, plays ect. So when God gets removed and instead a cultural. Dvidual relativism starts getting taught it make sense that it is related to the removal of God from school with many of these tragedies whether at a Mall or a School. you might want to check your spelling. and this: Edited December 17, 2012 by Lil Red Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PadrePioOfPietrelcino Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 Let me try to clarify...I am NOT saying "God did this because we took him out of schools..." What I AM saying is that this is a symptom of civil dysfunction caused by the breaking down of Religion and morals and the insertion of relativism as a new societal religion of sorts. When you tell a person that their opinion is the only thing they can be sure of, that individual opinion is all that matters, that everything must be measurable in order to be real...THEN these things can happen more and more, God did not cause this, but removing God from our societal expressions did help in creating this symptom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 Let me try to clarify...I am NOT saying "God did this because we took him out of schools..." What I AM saying is that this is a symptom of civil dysfunction caused by the breaking down of Religion and morals and the insertion of relativism as a new societal religion of sorts. When you tell a person that their opinion is the only thing they can be sure of, that individual opinion is all that matters, that everything must be measurable in order to be real...THEN these things can happen more and more, God did not cause this, but removing God from our societal expressions did help in creating this symptom. If murder had started only after the State decided to end moments of prayer, you'd have a case. But it didn't. This has always been here, and this instance didn't even involve someone within the school. This is like saying if only the people at the Batman movie had had a little prayer before watching Bane kick Batman's ass up and down Gotham, that the shooter wouldn't have blasted them. Again: Barring a miracle, a prayer would have done nothing. The shooter wouldn't have been in on the prayer. Apart from that, we have prayer in our "societal expressions". All the people who want to pray pray. The government =/= society. I would hazard that those who reference God only when required by the State aren't the most faithful people out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PadrePioOfPietrelcino Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 If murder had started only after the State decided to end moments of prayer, you'd have a case. But it didn't. This has always been here, and this instance didn't even involve someone within the school. This is like saying if only the people at the Batman movie had had a little prayer before watching Bane kick Batman's ass up and down Gotham, that the shooter wouldn't have blasted them. Again: Barring a miracle, a prayer would have done nothing. The shooter wouldn't have been in on the prayer. Apart from that, we have prayer in our "societal expressions". All the people who want to pray pray. The government =/= society. I would hazard that those who reference God only when required by the State aren't the most faithful people out there. I think you are still missing the point I am trying to make, weather or not the shooter came from that particular school is irrelevant. Motive does not matter in a society that teaches individual reletivism and a lack of absolute truth. What ever reason a crazy person can think of is enough to justify an action, and there is not way to tell them differently. When I say we are removing God from our societal expressions I mean true devotion as a community...not moments of prayer in schools...again symptom...The big thing is that by denying the existence of any absolute truth and that measurable matter is all that matters, that the individuals relativistic view is all that matters, then as a culture we push room for God out...leading to an increase of these things...yes bad men have always existed, but there were checks in place which stopped some of this from happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 (edited) I think you are still missing the point I am trying to make, weather or not the shooter came from that particular school is irrelevant. Motive does not matter in a society that teaches individual reletivism and a lack of absolute truth. What ever reason a crazy person can think of is enough to justify an action, and there is not way to tell them differently. When I say we are removing God from our societal expressions I mean true devotion as a community...not moments of prayer in schools...again symptom...The big thing is that by denying the existence of any absolute truth and that measurable matter is all that matters, that the individuals relativistic view is all that matters, then as a culture we push room for God out...leading to an increase of these things...yes bad men have always existed, but there were checks in place which stopped some of this from happening. Irregardless of weather or not the shooter was or wasn't being taut individual reletivism or absolute truth in school or society via sanctioning or dismissing God, the shooter was mentally ill. He wasn't evaluating his actions based on societal norms of behavior, presumably, mental illness precluded that sane step in directing one's actions. Only physical force, not belief, would have been the check to stop him. Edited December 17, 2012 by Anomaly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 Irregardless of weather or not the shooter was or wasn't being taut individual reletivism or absolute truth in school or society via sanctioning or dismissing God, the shooter was mentally ill. He wasn't evaluating his actions based on societal norms of behavior, presumably, mental illness precluded that sane step in directing one's actions. Only physical force, not belief, would have been the check to stop him. Beat me to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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