Jesuits Getting Dissed

[Mickey's_Girl]

I have a question for you. It seems like half the time someone on this board finds a supposedly "Catholic" entity misbehaving according to Church teachings, and decides to complain about it on, say, the Open Mic thread, someone else goes, "They're Jesuit, of course" and everyone seems to nod and say, "Oh yes, that explains it" and rolls their eyes.

What gives? All I know about the Jesuits is that they're very well-educated and have a lot of colleges. Is the whole group of them renegade, like the SSPX (or whatever that's called--the ones who think JPII isn't the real Pope)?

(I put this question on this board so I wouldn't get bombarded with cranky messages about the Jesuits. )

MG

[Guest AloysiusGhost]

i think it's because there's a lotta heterodox/liberal Jesuits out there, and they tend to represent the order bad.

but there are some good ones. Fr. Mitch Pacqwa, for example.

[Crusader_4]

Since this thread is about Jesuits (those who kno me kno my opinnon) The Jesuit Mystique is rather interesting. They were peresecuted for political reasons during the 1700's and since then there i think has been some mistrust about the order. They were really the missionaries that defined the Catholic missions throughout the world. It was St. Francis Xavier one of the first Jesuits who in was the first missionary to spread the gospel to the reaches of the world since Paul. At any rate the Jesuits were really the Catholic Missionaries of the New World. However their status among the Church rose and since they ran very many schools throughout Europe they began to have great infleunce on the populace and infleunce of national interests. As a result the Monarchs of Europe sought out to limit their power and pressured the Papacy for the abolishment of the Order. An Example of this was the Jesuit Republics in South America. The Jesuits established a republic style state in South America where the aborignal people were treated equal and Churches were errected as well as industry established even a small force was buitl to protect the aboriginals. However the Portugeese slave trade was upset about this and forced the Church to recall these missions (they also thought that the missions were run by secret gold because of how successful they were). However in modern times after the Re-establishment of the order circa 1800 something not qutie sure on the date off the top of my head they went back to the schools and teaching the which is a trademark of the Jesuits. The Jesuit life is really based upon the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius as well. At any rate a Jesuit tends to be very well educated however the order gives the individuals in some sense quite a lot of freedom to chose a profession to do...(a great number are teachers) as a result of this freedom I believe that many of the weaker Jesuits are opened to corruption. However as a whole the Jesuits still remain the largest Catholic order in the World. Also i dont want to walk into contreversy but from my understanding the American Jesuits are not quite on the same par as the rest of the Jesuits in the world who are really rewknown as running some of the best High Schools and Colleges throughout the world especially for Catholics in the Third World Nations. It tends only that the Jesuits in the states are talked poorly about which gets me to wonder if it is really more of a provincial problem rather then a society one. I know for example, in Canada the Jesuits where they work are held with very HIGH esteem since they brought Christianity to Canada first with saints such as St. Jean Brebeuf and St. Joseph Longue. But to answer the question quickly they are indeed in nature a very orthodox religious order with approval from Rome and continue to do great work throughout the world. However in modern times there have been some problems with specific individuals that have painted a black pictuer on the Jesuits in particularly in the American Province these are a few black sheep though and i find the people that say the Jesuits are bad are kind of like the People that say the Church is awful because we have had a few bad popes. One needs to look at things in general there is also reason why they are the worlds largest religious order.

[rachael]

wowie.

thanks Crusader_4.

[Ellenita]

Good response Crusader_4!

I think you are right, there were some individuals who appeared to become 'liberal' or heterodox, in [i]their[/i] interpretation of the changes which Vatican II bought about - no doubt there is evidence of individuals in a number of different orders who responded in this way. I think it's important not to underestimate the influence of secular society during this period of time too, so we see the rise of liberal politics, secular feminism etc aswell, a supposedly more 'inclusive' attitude which may have led to individuals promoting a 'watered down' version of church doctrine! There also undoubtedly would have been misinformation or deliberate disinformation spread about the order by secular authorities in the past who perceived that they had some influence over power because of their position in education. Personally I think the order did much in the past to ensure that the faith remained alive in Europe which was becoming increasingly hostile towards Catholicism, and I am grateful to the order for that!

Incidently I don't personally know any Jesuits so this is only my general perspective about the order - it's Dominicans who appear to have had direct impact in my life......and a rather special Franciscan (you know who you are! :wub: )

Edited May 22, 2004 by Ellenita

[Crusader_4]

Yea i know what you mean Ellentia i think that the rise of secularism has hijacked peoples views of Vatican II. Actually its kind of funny i was really converted by the Jesuits and a Jesuit priest who worked with Mother Teresea was my sponsor.

[PedroX]

Part of the bad rap for Jesuits comes from a few rogue members in Central/South America who got really caught up in Liberation Theology. Some even actively participated in revolutions. However, many are very Godly men, such as Avery Cardinal Dulles.

Also, SSPX does not deny that JPII is the Pope, they just have very differing views on theology and liturgy.

peace...

[Ellenita]

It breaks my heart that some priests involved with Liberation Theology went so far to the extreme and that the theology appears to have developed links with marxist thought. I'm sure that when it first began the basic premise of it was to challenge the very great injustices that were being done to the people (and often the indigenous communities) by some very far right and corrupt governments in Latin America........

[Crusader_4]

I know a Jesuit who i am very close with who in fact helped students in the Phillipines before the revolution. He would organize them and help them protest and such. They formed CLC (Christian Life Communities) which still exist and ppl can be part of today (if u want info pm me) and would unite in prayer and protest and speak out against the Government becasue of the grave injustices it was doing i.e. buldozing villages with people in the houses and such. It was rather interesting also doing this sort of activity in a Christ Like manner. He also was in Africa before Apartheid ended as well doing work there. Also Oscar Romero was very heavily infleunced by the Jesuits in South America when he was Bishop.