Not Voting Because You're Displeased With Candidates

[Basilisa Marie]

I'm voting third party because I can't bring myself to vote for Romney. I'm a resident of a blue state (Washington), with all of its electoral votes going to the majority winner, so there's no point in me voting for Romney even if I could stomach it. I feel that voting third party is better than not voting at all, because it's something concrete (albeit small) that shows that some people are dissatisfied with the two-party system.

Plus once the cases brought by Catholic organizations against the HHS mandate "exception" get to the Supreme Court, they'll rule in our favor. The Court has a strong history of voting unanimously in favor of a liberal interpretation of the first amendment. In their eyes, religions do what they want, yo, no matter what the haters say.

[Aloysius]

too much to go through everything in CMom's post, but I'll say this: most of the things referenced in CMom's post are empty symbolic things that really hold little to no importance to me and I don't think they should affect the way you vote at all, and quite a few of them have turned out to be exaggerations out of empty gestures--more like perceived slights. for example: Obama didn't mention God in one of his four thanksgiving addresses as president so far. George W. Bush didn't mention God in one of his eight thanksgiving addresses, and no one made a fuss about that. You can fiddler out most of the points in CMom's post to be nothing more than that: perceived slights blown out of proportion.

pulling out the actual substantial things Obama has done, one finds that Romney is either only very slightly better, or not better at all on them--for example, there's conscience exemptions, which Obama's definitely got a bad record on. Romney has a [i]slightly[/i] better record on that in that in a very particular conscience exemption case, he did fight for conscience exemptions; but in some of the main conscience scenarios we're now facing like insurance mandates for contraceptives/sterilizations/abortificients, Romney's record is just as bad as Obama's in that he consistently reinforced such mandates as a governor; moreover, his recent statements indicate he will likely leave the HHS mandate in place as precedent the same way he left similar mandates in place as Governor (because as he said, he doesn't think employers should affect ease of access to contraceptives through their insurance plans)

But yeah, all of those perceived symbolic slights tend to be the kind of media-generated distractions that we should ignore if we want to be taken seriously as people of faith in the public sphere.

[PhuturePriest]

cmotherofpirl, I agree with you that Obama is running on a platform of evil beliefs and an evil record. However, even without him, society as a whole is anti-Christian and hates us anyway, Catholics in particular. Society does everything it can to belittle us, take away our rights, and do anything it can to intolerantly attack us in the name of tolerance and relativism. Obama is simply a sign of where society is right now. He's not the sole source of our issues, he is simply part of the relativist society, which is gigantic and claims many Catholics that supposedly follow the faith. Even if he is not reelected that does not solve our problems.

Edited October 26, 2012 by FuturePriest387

[sixpence]

[qfnol31]

[quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1351289428' post='2498180']
cmotherofpirl, I agree with you that Obama is running on a platform of evil beliefs and an evil record. However, even without him, society as a whole is anti-Christian and hates us anyway, Catholics in particular. Society does everything it can to belittle us, take away our rights, and do anything it can to intolerantly attack us in the name of tolerance and relativism. Obama is simply a sign of where society is right now. He's not the sole source of our issues, he is simply part of the relativist society, which is gigantic and claims many Catholics that supposedly follow the faith. Even if he is not reelected that does not solve our problems.
[/quote]
Don't underestimate the power of his rhetoric. People who were more open to Catholicism five years ago are now more hateful than ever towards Catholics. Regardless of our wishes for the presidency, he still wields quite a bit of sway.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Aloysius' timestamp='1351281836' post='2498076']


But yeah, all of those perceived symbolic slights tend to be the kind of media-generated distractions that we should ignore if we want to be taken seriously as people of faith in the public sphere.
[/quote]


Right... and how is that working for us?

