Freedom Posted October 24, 2012 Author Share Posted October 24, 2012 The Catholic church itself puts the mother's life and health as a priority over the baby's. So Romney is on the right side one more time. Besides that, killing a baby is a crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 "health-of-the-mother" exception is code-word for pro-choice, because the mother's "health" is always stressed in any pregnancy, both physical or mental health are usually included in such exemptions; it justifies 99% of abortions. everywhere in the world where there is such an exception it's basically 99% pro-choice. there's a reason the spokespeople had to try to clean up after that, because pro-life organizations everywhere understand quite clearly that health-of-the-mother is a code word for pro-choice. "life of the mother" is a whole other story and refers to cases where the mother's life is in jeopardy, which is a much more difficult issue. Mitt specifically included "health of the mother" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qfnol31 Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 [quote name='Aloysius' timestamp='1351123316' post='2497212'] "health-of-the-mother" exception is code-word for pro-choice, because the mother's "health" is always stressed in any pregnancy, both physical or mental health are usually included in such exemptions; it justifies 99% of abortions. everywhere in the world where there is such an exception it's basically 99% pro-choice. there's a reason the spokespeople had to try to clean up after that, because pro-life organizations everywhere understand quite clearly that health-of-the-mother is a code word for pro-choice. "life of the mother" is a whole other story and refers to cases where the mother's life is in jeopardy, which is a much more difficult issue. Mitt specifically included "health of the mother" [/quote] On this point I know Al and I are in complete agreement. The senate race in Indiana proves how Mitt isn't in sync with many of us on this particular issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freedom Posted October 25, 2012 Author Share Posted October 25, 2012 [quote name='Aloysius' timestamp='1351123316' post='2497212'] "health-of-the-mother" exception is code-word for pro-choice, because the mother's "health" is always stressed in any pregnancy, both physical or mental health are usually included in such exemptions; it justifies 99% of abortions. everywhere in the world where there is such an exception it's basically 99% pro-choice. there's a reason the spokespeople had to try to clean up after that, because pro-life organizations everywhere understand quite clearly that health-of-the-mother is a code word for pro-choice. "life of the mother" is a whole other story and refers to cases where the mother's life is in jeopardy, which is a much more difficult issue. Mitt specifically included "health of the mother" [/quote] It's up to the mother's doctor to prescribe an abortion to save her life, not the government's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 saving the mother's life is a whole other story. morally, the Church allows for various indirect procedures that may result in the death of the child to save the life of the mother, it is a difficult situation and if the government allows direct abortion in only those cases (without making the distinction for indirect abortion that's required by Catholic morality) that's not as big of an issue to me from the standpoint of government policy. but the LIFE of the mother is different than the HEALTH of the mother. the HEALTH of the mother is a broad term that is used to justify abortion to avoid the physical strain that pregnancy always brings, and even includes a broad stroke for the "mental" health of a woman; so basically anyone who does not want a child can abort. this is not theoretical, these types of exemptions exist in other countries in the world; and that's the type of exemption it is in practice--an exemption that applies to everyone. and Governor Romney knows full well that this is what the "health-of-the-mother" exemption means. sigh... I thought I said I was leaving lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qfnol31 Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) [url="http://johnpaulbioethics.org/FinalProofs.pdf"]http://johnpaulbioet...FinalProofs.pdf[/url] This speaks about the difference between salpingectomy and salpingostomy referenced by Al above. It's a recent issue in moral theology and one worth understanding if we get into the debate of saving the mother's life. I highly recommend the entire article. Edited October 25, 2012 by qfnol31 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351120669' post='2497185'] Then accept being called a liberal & be happy with it, instead of attacking me. [/quote] the only one i see attacking is you. if you have a coherent argument, then other people (not me) would probably like to hear it, instead of posting idiotic nonsense like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351120372' post='2497177'] If someone is working, doing anything, certainly would not have the time to always be here and spend hours yacking. [/quote] You think it takes hours to deal with your simple tripe? Kid, you don't make a pimple on Anomaly's ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groo the Wanderer Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) i want to go cry now. it is so disheartening to see so many professed Catholics unable to see the forest for the trees. so many unwilling to swallow their pride and do the right thing. yeah politics is dirty. yeah romney smells of elderberries. but he's the best choice we have. wake up peeps. a third party choice is not a viable choice...not this time. smell of elderberries it up and get the murdering bastard out of the white house. then immediately start laying the grass-roots framework to build up a true pro-life candidate to run against romney in 4 years. right now, we just have to settle for what is better, even if that better is just a tiny bit better. God help us Edited October 25, 2012 by Groo the Wanderer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 You just keep saying the same stuff over and over again. We have responded to this argument in a dozen different forms already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 [quote name='Groo the Wanderer' timestamp='1351130833' post='2497313'] i want to go cry now. it is so disheartening to see so many professed Catholics unable to see the forest for the trees. so many unwilling to swallow their pride and do the right thing. yeah politics is dirty. yeah romney smells of elderberries. but he's the best choice we have. wake up peeps. a third party choice is not a viable choice...not this time. smell of elderberries it up and get the murdering bastard out of the white house.[b] then immediately start laying the grass-roots framework to build up a true pro-life candidate to run against romney in 4 years.[/b] [/quote] and that's what everyone said 4 years ago, and had great momentum and then we still got stuck with someone like romney. and you still haven't answered how romney is better, when aloysius has detailed the problems with him. also: i saw before you edited. real classy, Groo, real flooping classy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG45 Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 [quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1351131295' post='2497321'] and that's what everyone said 4 years ago, and had great momentum and then we still got stuck with someone like romney. and you still haven't answered how romney is better, when aloysius has detailed the problems with him. also: i saw before you edited. real classy, Groo, real flooping classy. [/quote] I didn't see pre-edit, but I contend there are only a few people on PM who can stay classy in the Debate Table. I do not count myself among them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Non serviam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 [quote name='Groo the Wanderer' timestamp='1351130833' post='2497313'] smell of elderberries it up and get the murdering bastard out of the white house. then immediately start laying the grass-roots framework to build up a true pro-life candidate to run against romney in 4 years. [/quote] I will fix this: smell of elderberries it up and replace one murdering bastage with another murdering bastage, then complain for the next four years that all of our politicians are murdering bastages, while desperately doing mental gymnastics trying to defend [i]our[/i] mudering bastage as being slightly less murderous than [i]their[/i] murdering bastage. Rinse and flooping repeat. It is absolutely vile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 [quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1351130476' post='2497309'] You think it takes hours to deal with your simple tripe? Kid, you don't make a pimple on Anomaly's ass. [/quote]WAT I go and let my kid's boyfriend buy me beer at WOB and come back and see Winnie pointing out my posterior imperfections. Answer the question, Claire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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