Did The "pro-life" Movement Permanently Change Because Of Romn

[stevil]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1353179710' post='2511900']
You don't really deny what he said. The more you state the more it's clear you are selfish and indifferent to others so long as it doesn't effect you personally.
[/quote]
Yes, absolutely I am selfish. I take that as a compliment.

I will not impose myself onto others, I will not force them to live my life. I respect that they are in control of their own lives, that they can exercise their own "free will" how they choose as long as it doesn't make society dangerous for me, or endanger myself or my loved ones. People can "sin" to their hearts content, it is not my concern. Not because I am indifferent, but because I know my place.

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='stevil' timestamp='1353180605' post='2511908']

Yes, absolutely I am selfish. I take that as a compliment.

I will not impose myself onto others, I will not force them to live my life. I respect that they are in control of their own lives, that they can exercise their own "free will" how they choose as long as it doesn't make society dangerous for me, or endanger myself or my loved ones. People can "sin" to their hearts content, it is not my concern. Not because I am indifferent, but because I know my place.
[/quote]

Selfish people are detrimental to and the shame of society. They place themselves and their concerns above the welfare of others. As you have well demonstrated.

[stevil]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1353181967' post='2511916']
Selfish people are detrimental to and the shame of society. They place themselves and their concerns above the welfare of others. As you have well demonstrated.
[/quote]
I understand that you have been taught to think this way. I understand you believe what you have said to be absolutely true.

I believe that people whom push their beliefs onto others, whom judge others against their own morality are the cause of oppression, conflict and war.

Edited November 17, 2012 by stevil

[havok579257]

[quote name='stevil' timestamp='1353182870' post='2511927']
I understand that you have been taught to think this way. I understand you believe what you have said to be absolutely true.

I believe that people whom push their beliefs onto others, whom judge others against their own morality are the cause of oppression, conflict and war.
[/quote]


actually taking all religon out of it he is still right. selfish people are a detrement to society. the reason civilized society works is because people are not all like you and selfish.

[stevil]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1353183319' post='2511930']
actually taking all religon out of it he is still right. selfish people are a detrement to society. the reason civilized society works is because people are not all like you and selfish.
[/quote]
This shows very limited forsight.
I can only assume you don't think it through because of your confirmation bias rather than your ability to think.

A selfish person understands that society is extremely important because people must live within this society. Taking care of and influencing society to be one that also takes care of the self is very important.

[KnightofChrist]

Selfishness is naturally opposed to the concerns and welfare of others, ie the community or society.

[stevil]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1353186738' post='2511957']
Selfishness is naturally opposed to the concerns and welfare of others, ie the community or society.
[/quote]
Selfishness is not naturally opposed to anything. Selfishness is the act of looking after one's self.
If you behave well to others then they are more likely to behave well back to you. If you influence a society to be caring and supportive then your society will likely be caring and supporting of you. You could think of it as a non spiritual view of Karma.

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='stevil' timestamp='1353187375' post='2511964']

Selfishness is not naturally opposed to anything. Selfishness is the act of looking after one's self.
If you behave well to others then they are more likely to behave well back to you. If you influence a society to be caring and supportive then your society will likely be caring and supporting of you. You could think of it as a non spiritual view of Karma.
[/quote]

Being selfish is not behaving well to others. It's putting your well being above others well being.

I think you need to remember you don't believe in objective truth. So your understanding of selfishness is no more correct than mine. The same is true for all your opinions in this thread. All you can do is offer your subjective opinion. And may I also say for someone that doesn't want to impose their view on others, and again you don't believe in objective truth, you seem mighty concerned to see that others adopt your point of view or see that you are right.

Anyway your subjective opinions have been noted. But if that's all you have to offer, and it probably is, we are done here.

[stevil]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1353188537' post='2511976']
Being selfish is not behaving well to others. It's putting your well being above others well being.

I think you need to remember you don't believe in objective truth. So your understanding of selfishness is no more correct than mine.
[/quote]
You can assert all that you wish, but if you attempt to live by your definition of selfish, you will find that society rebels against you.
If you steal, people will punish you, if you kill, people will punish you, if you lie, people won't trust you. You will soon find that you have very limited options in life.
To selfishly benefit yourself you need to behave well to others. To benefit yourself you need to live in a supportive society rather than a cut throat one.
But of course I cannot reason with you, your confirmation bias tells you that selfishness is wrong and leads to destructive society, so you choose to see only that with confirms your own beliefs.

[quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1353188537' post='2511976']
And may I also say for someone that doesn't want to impose their view on others, and again you don't believe in objective truth, you seem mighty concerned to see that others adopt your point of view or see that you are right.
[/quote]
I am not telling anyone to vote a particular way, I am not trying to force law or rules, I am merely talking openly about my own philosophy as I am interested in learning about yours and hearing your challenges to mine. It's called open dialogue, where you discuss topics and listen to what others say.

Edited November 17, 2012 by stevil

[KnightofChrist]

More opinion... cool story bro!

[havok579257]

[quote name='stevil' timestamp='1353189474' post='2511985']
You can assert all that you wish, but if you attempt to live by your definition of selfish, you will find that society rebels against you.
If you steal, people will punish you, if you kill, people will punish you, if you lie, people won't trust you. You will soon find that you have very limited options in life.
To selfishly benefit yourself you need to behave well to others. To benefit yourself you need to live in a supportive society rather than a cut throat one.
But of course I cannot reason with you, your confirmation bias tells you that selfishness is wrong and leads to destructive society, so you choose to see only that with confirms your own beliefs.


I am not telling anyone to vote a particular way, I am not trying to force law or rules, I am merely talking openly about my own philosophy as I am interested in learning about yours and hearing your challenges to mine. It's called open dialogue, where you discuss topics and listen to what others say.
[/quote]

well speaking strictly facts and not adding any religion at all your completely wrong on the meaning of selfishness. i don't know where your coming up with your definition but the vast majority of people do not see selfishness in the same way as you do. to be selfish is to care about oneself over all others and not caring what happens to others or how you treat others because you come first and no one else matters. your trying to warp being selfish into caring about society and others is far from what you actually mean.

[Aloysius]

the truly unselfish would put the good of others above good for themselves. ie Spock or Jesus Christ, take your pick. without the willingness to self-sacrifice, all morality is relatively meaningless; when all you're saying is that you're motivated by your own self interest, well you might as well not be human at all, radical self interest is an animal instinct. it is altruism that makes life meaningful and worth living, self-sacrificial love that makes anything worthwhile. without self-sacrificial love, everything is meaningless. it is the foundation on which everything good and decent stands. if you do not love anything enough that you'd be willing to lose your life for it, then you do not truly love anything.

[stevil]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1353199412' post='2512029']
well speaking strictly facts and not adding any religion at all your completely wrong on the meaning of selfishness.
[/quote]
Selfish means doing what is in your own best interests.

Stealing and facing the consequence of either going to prison or being attacked by those you steal from, is not in a person's best interests.

If you put thought into it, i'm sure havok, you can work out what is selfishly in a person's best interests, you will ultimately find that it is in their best interest to support a caring and supportive society with which to live in.

Edited November 18, 2012 by stevil

[havok579257]

[quote name='stevil' timestamp='1353205738' post='2512089']
Selfish means doing what is in your own best interests.

Stealing and facing the consequence of either going to prison or being attacked by those you steal from, is not in a person's best interests.

If you put thought into it, i'm sure havok, you can work out what is selfishly in a person's best interests, you will ultimately find that it is in their best interest to support a caring and supportive society with which to live in.
[/quote]


stealing and murder can be in some ones best interest according to you. you keep harping on the fact about the only reason murder, theft, i guess you could also say rape and pedophilia are bad is because of fear of getting caught. let's be honest here, so many people get away with crime everyday in the world. your all for a man choosing to rape a women or a small child as long as he doesn't get caught. if he can get away with it and it does not personally effect you, you are all for a man being able to choose to rape a woman or a child. also that the only thing that would keep someone from doing this is being caught which does not happen in countries all over the world and if that were to happen your perfectly ok with it if it doesn't effrect you.

like for example your are more than ok with the rebels over in darfur raping women and children and killing children because it doesn't effect you over in america. am i correct in what i am understanding about what your saying?

[stevil]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1353214050' post='2512222']
stealing and murder can be in some ones best interest according to you. you keep harping on the fact about the only reason murder, theft, i guess you could also say rape and pedophilia are bad is because of fear of getting caught.
[/quote]
That's not what I am saying.

A selfish person doesn't do these things through fear of getting caught, yes that is part of the story.

But it doesn't take a genius deep thinker to realise that a selfish person doesn't want other people to steal from them, murder them, rape them. Thus a selfish person wants a society where people don't do these things. Thus we want legal constraints and enforcement. We also understand that our own behavior influences society, the way society reacts to us and the way society behaves in general.

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1353214050' post='2512222']
like for example your are more than ok with the rebels over in darfur raping women and children and killing children because it doesn't effect you over in america. am i correct in what i am understanding about what your saying?
[/quote]
I don't live in America. I do not support USA interferring in other nations affairs.