[Aloysius]

not very well, everyone keeps falling for the distractions

[4588686]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' timestamp='1351269614' post='2497981']

[color=#000000][font=verdana][size=3][b][u]1. Acts of hostility toward people of Biblical faith:[/u][/b][/size][/font][/color][list]
[*]April 2008 – Obama speaks disrespectfully of Christians, saying they “cling to guns or religion” and have an “antipathy to people who aren't like them.” [url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN1"][sup][size=1]1[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN1"]February 2009 – Obama announces plans to revoke conscience protection for health workers who refuse to participate in medical activities that go against their beliefs, and fully implements the plan in February 2011.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN2"][sup][size=1]2[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN2"]April 2009 – When speaking at Georgetown University, Obama orders that a monogram symbolizing Jesus' name be covered when he is making his speech.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN3"][sup][size=1]3[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN3"]May 2009 – Obama declines to host services for the National Prayer Day (a day established by federal law) at the White House.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN4"][sup][size=1]4[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN4"]April 2009 – In a deliberate act of disrespect, Obama nominated three pro-abortion ambassadors to the Vatican; of course, the pro-life Vatican rejected all three.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN5"][sup][size=1]5[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN5"]October 19, 2010 – Obama begins deliberately omitting the phrase about “the Creator” when quoting the Declaration of Independence – an omission he has made on no less than seven occasions.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN6"][sup][size=1]6[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN6"]November 2010 – Obama misquotes the National Motto, saying it is “E pluribus unum” rather than “In God We Trust” as established by federal law.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN7"][sup][size=1]7[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN7"]January 2011 – After a federal law was passed to transfer a WWI Memorial in the Mojave Desert to private ownership, the U. S. Supreme Court ruled that the cross in the memorial could continue to stand, but the Obama administration refused to allow the land to be transferred as required by law, and refused to allow the cross to be re-erected as ordered by the Court.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN8"][sup][size=1]8[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN8"]February 2011 – Although he filled posts in the State Department, for more than two years Obama did not fill the post of religious freedom ambassador, an official that works against religious persecution across the world; he filled it only after heavy pressure from the public and from Congress.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN9"][sup][size=1]9[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN9"]April 2011 – For the first time in American history, Obama urges passage of a non-discrimination law that does not contain hiring protections for religious groups, forcing religious organizations to hire according to federal mandates without regard to the dictates of their own faith, thus eliminating conscience protection in hiring.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN10"][sup][size=1]10[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN10"]August 2011 – The Obama administration releases its new health care rules that override religious conscience protections for medical workers in the areas of abortion and contraception.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN11"][sup][size=1]11[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN11"]November 2011 – Obama opposes inclusion of President Franklin Roosevelt’s famous D-Day Prayer in the WWII Memorial.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN12"][sup][size=1]12[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN12"]November 2011 – Unlike previous presidents, Obama studiously avoids any religious references in his Thanksgiving speech.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN13"][sup][size=1]13[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN13"]December 2011 – The Obama administration denigrates other countries' religious beliefs as an obstacle to radical homosexual rights.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN14"][sup][size=1]14[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN14"]January 2012 – The Obama administration argues that the First Amendment provides no protection for churches and synagogues in hiring their pastors and rabbis.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN15"][sup][size=1]15[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN15"]February 2012 – The Obama administration forgives student loans in exchange for public service, but announces it will no longer forgive student loans if the public service is related to religion.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN16"][sup][size=1]16[/size][/sup][/url]
[/list]
