the lumberjack Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 and amarkich only continues to validate what is written throughout all Catholic documents... the eternal damnation of all outside the Catholic Church...no matter if they've been baptized or follow Christ or whatever else. thank you amarkich, I really mean that. God bless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulls Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 [quote name='the lumberjack' date='May 18 2004, 05:48 PM'] and amarkich only continues to validate what is written throughout all Catholic documents... the eternal damnation of all outside the Catholic Church...no matter if they've been baptized or follow Christ or whatever else. thank you amarkich, I really mean that. God bless. [/quote] yea but it was a good, relevant post. if that's what they believe, they should be unashamed about it. i don't like it, but hey, we're here for conversation right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the lumberjack Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 thats right mullsy ol' chap. but so many people here insist that that isn't correct...though I have found nothing that states otherwise in all the catholic documentation I've engaged. and hey, I'm not ashamed of what I believe, so hallelujah! Christ first and only God bless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted May 18, 2004 Author Share Posted May 18, 2004 [quote name='the lumberjack' date='May 18 2004, 04:54 PM'] thats right mullsy ol' chap. but so many people here insist that that isn't correct...though I have found nothing that states otherwise in all the catholic documentation I've engaged. and hey, I'm not ashamed of what I believe, so hallelujah! Christ first and only God bless [/quote] lumberjack, Those documents amarkich is quoting are re-affirming that [b]Christ[/b] is the Way, the Truth and the Life. All who reject Christ's body will not have eternal salvation. How is this different from what you believe? Why do you fault the Church from re-affirming that it contains the fullness of truth found in God's Word, when you yourself would turn around and make the same affirmations about Christianity over, say, Islam or Judaism? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the lumberjack Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 thing is dust, I'm not part of the Catholic Church...which according to the definition of the Catholic Church, I am damned to the fires reserved for the devil and his minions. I proclaim Christ, and live for Him, regardless of what the Catholic Church institution may teach or say. I know where my salvation lies...In Christ...not the Roman Catholic Church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livin_the_MASS Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 [u][b]St. Cyprian (c. 250 AD):[/b][/u] [quote][b]"God is one and Christ is one, and one is His Church, and the faith is one, and His people welded together by the glue of concord into a solid unity of body. Unity cannot be rent asunder, nor can the body of the Church, through the division of its structure, be divided into seperate pieces."[/b][/quote] [u][b]St. Hillary (4th c.):[/b][/u] [quote][b]"In the Scriptures our people are shown to be made one; so that just as many grains collected into one and grounded and mingled together, make one loaf, so in Christ, who is the heavenly Bread, we know there is one body, in which our whole company in joined and united." [i]Treatise 62, 13.[/i][/b][/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livin_the_MASS Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 [quote][b]1 Cor 1:10: I urge you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree in what you say, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and in the same purpose.[/b][/quote] This is just one! Do you need more? Pax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted May 18, 2004 Author Share Posted May 18, 2004 [quote name='the lumberjack' date='May 18 2004, 05:44 PM'] thing is dust, I'm not part of the Catholic Church...which according to the definition of the Catholic Church, I am damned to the fires reserved for the devil and his minions. I proclaim Christ, and live for Him, regardless of what the Catholic Church institution may teach or say. I know where my salvation lies...In Christ...not the Roman Catholic Church. [/quote] You still have not answered my question. "Why do you fault the Church from re-affirming that it contains the fullness of truth found in God's Word, when you yourself would turn around and make the same affirmations about Christianity over, say, Islam or Judaism?" And according to the Church, you [b]are[/b] part of the Church--just not in perfect communion. [i]"The Church knows that she is joined in many ways to the baptized who are honored by the name of Christian, but do not profess the Catholic faith in its entirety or have not preserved unity or communion under the successor of Peter." Those "who believe in Christ and have been properly baptized are put in a certain, although imperfect, communion with the Catholic Church." - Catechism of the Catholic Church, 838[/i] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulls Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 hmm, i wonder if queen latifah sings gospel. please oh please, somebody understand that joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katholikos Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 [quote name='the lumberjack' date='May 18 2004, 02:30 PM'] for starters...yes. the things that go on in the Catholic churches around the world are not what you would think they are...and unless you've been to a Catholic church in, say, Jamaica, or Mexico, or any where else outside the states, you should seriously look into the amount of unity actually in the Catholic Church. a lot of those churches are catholic only by name... I was raised a good portion of my childhood in Mexico, and right across the street from my grandmother's house is a catholic