Countdown To My Sister's First Vows!

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1344013090' post='2462106']
Iggy, for some reason your link didn't work right, so here it is, again [url="http://www.flickr.com/photos/dominicanfriars/7669215400/in/set-72157630804743022"]http://www.flickr.co...157630804743022[/url]

My sister is front and center in the first picture!
[/quote]

Thanks for fixing it. You're able to edit posts with your mod powers, right? Could you fix the link in my post just in case someone tries my link and gives up instead of reading down to your post. Thanks!

And thanks for pointing out your Sister sister!

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

MS--Maybe you'll know the answer to this--maybe not.

The ND's are pretty unusual in only having one year of novitiate--the required year of "canonical novitiate." (At least I THINK it's unusual, although I'm sure there are other Communities that do this, as well.) Do you know why the ND's only have a one-year novitiate compared to the two-year novitiate that is more typical? As I understand it (and again I could be wrong), a one year novitiate was common pre-Vatican II, but after Vatican II recommended a 2-year novitiate, a lot of Communities went to that.

If you don't know offhand, no biggie. It's not like I'm discerning--just curious.

(For those who are newer to VS, I am one of VS' self-appointed "cheerleaders"--not discerning myself, but supporting in prayer and posts those who are discerning, especially Dominicans, but will pray for most anyone who is nice to me.

Edited August 3, 2012 by IgnatiusofLoyola

[somethingfishy]

The Dominican friars also have a one-year novitiate (after about two weeks of postulancy!). It is somewhat unusual for women's communities, though.

[MissScripture]

[quote name='IgnatiusofLoyola' timestamp='1344037228' post='2462452']
Thanks for fixing it. You're able to edit posts with your mod powers, right? Could you fix the link in my post just in case someone tries my link and gives up instead of reading down to your post. Thanks!

And thanks for pointing out your Sister sister!
[/quote]
No problem. I almost just changed your link, but decided that I'd leave it, in case somehow the pics I found weren't what you were linking to. I just figured it was better to get permission first. But it's fixed, now.

[quote name='IgnatiusofLoyola' timestamp='1344037803' post='2462455']
MS--Maybe you'll know the answer to this--maybe not.

The ND's are pretty unusual in only having one year of novitiate--the required year of "canonical novitiate." (At least I THINK it's unusual, although I'm sure there are other Communities that do this, as well.) Do you know why the ND's only have a one-year novitiate compared to the two-year novitiate that is more typical? As I understand it (and again I could be wrong), a one year novitiate was common pre-Vatican II, but after Vatican II recommended a 2-year novitiate, a lot of Communities went to that.

If you don't know offhand, no biggie. It's not like I'm discerning--just curious.

(For those who are newer to VS, I am one of VS' self-appointed "cheerleaders"--not discerning myself, but supporting in prayer and posts those who are discerning, especially Dominicans, but will pray for most anyone who is nice to me.
[/quote]
Well, they have a full year of postulancy, then a year of being a novice, then 2 years following still in the novitiate as 1st year black veils and then 2nd year black veils. After that, they move to the professed side of the Motherhouse. I don't know the why of any of it. I find it a little strange that their First vows were for 3 years, but they only remain in the novitiate for 2 more years.

[Deus te Amat]

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1344041510' post='2462479']

No problem. I almost just changed your link, but decided that I'd leave it, in case somehow the pics I found weren't what you were linking to. I just figured it was better to get permission first. But it's fixed, now.


Well, they have a full year of postulancy, then a year of being a novice, then 2 years following still in the novitiate as 1st year black veils and then 2nd year black veils. After that, they move to the professed side of the Motherhouse. I don't know the why of any of it. I find it a little strange that their First vows were for 3 years, but they only remain in the novitiate for 2 more years.
[/quote]

I think the last bit is so that they experience life on the professed side before renewing vows.

[MissScripture]

[quote name='Deus_te_Amat' timestamp='1344041971' post='2462487']


I think the last bit is so that they experience life on the professed side before renewing vows.
[/quote]
Oh, that makes sense. Not that you would know, since you haven't entered yet, but are there a lot of differences? Or is it more just a sense of permanence?

[Deus te Amat]

Off the top of my head?

Novitiate:
~60 sisters
Under a novice mistress
Preparing to teach/focusing on formation
Live at the Motherhouse

Professed:
~200 sisters
Under mother (as far as I know)
Living the apostolate
Not necessarily living at the motherhouse


There's probably a lot more, but I'll probably learn the rest by experience.

Edited August 4, 2012 by Deus_te_Amat

[MissScripture]

[quote name='Deus_te_Amat' timestamp='1344044161' post='2462499']
Off the top of my head?

Novitiate:
~60 sisters
Under a novice mistress
Preparing to teach/focusing on formation
Live at the Motherhouse

Professed:
~200 sisters
Under mother (as far as I know)
Living the apostolate
Not necessarily living at the motherhouse


There's probably a lot more, but I'll probably learn the rest by experience.
[/quote]
So, on the 3rd year as a black veil, can they be sent to a mission? Some of this stuff I haven't really considered, since my sister won't be done with school soon enough for it to even be a possibility.

Also, I didn't want to ask this question last weekend, when we were all happy about vows and stuff, but I was curious. They took vows for 3 years, so what happens to someone who discerns out before that? Do they need to wait out the three years? Or do they need special permission from the Bishop to be released from their vows? Or can they be released by their superiors in the Novitiate? Or do you not know and don't really want to think about it? lol.

