There Cannot Be A God

[the171]

I don't understand why. I just want concrete answers.

[sixpence]

Sorry, it sounds like you are going through something terrible. I will pray for you too! Sometimes people are just nasty, it does happen, God does not stop them, just like He does not stop me or you when we choose to do hurtful things to others, just like He did not stop the people who tortured and killed His son. It is just required for us to have free will. It is difficult to understand during hard times, but God will get you through it if you let Him. I am sure there are a number of people on phatmass you could pm if you need to vent further, including me. Lastly, I think it is ok to vent at God if you need too, I'm sure He can take it.

[PhuturePriest]

[quote name='the171' timestamp='1348098232' post='2484398']
I don't understand why. I just want concrete answers.
[/quote]

Here are two links from Michelle Arnold on this subject: [url="http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=15026"]http://forums.cathol...ead.php?t=15026[/url] [url="http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=84452"]http://forums.cathol...ead.php?t=84452[/url]

Edited September 19, 2012 by FuturePriest387

[the171]

If there is a God how can I trust him? I don't understand!! All he does is allow these terrible things to happen. Isn't a sin to sit by and allow a sin to be committed? Wouldn't that make God a sinner?

[CatherineM]

Why not? Who told you that life was going to be easy and everyone was going to like you and be nice to you? So what if someone screwed you over. That has happened to everyone. My husband had a sister steal $200,000 from him. My mom prevented my dad from having life saving surgery. My foster son's older brother stole every possession he had practically except the clothes on his back.

Everyone here has similar stories in their lives. It wasn't that God let it happen, we let it happen because we are human. We are lazy and greedy and self-centered unless we choose to live differently.

When I was 29 years old, a man stabbed me numerous times, pushed me head first down a marble staircase, then slammed my head repeatedly on to the floor while strangling me into unconsciousness. God wasn't responsible for that. An individual was, and his hate was responsible. I could have allowed hate to ruin my life too. Instead, I forgave him and broke the cycle. That's free will in action too.

[4588686]

[quote name='CatherineM' timestamp='1348099226' post='2484412']
When I was 29 years old, a man stabbed me numerous times, pushed me head first down a marble staircase, then slammed my head repeatedly on to the floor while strangling me into unconsciousness. God wasn't responsible for that. An individual was, and his hate was responsible. I could have allowed hate to ruin my life too. Instead, I forgave him and broke the cycle. That's free will in action too.
[/quote]

No, but God could have stopped it. And he didn't. If I saw a woman being beaten to hell and stabbed and did not a beaver dam thing to stop it then I would rightly be labeled a cretin. When Kitty Gervais was murdered in public view it shocked the national conscious. How could so many people stand by and do nothing to stop it? And yet when God does the very same it's him respecting 'free will.'

[PhuturePriest]

[quote name='CatherineM' timestamp='1348099226' post='2484412']
Why not? Who told you that life was going to be easy and everyone was going to like you and be nice to you? So what if someone screwed you over. That has happened to everyone. My husband had a sister steal $200,000 from him. My mom prevented my dad from having life saving surgery. My foster son's older brother stole every possession he had practically except the clothes on his back.

Everyone here has similar stories in their lives. It wasn't that God let it happen, we let it happen because we are human. We are lazy and greedy and self-centered unless we choose to live differently.

When I was 29 years old, a man stabbed me numerous times, pushed me head first down a marble staircase, then slammed my head repeatedly on to the floor while strangling me into unconsciousness. God wasn't responsible for that. An individual was, and his hate was responsible. I could have allowed hate to ruin my life too. Instead, I forgave him and broke the cycle. That's free will in action too.
[/quote]

This. I tried to use an example in my life, but after this post all of them seemed totally lame. The only one that is kind of up there is when an EF5 tornado came through and destroyed 95% of my town. Was this God's fault? No. But he used it for the good. I know I likely wouldn't be here right now if it hadn't been for that tornado. So much good happened in my life after it. So no, God does not stop evil things from happening in the world. He does, however, help you heal and help good outcomes happen from them. People get upset when you say this, but it's true.

[Norseman82]

[quote name='Anomaly' timestamp='1348096038' post='2484380']
What was an omnipotent all knowing god doing for the thousands crippled physically and mentally in the tsunamis or for children and innocents maimed in natural disasters. What about the people who are killed in these disaster who aren't quite "right" with the requirements to be "saved".
[/quote]

The best response to this was in a letter to the editor that basically said that others saw a God Who sent or allowed natural disasters, but he (she?) saw a God who sent relief workers.