[url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN16"][color=#000000][font=verdana][size=3][u][b]2. Acts of hostility from the Obama-led military toward people of Biblical faith:[/b][/u][/size][/font][/color][/url][list]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN16"]June 2011 – The Department of Veterans Affairs forbids references to God and Jesus during burial ceremonies at Houston National Cemetery. [/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN17"][sup][size=1]17[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN17"]August 2011 – The Air Force stops teaching the Just War theory to officers in California because the course is taught by chaplains and is based on a philosophy introduced by St. Augustine in the third century AD – a theory long taught by civilized nations across the world (except America).[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN18"][sup][size=1]18[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN18"]September 2011 – Air Force Chief of Staff prohibits commanders from notifying airmen of programs and services available to them from chaplains.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN19"][sup][size=1]19[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN19"]September 2011 – The Army issues guidelines for Walter Reed Medical Center stipulating that “No religious items (i.e. Bibles, reading materials and/or facts) are allowed to be given away or used during a visit.”[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN20"][sup][size=1]20[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN20"]November 2011 – The Air Force Academy rescinds support for Operation Christmas Child, a program to send holiday gifts to impoverished children across the world, because the program is run by a Christian charity.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN21"][sup][size=1]21[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN21"]November 2011 – The Air Force Academy pays $80,000 to add a Stonehenge-like worship center for pagans, druids, witches and Wiccans.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN22"][sup][size=1]22[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN22"]February 2012 – The U. S. Military Academy at West Point disinvites three star Army general and decorated war hero Lieutenant General William G. (“Jerry”) Boykin (retired) from speaking at an event because he is an outspoken Christian.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN23"][sup][size=1]23[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN23"]February 2012 – The Air Force removes “God” from the patch of Rapid Capabilities Office (the word on the patch was in Latin: Dei).[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN24"][sup][size=1]24[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN24"]February 2012 – The Army orders Catholic chaplains not to read a letter to parishioners that their archbishop asked them to read.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN25"][sup][size=1]25[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN25"]April 2012 – A checklist for Air Force Inns will no longer include ensuring that a Bible is available in rooms for those who want to use them.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN26"][sup][size=1]26[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN26"]May 2012 - The Obama administration opposes legislation to protect the rights of conscience for military chaplains who do not wish to perform same-sex marriages in violation of their strongly-held religious beliefs.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN27"][sup][size=1]27[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN27"]June 2012 - Bibles for the American military have been printed in every conflict since the American Revolution, but the Obama Administration revokes the long-standing U. S. policy of allowing military service emblems to be placed on those military Bibles.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN28"][sup][size=1]28[/size][/sup][/url]
[/list]
[url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN28"][color=#000000][font=verdana][size=3][b][u]3. Acts of hostility toward Biblical values:[/u][/b][/size][/font][/color][/url][list]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN28"]January 2009 – Obama lifts restrictions on U.S. government funding for groups that provide abortion services or counseling abroad, forcing taxpayers to fund pro-abortion groups that either promote or perform abortions in other nations. [/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN29"][sup][size=1]29[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN29"]January 2009 – President Obama’s nominee for deputy secretary of state asserts that American taxpayers are required to pay for abortions and that limits on abortion funding are unconstitutional.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN30"][sup][size=1]30[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN30"]March 2009 – The Obama administration shut out pro-life groups from attending a White House-sponsored health care summit.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN31"][sup][size=1]31[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN31"]March 2009 – Obama orders taxpayer funding of embryonic stem cell research.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN32"][sup][size=1]32[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN32"]March 2009 – Obama gave $50 million for the UNFPA, the UN population agency that promotes abortion and works closely with Chinese population control officials who use forced abortions and involuntary sterilizations.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN33"][sup][size=1]33[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN33"]May 2009 – The White House budget eliminates all funding for abstinence-only education and replaces it with “comprehensive” sexual education, repeatedly proven to increase teen pregnancies and abortions.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN34"][sup][size=1]34[/size][/sup] He continues the deletion in subsequent budgets.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN35"][sup][size=1]35[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN35"]May 2009 – Obama officials assemble a terrorism dictionary calling pro-life advocates violent and charging that they use racism in their “criminal” activities.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN36"][sup][size=1]36[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN36"]July 2009 – The Obama administration illegally extends federal benefits to same-sex partners of Foreign Service and Executive Branch employees, in direction violation of the federal Defense of Marriage Act.