Where To Put President # 44?

[Winchester]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1344138850' post='2462840']
That's not how blackness has **ever** been determined around here. I guess you really are just ignorant about racism and that's cute, but also sad because said ignorance empowers actual racists. The general standard in the south, particularly after the Civil War, is the one-drop rule. One drop of black blood makes an individual black. That's how it's been for a long, long time and that general trend continues today. Obama is a black man, by the historical standard and by the standard that continues to today.
[/quote]
floopy that standard. It's dumb. He's exactly equal parts black and white. Just like Will Ferrell.

[4588686]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1344177653' post='2462947']
I have no doubt it's what he wanted it to mean. He was a nationalist. Other framers rather disagreed with him.[/QUOTE}

I've read some quotes here and there from the ratification conventions, but I've found a source online for them. Should be interesting.
[/quote]

That would be baller

[4588686]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1344177798' post='2462948']
floopy that standard. It's dumb. He's exactly equal parts black and white. Just like Will Ferrell.
[/quote]

I agree but its the one that exists in the cultural context he lives in. Does anyone seeing Obama walk down the street consider him anything other than black? You can't say, well it's stupid because rationally he's really half black and half white because the categories of being 'white' or 'black' are themselves non-scientific categories, they're cultural categories. That's how Ben Franklin could rail against the 'stupid, swarthy Germans' who didn't understand how to function in a civilized, white nation.

[4588686]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1344134024' post='2462806']
I missed the part where I said that ever conservative in the south is racist. There is, however, a correlative relationship between being a conservative in the south and being a racist.



This is a straw man. I never said that every single southern conservative is a racist.



Why?



Yep. And when did this big sudden surge in foodstamp usage occur. I think it was sometime around the end of Bush's second term and the begining portion of Obama's. Hm. What happened during this timeframe? Did Bush and Obama suddenly start throwing out foodstamp cards? Or did the economy, you know, kind of explode? Maybe around 2008? I'm just spit-balling here.



Actually, if you read that article, the rates are starting to fall off.



In what political universe do you live where a President facing reelection [b]wants[/b] to be known as the President under whom foodstamp usage exploded?





Yep.

But back to the purpose of this spat. It is just infinity fascinating to me that the same racist rhetoric I see back in my part of the woods will suddenly appear, scrubbed of n-bombs, in formats like the one Groo presented and yet, amazingly, it has absolutely nothing to do with the remarkably similar racist rhetoric that occurs in conservative parts of the country. It's really quite amazing. This has nothing to do with race. And that's why I constantly hear right-wingers refer to Bush, under whom this boom began, as a food-stamp President. Oh, wait. I never hear that term associated with Bush. I hear plenty of complaints that Bush wasn't a 'true conservative' but for some reason that rhetoric which seems to be a somewhat sanitized version of typical racist rhetoric, is only applied to the black President. Hmmmm...

Hey, what's this?




[img]http://www.pleasegodno.com/uploads/obamabucks3.jpg[/img]





Hm. It seems to be a more overtly racist, but thematically identical, version of the same format. Huh. What an interesting coincidence.
[/quote]

The interesting thing is that this pissing drunk post was more coherent than most of my sober posts.

[Innocent]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1344134024' post='2462806']
[img]http://www.pleasegodno.com/uploads/obamabucks3.jpg[/img]

Hm. It seems to be a more overtly racist, but thematically identical, version of the same format. Huh. What an interesting coincidence.
[/quote]


Hasan, why would you consider this caricature racist? I could understand if you said that this was a disrespectful depiction of your President, but there are no racist symbols or text in this image that I can discover. Or perhaps I'm missing something.

Placing a politician's face on a donkey is not unheard-of in political caricatures, no? But in this case the severity is reduced since that animal is the symbol of his party, isn't it?


[b]ETA:[/b] It just struck me after I posted this: perhaps you refer to the skin colour of the donkey? Hm.. perhaps that is indeed racist, but that never would have occurred to me if you hadn't called the picture overtly racist.

Edited August 5, 2012 by Innocent

[God the Father]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1344197978' post='2463037']
I agree but its the one that exists in the cultural context he lives in. Does anyone seeing Obama walk down the street consider him anything other than black? You can't say, well it's stupid because rationally he's really half black and half white because the categories of being 'white' or 'black' are themselves non-scientific categories, they're cultural categories. That's how Ben Franklin could rail against the 'stupid, swarthy Germans' who didn't understand how to function in a civilized, white nation.
[/quote]

Derek Jeter's father is black. For fifteen years or so, I didn't know this, and did not consider him anything other than white when I saw him on tv. Sometimes I forget. I get your point but to be fully honest, I think a lot of people do draw a distinction when it comes to biracial individuals. The system that considered anything below "octoroon" inferior was deconstructed a long time ago and has been forgotten in many parts of the country.

Furthermore, your point about white Americans being persecuted for generations dilutes your point that Obama had it much tougher than, for instance, Kennedy, who in a past era would have been marginalized for his Irish and Catholic background.


[quote name='Innocent' timestamp='1344208137' post='2463137']
Hasan, why would you consider this caricature racist? I could understand if you said that this was a disrespectful depiction of your President, but there are no racist symbols or text in this image that I can discover. Or perhaps I'm missing something.

