What Many Have Forgotten And No Longer Appreciate

[Lil Red]

[quote name='NonNovi' timestamp='1345407568' post='2470233']
If the priest prays the canon in silence, the people can't exactly tell what is going on (especially if the Mass is celebrated ad orientem) and thus not "participate".
[/quote]

so that's a good thing?

[PhuturePriest]

[quote name='Slappo' timestamp='1345326880' post='2469819']
The GIRM doesn't specify the voice of the priest, so there'd be nothing wrong with an inaudible canon. It would actually be keeping with long standing practice of the Latin Rite, so there doesn't need to be specific rubrics to continue saying the canon inaudibly.



Because it more clearly indicates that the priest is praying to God, not telling a story to the congregation. Both ad orientem and an inaudible canon assist with this. Obviously the way the priest prays can be an indicator that he is praying to God not telling a story to the people though and an inaudible canon isn't necessary for this relationship to be understood.
[/quote]

I never realized until now that he was praying to God. I of course knew the Mass was a prayer, but it never occurred to me that he was praying to God rather than telling a story, as you suggest.

[Brother Adam]

[quote name='mortify' timestamp='1345354391' post='2470035']
I think reverential silence might be interpreted as not letting the congregation "actively participat" with the liturgy
[/quote]

That is what a missal is for. When we go to the Mass we are approaching Calvary. It is our job to be attentive

[PhuturePriest]

[quote name='Brother Adam' timestamp='1345411643' post='2470259']
That is what a missal is for. When we go to the Mass we are approaching Calvary. It is our job to be attentive
[/quote]

Yes. As unliked as he is on here, Michael Voris says that Mass has become too much about the community and not enough about the sacrifice.

[jazzytakara]

I love the reverence displayed in the video, and I enjoy going to different types of mass. But as a converting Catholic so to speak (RCIA this fall), I like being able to hear what is going on, as a way to understand the mass better. I remember my first Latin Mass, I didn't know how to read the missal and I was so lost. I am sure the more I learn, and the more I experience other masses out side of OF, the more I will be able to partisipate with out being glued to leaflets. =)

[mortify]

[quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1345410296' post='2470246']
so that's a good thing?
[/quote]

Apparently it was a good thing for well over a thousand years

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='mortify' timestamp='1345426712' post='2470367']


Apparently it was a good thing for well over a thousand years
[/quote]
Also deaf people can participate just as readily as anyone else.

[IcePrincessKRS]

[quote name='jazzytakara' timestamp='1345413900' post='2470270']
I love the reverence displayed in the video, and I enjoy going to different types of mass. But as a converting Catholic so to speak (RCIA this fall), I like being able to hear what is going on, as a way to understand the mass better. I remember my first Latin Mass, I didn't know how to read the missal and I was so lost. I am sure the more I learn, and the more I experience other masses out side of OF, the more I will be able to partisipate with out being glued to leaflets. =)
[/quote]

I'm a cradle Catholic and don't use the books most of the time. I still like to hear it, partly because I'm a mother of 4 and often have little distractions down the pew. It's easier to get something out of the Mass when I can hear what's going on than *have* to follow along in the books or miss everything. When my 3 year old is being distracting I will often point to the cross and whisper in his ear about Jesus, or I will ask him to tell me where Jesus is. Where Mary is. Etc. But I can still hear our priest praying. Our Church has so many beautiful traditions and we are blessed to have both forms of the Mass available to us. I know people will argue that for the past however many hundreds of years mothers managed just fine without Mass in the vernacular, but you never know until you've been in those shoes. I've been to both forms with toddlers in tow and I, personally, find the OF easier to get something out of. Maybe down the line when my kids are older things will change but for now I am very thankful that I can hear all of the prayers being said.

[mortify]

The great Saints of the past are the fruit of the Mass as it was celebrated traditionally. Despite modernizations the laity are more ignorant than ever and hardly any spiritual advancement is seen. Perhaps we moderns are simply too dull to understand how our ancestors connected and particpated in the Mass.

[missionseeker]

So padre pio and Mother Teresa, Gianna Molla, etc are not notable?

[Ice_nine]

I want to go to an EF Mass. There's one every wed evening.

There's my contribution to the thread.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='missionseeker' timestamp='1345431213' post='2470422']
So padre pio and Mother Teresa, Gianna Molla, etc are not notable?
[/quote]

It seems rather unlikely to me (and I've heard very strong arguments besides) that Padre Pio did not celebrate Mass according to the Pauline Missal. I believe the missal itself was promulgated in 1969, and it did not become compulsory until 1971. By the 60s his health was already failing, and he died in 1968.
It is possible, though again IMO unlikely that Padre Pio participated in the experimental Masses of the mid-60s such as the transitional Missal (playing with elements such as versus populum, vernacular elements, suppressed Prayers at the Foot of the Altar, suppressed Last Gospel, etc., etc.). Frankly, Padre Pio does not seem to me to have been the experimental type. I would be surprised if he participated to any meaningful extent in those 'exercises'.

(Fun fact, Marcel Lefebvre actually did on a couple occasions personally try some of those experimental elements. Specifically I believe he celebrated Mass on one occasion versus populum, and for a time he also followed the transitional suppression of the Prayers at the Foot of the Altar and the Last Gospel.)

What I've read, in fact, says that as soon as Padre Pio learned of the new Missal, he wrote Pope Paul asking for, and quickly received dispensation to refrain from its celebration. Apparently Cardinal Bacci (the other cardinal with his name on the Ottaviani Intervention) granted him that authorization personally.

[dymphnamaria]

I come to realize that this Extraordinary Form of mass is celebrated by young priests nowadays.

[missionseeker]

I never said anything about the way Padre Pio celebrated Mass. And I know Mother Teresa or Gianna Molla never celebrated a mass.. He said that modern people are spiritually inferior to ancient saints.

Edited August 20, 2012 by missionseeker

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='missionseeker' timestamp='1345432949' post='2470442']
I never said anything about the way Padre Pio celebrated Mass. And I know Mother Teresa or Gianna Molla never celebrated a mass.. He said that modern people are spiritually inferior to ancient saints.
[/quote]

Oh, I thought you were referring to the method of attending (or celebrating as the case may be) Mass in its modern or traditional forms.

I wonder if over the next several decades we'll see some of the modern martyrs being canonized, such as the ones in Nigeria lately.