[ACS67]

the171? What in the world? Not too long ago you were all happy about the Catholic conferences and camps you were attending and before that you were discerning a vocation to the Carmelites. I'm not going to attempt to answer your question until you answer one....Where is all of this doubt coming from? I have read your blog. You are not this elementary or basic in thought. Something has happened to cause you to completely turn 360.

[Papist]

If God made/forced everyone to be moral and good, we would not be truly free.

[Anomaly]

[quote name='Norseman82' timestamp='1348099856' post='2484419']


The best response to this was in a letter to the editor that basically said that others saw a God Who sent or allowed natural disasters, but he (she?) saw a God who sent relief workers.
[/quote]No. God sent a tsunami. People brought help.

[sixpence]

[sup]32 [/sup]When Mary reached the place where Jesus was and saw him, she fell at his feet and said, “Lord, if you had been here, my brother would not have died.”[sup] 33 [/sup]When Jesus saw her weeping, and the Jews who had come along with her also weeping, he was deeply moved in spirit and troubled. [sup]34 [/sup]“Where have you laid him?” he asked. “Come and see, Lord,” they replied.[sup] 35 [/sup]Jesus wept.[sup] 36 [/sup]Then the Jews said, “See how he loved him!”[sup] 37 [/sup]But some of them said, “Could not he who opened the eyes of the blind man have kept this man from dying?”
(John 11)

[Papist]

[quote name='the171' timestamp='1348096311' post='2484384']
How can I find happiness in other people when other people are the ones who have screwed me over? While God just say up there and watched. No one is making any sense. I just don't understand. I want to but I can't.
[/quote]
What is your expectation of what God ought to do?

Remember, we are not promised happiness in this world, but the next.

Edited September 20, 2012 by Papist

[BG45]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1348099522' post='2484415']
When Kitty Gervais was murdered in public view it shocked the national conscious. How could so many people stand by and do nothing to stop it?
[/quote]

If you mean Kitty Genovese, there's still a lot of debate as to how aware the neighbors really were, and the newspaper article itself about how everyone just watched is pretty much debunked. Most of the windows that night were closed, meaning her cries weren't readily heard in the ten story apartment building. One neighbor who did see it out of his window actually did start yelling at her attacker to stop, but he assumed it was just one of the many such incidents between bar patrons at a nearby pub that had let out not long before, and closed his window when he saw the man run away.

Her attacker, Mosely, would later return as she tried to get inside her building, and he would kill her. Another neighbor this time saw what was happening and called the police. The official trial and investigation found there had been perhaps six witnesses, as compared to the newspaper's claim of 30-38. Some were drunk, most were drowsy, some assumed another had called the police, and one couple admitted they had known they should do something, but that for whatever reason they hadn't.

That said, this myth still persists, even in higher education institutions, despite the court documents providing evidence to the contrary.

Sources:
http://articles.nydailynews.com/2011-03-13/news/29139732_1_winston-moseley-genovese-murder-kitty-genovese

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/fulfillment-any-age/201112/the-top-10-psychology-myths

[Papist]

[quote name='BG45' timestamp='1348100303' post='2484432']
If you mean Kitty Genovese, there's still a lot of debate as to how aware the neighbors really were, and the newspaper article itself about how everyone just watched is pretty much debunked. Most of the windows that night were closed, meaning her cries weren't readily heard in the ten story apartment building. One neighbor who did see it out of his window actually did start yelling at her attacker to stop, but he assumed it was just one of the many such incidents between bar patrons at a nearby pub that had let out not long before, and closed his window when he saw the man run away.

Her attacker, Mosely, would later return as she tried to get inside her building, and he would kill her. Another neighbor this time saw what was happening and called the police. The official trial and investigation found there had been perhaps six witnesses, as compared to the newspaper's claim of 30-38. Some were drunk, most were drowsy, some assumed another had called the police, and one couple admitted they had known they should do something, but that for whatever reason they hadn't.

That said, this myth still persists, even in higher education institutions, despite the court documents providing evidence to the contrary.

Sources:
[url="http://articles.nydailynews.com/2011-03-13/news/29139732_1_winston-moseley-genovese-murder-kitty-genovese"]http://articles.nyda...-kitty-genovese[/url]

[url="http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/fulfillment-any-age/201112/the-top-10-psychology-myths"]http://www.psycholog...sychology-myths[/url]
[/quote]
Don't let the facts blur out the truth.