church...and man...I don't think I ever heard Christ mentioned once the number of times I went. it was ALL the virgen of guadlupe and juan diego and this idol and the other...NEVER CHRIST...ever. God bless. [/quote] I've been in many Catholic Churches in many countries including Mexico. I lived briefly in Mexico. Sadly, you have seen and experienced Catholicism through the warped prism of Protestantism. The Church does not teach one Catholicism in Mexico and another in Bangladesh and yet another in the U.S. You're no authority in what is "Catholic" and what isn't. The Mass is exactly the same all over the world -- with allowable cultural variations. The same seven Sacraments are celebrated. The same theological and moral Truths are taught. Unity does not mean uniformity. There is diversity within the unity of the Church. A Catholic Church is Mexico is no less CATHOLIC than one in California or Malta or New Caledonia. The very fact that you refer to Our Lady of Guadalupe and Juan Diego as [i]idols[/i] is ample proof of your lack of understanding. Ave Cor Mariae, Likos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the lumberjack Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 hahahaha "allowable cultural variations"?!?!?! hahaha...exactly the same...EXCEPT for that. please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted May 19, 2004 Author Share Posted May 19, 2004 lumberjack - You still have not addressed my question. Thx. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
socalscout Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 [b]one answer would be[/b] All Christians submit to the authority of the pope, and are unified under the universal Catholic Church. [b]Or[/b] All Christians submit to the authority of the pope, and are unified under the universal Catholic Church. [b] another way to go is[/b] All Christians submit to the authority of the pope, and are unified under the universal Catholic Church. [b]If that does not work then[/b] All Christians submit to the authority of the pope, and are unified under the universal Catholic Church. [b]but my favorite is[/b] All Christians submit to the authority of the pope, and are unified under the universal Catholic Church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yesygerm Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 [quote name='the lumberjack' date='May 18 2004, 01:30 PM'] for starters...yes. the things that go on in the Catholic churches around the world are not what you would think they are...and unless you've been to a Catholic church in, say, Jamaica, or Mexico, or any where else outside the states, you should seriously look into the amount of unity actually in the Catholic Church. a lot of those churches are catholic only by name... I was raised a good portion of my childhood in Mexico, and right across the street from my grandmother's house is a catholic church...and man...I don't think I ever heard Christ mentioned once the number of times I went. it was ALL the virgen of guadlupe and juan diego and this idol and the other...NEVER CHRIST...ever. God bless. [/quote] peace be with you the lumberjack! I am Mexican and have been to a many Roman Catholic Churches from the tip of Mexico, Tijuana, to Mexico City and Every time I attend mass Christ is mentioned. In fact, I just got back two weeks ago from Guadalajara and attended mass in the city of Talpa Jalisco and Christ was mentioned throughtout the entire mass. The Catholic churchs being Catholic by name are only your opinion, but I have insight on things that go on in some Churches and it's really a blessing what Priests, Nuns, and the community do in the name of Christ. I should know, I have 2 cousins that are priests, Aunts that are nuns. Peace be with you and I will pray for you, VIVA CHRISTO REY!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 [quote name='the lumberjack' date='May 18 2004, 11:16 PM'] hahahaha "allowable cultural variations"?!?!?! hahaha...exactly the same...EXCEPT for that. please. [/quote] you fail to understand, we're not talking the superficial stuff you emphasize when belittling the fact that we're seperated. you know, you're like oh well we have different this that and the other thing but we hold the same [sortof almost] basic tenents. well we have differences in the way we come together in different cultures but we hold the same exact faith, not merely a few basic tenents, but all doctrine of the Holy Apostolic Church centered in the city of the Holy Martyrs Peter and Paul. yeah, some Catholics have disagreements. but good practicing Catholics always submit to the Apostolic Authority out of love of Truth and love of Jesus Christ who is Truth (certainly not out of some misguided exhaltation of a man). The Apostolic Bishops and especially the Pope do not have authority on their own, but authority because of their nature as APOSTLES. Apostle- one who is sent. Because they are sent by the Lord Jesus they have been granted the Holy Spirit which prevents them from bringing us error when their office of Apostolic Authority is fully utilized (which then must include the Petrine office of course) But all truly Catholic people subscribe to that doctrine, and thus, Catholics are unified in their belief because that doctrine binds all the rest together in one lump-sum of a Universal Sometimes the mexicans are just so caught up in love of God because of the amazing things He has done for them through His mother. They haven't had to deal with touchy wording and all that like we do in America. You know, like we have to watch what way we word things so it's exactly theologically correct otherwise a protestant will take it and completely misinterpret it. In some ways i envy the Mexicans. THey can show love for Our Lady without having to be so concerned that they mention "but of course I love Jesus more" they don't even have this poisonous heresy of imaging a popularity contest in heaven. Pax Out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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