Placing a politician's face on a donkey is not unheard-of in political caricatures, no? But in this case the severity is reduced since that animal is the symbol of his party, isn't it?


[b]ETA:[/b] It just struck me after I posted this: perhaps you refer to the skin colour of the donkey? Hm.. perhaps that is indeed racist, but that never would have occurred to me if you hadn't called the picture overtly racist.
[/quote]

The fried chicken, ribs, kool-aid guy, and watermelon invoke racial stereotypes.

Edited August 5, 2012 by God the Father

[4588686]

[quote name='Innocent' timestamp='1344208137' post='2463137']
Hasan, why would you consider this caricature racist? I could understand if you said that this was a disrespectful depiction of your President, but there are no racist symbols or text in this image that I can discover. Or perhaps I'm missing something.

Placing a politician's face on a donkey is not unheard-of in political caricatures, no? But in this case the severity is reduced since that animal is the symbol of his party, isn't it?


[b]ETA:[/b] It just struck me after I posted this: perhaps you refer to the skin colour of the donkey? Hm.. perhaps that is indeed racist, but that never would have occurred to me if you hadn't called the picture overtly racist.
[/quote]

Right. The references are all cultural. Watermelon, fried-chicken, and kool-aid are all foods associated with black people in the south. Things like fried chicken and watermelon are really staples of southern-culture in general, but for whatever reason they've become specifically associated with black culture in America. I'm not sure why. The implication is that Obama is giving the stamps to black people to buy KFC and watermelon or whatever.

[4588686]

[QUOTE]Furthermore, your point about white Americans being persecuted for generations dilutes your point that Obama had it much tougher than, for instance, Kennedy, who in a past era would have been marginalized for his Irish and Catholic background.
[/quote]

I never said that Obama had it tougher than Kennedy (although he did). But to the point I think you are getting at, that it is not just black Americans who have been marginalized and discriminated against, I fully agree. Kennedy is just a bad example since he grew up in extremely privileged circumstances. I'm not sure where I have said or implied that because Obama would be considered black by American standards he necessarily had it harder than any white person. He didn't. There are white people in the country who had it far harder than Obama ever did. That has nothing to do with my argument.

[Winchester]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1344197758' post='2463034']
That would be baller
[/quote]
By 'interesting', I meant really flooping wordy and a snore fest except for the things that satisfy my confirmation bias.

[Winchester]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1344197978' post='2463037']
I agree but its the one that exists in the cultural context he lives in. Does anyone seeing Obama walk down the street consider him anything other than black?
[/quote]
Yes.

[Groo the Wanderer]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1344210125' post='2463159']
Watermelon, fried-chicken, and kool-aid are all foods associated with black people in the south. Things like fried chicken and watermelon are really staples of southern-culture in general, but for whatever reason they've become specifically associated with black culture in America. I'm not sure why. The implication is that Obama is giving the stamps to black people to buy KFC and watermelon or whatever.
[/quote]

Yer a twit. I am from the South, I live in the South. All of us like those things, regardless of color or culture or whatever. Fried chicken is not a' black thing' - ever seen Paula Deen? Cold sliced watermelon is gret for everyone, especially kids on a hot summer day (which is about 200 days of the year). You should add pecan pie and iced tea. Racist? I think you are the racist my friend, claiming stereotypes that are fallacious.

[MIKolbe]

LOL

Tell that to Fuzzy Zeller.

[4588686]

[quote name='Groo the Wanderer' timestamp='1344246767' post='2463381']
Yer [/QUOTE]
What's with all the 'yer's? Are you some sort of pirate?


[QUOTE] a twit. I am from the South, I live in the South. All of us like those things, regardless of color or culture or whatever. Fried chicken is not a' black thing' - ever seen Paula Deen? Cold sliced watermelon is gret for everyone, especially kids on a hot summer day (which is about 200 days of the year). [/QUOTE]

Hey, you know what can be helpful in not giving a dumb response? Actually reading what somebody said.

[i][color=#282828][font='Segoe UI', 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][size=3][background=rgb(247, 247, 247)]"Things like fried chicken and watermelon are really staples of southern-culture in general..."[/background][/size][/font][/color][/i]
[QUOTE]You should add pecan pie and iced tea.[/QUOTE]

Those are not stearotypical foodstuffs.

[QUOTE]Racist? I think you are the racist my friend, claiming stereotypes that are fallacious.
[/quote]


What sort of bubble do you live in that you honestly don't know about this?

Hey, look at this!

[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fried_chicken#Racial_stereotype"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fried_chicken#Racial_stereotype[/url]

[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereotypes_of_African_Americans_in_the_United_States"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereotypes_of_African_Americans_in_the_United_States[/url]


[url="http://www.good.is/post/eating-while-black-how-i-navigate-watermelon-fried-chicken-and-frozen-yogurt/"]http://www.good.is/post/eating-while-black-how-i-navigate-watermelon-fried-chicken-and-frozen-yogurt/[/url]


[url="http://www.dailynorthwestern.com/clifton-i-ll-eat-my-fried-chicken-with-pride-1.2728771#.UCADfU1lTa0"]http://www.dailynorthwestern.com/clifton-i-ll-eat-my-fried-chicken-with-pride-1.2728771#.UCADfU1lTa0[/url]


And on and on