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN37"][sup][size=1]37[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN37"]September 16, 2009 – The Obama administration appoints as EEOC Commissioner Chai Feldblum, who asserts that society should “not tolerate” any “private beliefs,” including religious beliefs, if they may negatively affect homosexual “equality.”[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN38"][sup][size=1]38[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN38"]July 2010 – The Obama administration uses federal funds in violation of federal law to get Kenya to change its constitution to include abortion.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN39"][sup][size=1]39[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN39"]August 2010 – The Obama administration Cuts funding for 176 abstinence education programs.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN40"][sup][size=1]40[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN40"]September 2010 – The Obama administration tells researchers to ignore a judge’s decision striking down federal funding for embryonic stem cell research.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN41"][sup][size=1]41[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN41"]February 2011 – Obama directs the Justice Department to stop defending the federal Defense of Marriage Act.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN42"][sup][size=1]42[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN42"]March 2011 – The Obama administration refuses to investigate videos showing Planned Parenthood helping alleged sex traffickers get abortions for victimized underage girls.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN43"][sup][size=1]43[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN43"]July 2011 – Obama allows homosexuals to serve openly in the military, reversing a policy originally instituted by George Washington in March 1778.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN44"][sup][size=1]44[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN44"]September 2011 – The Pentagon directs that military chaplains may perform same-sex marriages at military facilities in violation of the federal Defense of Marriage Act.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN45"][sup][size=1]45[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN45"]October 2011 – The Obama administration eliminates federal grants to the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops for their extensive programs that aid victims of human trafficking because the Catholic Church is anti-abortion.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN46"][sup][size=1]46[/size][/sup][/url]
[/list]
[url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN46"][color=#000000][font=verdana][size=3][b][u]4. Acts of preferentialism for Islam:[/u][/b][/size][/font][/color][/url][list]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN46"]May 2009 – While Obama does not host any National Day of Prayer event at the White House, he does host White House Iftar dinners in honor of Ramadan. [/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN47"][sup][size=1]47[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN47"]April 2010 – Christian leader Franklin Graham is disinvited from the Pentagon’s National Day of Prayer Event because of complaints from the Muslim community.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN48"][sup][size=1]48[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN48"]April 2010 – The Obama administration requires rewriting of government documents and a change in administration vocabulary to remove terms that are deemed offensive to Muslims, including jihad, jihadists, terrorists, radical Islamic, etc.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN49"][sup][size=1]49[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN49"]August 2010 – Obama speaks with great praise of Islam and condescendingly of Christianity.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN50"][sup][size=1]50[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN50"]August 2010 – Obama went to great lengths to speak out on multiple occasions on behalf of building an Islamic mosque at Ground Zero, while at the same time he was silent about a Christian church being denied permission to rebuild at that location.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN51"][sup][size=1]51[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN51"]2010 – While every White House traditionally issues hundreds of official proclamations and statements on numerous occasions, this White House avoids traditional Biblical holidays and events but regularly recognizes major Muslim holidays, as evidenced by its 2010 statements on Ramadan, Eid-ul-Fitr, Hajj, and Eid-ul-Adha.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN52"][sup][size=1]52[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN52"]October 2011 – Obama’s Muslim advisers block Middle Eastern Christians’ access to the White House.[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN53"][sup][size=1]53[/size][/sup][/url]
[*][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN53"]February 2012 – The Obama administration makes effulgent apologies for Korans being burned by the U. S. military,[/url][url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN54"][sup][size=1]54[/size][/sup] but when Bibles were burned by the military, numerous reasons were offered why it was the right thing to do.[/url][sup][size=1]<a href="[url="http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=106938#FN55"]http://www.wallbuild...id=106938#FN55"[/url] style="color: rgb(153, 0, 0); ">5[/size][/sup]
[*]
[*]
[*]
[*][size=4]But yeah lets vote 3rd party because Obama needs 4 more years to attack Christians....[/size]
[/list]
[/quote]


