Mark of the Cross Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Mark of the Cross' timestamp='1349650607' post='2491027'] Even though the Catholic church extensively uses pirated software and music in third world countries and must know that it does. My conscience still brought me to confession that I had been a party to that. The only thing my conscience doesn't tell me is if the benefits outweigh the acceptance of the sinful action. [/quote] [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1349668368' post='2491111'] There is a legitimate debate to be had as to whether or not using 'pirated' software or music constitutes theft in a moral sense. [/quote] Discussions please. Edited October 9, 2012 by Mark of the Cross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 I did not say I [i]wanted[/i] to have that debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark of the Cross Posted October 9, 2012 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1349741631' post='2491416'] I did not say I [i]wanted[/i] to have that debate. [/quote] Sorry shall I delete it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Lol, I am just joking with you. Seriously though, all I am willing to do at this point is prooftext and slowly back out of the room. If you want I will post two good sources that I read a year or two ago, and have re-read once or twice since then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark of the Cross Posted October 9, 2012 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1349742536' post='2491420'] Lol, I am just joking with you. Seriously though, all I am willing to do at this point is prooftext and slowly back out of the room. If you want I will post two good sources that I read a year or two ago, and have re-read once or twice since then. [/quote] Troll! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark of the Cross Posted October 9, 2012 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1349742536' post='2491420'] Lol, I am just joking with you. Seriously though, all I am willing to do at this point is prooftext and slowly back out of the room. If you want I will post two good sources that I read a year or two ago, and have re-read once or twice since then. [/quote] Yes please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Both of these links direct to pdf files: [url="http://www.dklevine.com/papers/imbookfinalall.pdf"]Against Intellectual Monopoly, Boldrin and Levine[/url] [url="http://mises.org/journals/jls/15_2/15_2_1.pdf"]Against Intellectual Property, Stephan Kinsella[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 [url="http://www.catholicity.com/commentary/tucker/05372.html"]Jeffrey Tucker on the Church and its use of copyright.[/url] [url="http://archive.mises.org/9344/the-book-and-music-killers/"]Jeffrey Tucker on copyright and books and music.[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basilisa Marie Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Well...I don't think I could make the argument that using any kind of pirated anything is completely moral, but I would venture to say that it'd be worse to pirate the music (or whatever) from a small group than a large corporation. A band like Coldplay makes most of its money from concerts and merchandise, so pirating one of their CDs doesn't result in much damage. Pirating a new local indie band's CD results in more damage, because they make much more of their money from music sales and not concerts and the like. But I've also found that people who pirate music and software are much more likely to purchase the product from bands or companies that they like, because they want to support them. And I support the idea of copyright in general, because that's one of the only ways that new artists of all kinds can keep a claim on their work and make some kind of living, especially in the age of the internet where anyone with half a brain can find a way to steal a copy of virtually any kind of artwork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 How can you own a particular arrangement of someone else's property? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark of the Cross Posted October 9, 2012 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 Essentially we can make up all kinds of reasoning. I've likened pirating MS to robbing the thief that has come into your house to rob you. They sell you something with a deliberate defect so they can sell you the upgrade. When we buy anything we demand and have a right to warranty that it will do what it is supposed to do. Why should I be forced to buy win7 when XP in some ways had less issues than I am now experiencing. Why Why Why but down to the nitty gritty isn't there a degree of sinfulness. My question is do we have the right to forcibly take intellectual property for the good of the work done by the church in the 3rd world? It boils back to the question of can we justly sin for a greater good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightofChrist Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 (edited) I am a graphic designer my living depends upon intellectual property. In a arco system how do I keep thieves from stealing my work, or would the theft of my work be ok? Edited October 9, 2012 by KnightofChrist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 The framing of the 'questions' in this thread is ridiculously biased. That is not particularly intellectually honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 [quote name='KnightofChrist' timestamp='1349822533' post='2491740'] I am a graphic designer my living depends upon intellectual property. In a arco system how do I keep thieves from stealing my work, or would the theft of my work be ok? [/quote] People shouldn't steal your work. But if they use their own property to duplicate the arrangement you make with your own property, how is that theft? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightofChrist Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Yes my questions are bias. The arco way of thinking of intellectual property would seem to attack my livelihood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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