You live in an interesting world.




Still demanding to see Obama's birth certificate?

[havok579257]

[quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1351289428' post='2498180']
cmotherofpirl, I agree with you that Obama is running on a platform of evil beliefs and an evil record. However, even without him, society as a whole is anti-Christian and hates us anyway, Catholics in particular. Society does everything it can to belittle us, take away our rights, and do anything it can to intolerantly attack us in the name of tolerance and relativism. Obama is simply a sign of where society is right now. He's not the sole source of our issues, he is simply part of the relativist society, which is gigantic and claims many Catholics that supposedly follow the faith. Even if he is not reelected that does not solve our problems.
[/quote]

so give up and let him be reelected?

[Ash Wednesday]

If someone chooses not to vote for WHATEVER reason, then I really don't want to hear their complaining if they aren't happy with the state of the country. Not voting takes away someone's credibility with regards to voicing public opinion. I had a liberal friend that picked on me and complained because I voted for Bush, while she for whatever reason didn't manage to vote because she had moved to another state, though really she could have still sorted that out. I wanted to slap her in the face.

If it's frustration with regards to the two party system, I'd rather see someone vote for an obscure 3rd, 4th or 34882489205th party candidate than not vote if they want to have any opinion at all, surely they could find someone remotely suitable.

Edited October 27, 2012 by Ash Wednesday

[Ash Wednesday]

[quote name='Basilisa Marie' timestamp='1351279162' post='2498041']
I'm voting third party because I can't bring myself to vote for Romney. I'm a resident of a blue state (Washington), with all of its electoral votes going to the majority winner, so there's no point in me voting for Romney even if I could stomach it. I feel that voting third party is better than not voting at all, because it's something concrete (albeit small) that shows that some people are dissatisfied with the two-party system.

Plus once the cases brought by Catholic organizations against the HHS mandate "exception" get to the Supreme Court, they'll rule in our favor. The Court has a strong history of voting unanimously in favor of a liberal interpretation of the first amendment. In their eyes, religions do what they want, yo, no matter what the haters say.
[/quote]

In the past I've held the same position about voting 3rd party and share the same frustrations voting as a WA state resident, only I'm voting absentee from overseas. This election in particular I've decided to vote for Romney/Ryan though. I personally do not expect radical changes on things like abortion from Romney, but I do think he will be more favorable towards some causes on the conservative end than Obama would be. Popular vote doesn't really mean squat but people do pay attention to it, and I do think it does help a candidate earn a certain amount of capita so I'm willing to contribute to that, as I would rather not hear people howling about it like they did in 2000 with Bush and Gore.

So this election, that is where I'm at. And in the end, yes, voting 3rd party is still better than not voting at all. In many respects, the 2 party system needs radical changes so I share that sympathy for people that don't want a continuation of that. I really do wish we weren't so locked up in the current system we have as Americans. At the moment I'm just not sure what can and needs to be done to get out of that.

Edited October 27, 2012 by Ash Wednesday

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' timestamp='1351332616' post='2498485']
If someone chooses not to vote for WHATEVER reason, then I really don't want to hear their complaining if they aren't happy with the state of the country. Not voting takes away someone's credibility with regards to voicing public opinion.[/quote]

Disagree.

[Winchester]

That's like saying if you don't participate in a burglary, then you really can't complain about way the burglary was executed.

The premise behind the notion that those who don't vote can't complain is that A and B have a right to force C into an agreement he does not wish to be a party to. There is no social contract.

[MIKolbe]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' timestamp='1351332616' post='2498485']
If someone chooses not to vote for WHATEVER reason, then I really don't want to hear their complaining if they aren't happy with the state of the country. Not voting takes away someone's credibility with regards to voicing public opinion. I had a liberal friend that picked on me and complained because I voted for Bush, while she for whatever reason didn't manage to vote because she had moved to another state, though really she could have still sorted that out. I wanted to slap her in the face.

If it's frustration with regards to the two party system, I'd rather see someone vote for an obscure 3rd, 4th or 34882489205th party candidate than not vote if they want to have any opinion at all, surely they could find someone remotely suitable.
[/quote]

I can agree if you can cast your vote and don't, your creditibilty is compromised. I think there is an important caveat to this, however. If, by virtue of your informed conscience, you cannot vote for any candidate; i would posit that would still be a vote.almost like a conscientious objection vote..lol. If, as well, you are one of those 'anarchist-there's-violence-inherent-to-the-system type' and you refuse to vote on some odd principle; though I may not fully understand it; I could conceivably call that a vote as well.

In the case of your friend, though; who seemed to be too lazy; yeah.. i totally agree with you.

[Winchester]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agorism