[Deus te Amat]

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1344046279' post='2462507']

So, on the 3rd year as a black veil, can they be sent to a mission? Some of this stuff I haven't really considered, since my sister won't be done with school soon enough for it to even be a possibility.

Also, I didn't want to ask this question last weekend, when we were all happy about vows and stuff, but I was curious. They took vows for 3 years, so what happens to someone who discerns out before that? Do they need to wait out the three years? Or do they need special permission from the Bishop to be released from their vows? Or can they be released by their superiors in the Novitiate? Or do you not know and don't really want to think about it? lol.
[/quote]

They could teach, but it would be in Nashville, as they are still in the Novitiate.

As for the other question, I think they would wait for the end for the three years, but if it were dire, I think there would be some wiggle room. But I don't know for sure.

[TheresaThoma]

I don't know if it is the same for the NDs but I talked about the vows with the novice director with the SMMC they have 4 years of temporary vows. They take them for one year then renew for three more years. If you were to discern out after renewing your temporary vows you would have to wait out the remaining part of the three years.

[MessorCarus]

But temporary vows aren't binding like final vows, correct? So, why would they need to stay? Actually, I know of a Sister who left after professing temporary vows. She then rejoined the community later. Granted, I don't know for what reason she left.

[mantellata]

Temporary vows are just as binding as final vows but for less time. A Sister could be dispensed from her vows if she left prior to fulfilling the temporary term (this would require the permission of the Ordinary for religious orders of diocesan rite and of the Congregation for Religious - rep. the Pope for Pontifical) or she could live out her vows (with certain dispensations especially in regards to poverty) at home until they "run out".

[OnlySunshine]

I don't think it's necessarily a requirement of all communities if the temporarily professed discerns out of the convent. I have known some religious to discern that they were not called to live in the convent anymore. One in particular left about a month after professing temporary vows. I'm not sure what the stipulations were when she left, however.

[Sr Mary Catharine OP]

Our sisters remain in the novitiate for 2 years after Profession (we don't "take vows", we "make profession"). This is so that the living out of the committment of profession can be guided and that there is a gradual taking on of responsibilities.

The 3rd year of profession a sister "moves downstairs" but the professed dorm is actually on the same floor as the novitiate. She is under the prioress but continues to receive guidance from the novice mistress as needed. Her studies are also still under the novice mistress. The 3rd year is important because the Sister find what life is like for her living the full observance. She also takes her share of answering "the turn" and of other responsibilities shared among the professed community. In some ways she has more "freedom" because she doesn't need to get permission to do things, etc. the way she does in the novitiate. She has her assignments and may within the regular observance of the house and her responsibilities work out her day as she wishes.

For example, in the novitiate much of the work is assigned and can (and does) change. The sisters need to ask permission for their retreat days, for visitors, and to offer to substitute for various works or adoration times. In the professed community the sisters can decide this for themselves and can work out times that are good for their family visit, etc. and they inform the prioress out of respect or curtesy but it is understood that if it is a regular parlor visit they don't need to ask specific permissions.

Sisters who wish to leave in temporary vows petition the Prioress who brings this request to the Council for their consent. The decision is then sent to the Bishop for confirmation.

I don't know what exactly is done in Nashville but I would expect it is the same as this is from Canon Law.

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

[quote name='Sr. Mary Catharine' timestamp='1344084475' post='2462627']
Our sisters remain in the novitiate for 2 years after Profession (we don't "take vows", we "make profession"). This is so that the living out of the committment of profession can be guided and that there is a gradual taking on of responsibilities.

The 3rd year of profession a sister "moves downstairs" but the professed dorm is actually on the same floor as the novitiate. She is under the prioress but continues to receive guidance from the novice mistress as needed. Her studies are also still under the novice mistress. The 3rd year is important because the Sister find what life is like for her living the full observance. She also takes her share of answering "the turn" and of other responsibilities shared among the professed community. In some ways she has more "freedom" because she doesn't need to get permission to do things, etc. the way she does in the novitiate. She has her assignments and may within the regular observance of the house and her responsibilities work out her day as she wishes.

For example, in the novitiate much of the work is assigned and can (and does) change. The sisters need to ask permission for their retreat days, for visitors, and to offer to substitute for various works or adoration times. In the professed community the sisters can decide this for themselves and can work out times that are good for their family visit, etc. and they inform the prioress out of respect or curtesy but it is understood that if it is a regular parlor visit they don't need to ask specific permissions.

Sisters who wish to leave in temporary vows petition the Prioress who brings this request to the Council for their consent. The decision is then sent to the Bishop for confirmation.

I don't know what exactly is done in Nashville but I would expect it is the same as this is from Canon Law.
[/quote]

Sister Mary Catherine--Thanks so much for the explanation!

I miss Sister Joseph Maria's smile. Now that she is no longer living in the novitiate, she isn't in as many of the pictures on the Summit blog!

With your explanation, I now have a better idea of what the change has meant for Sister Joseph Maria's everyday life. And, unless I have my arithmetic wrong, Sister Maria Teresa is also due to move "down the hall" sometime this fall. I will miss her in the novitiate pictures, too!

On the other hand, although I will miss seeing these Sisters' pictures on your blog so often, their moving out of the novitiate means more free beds in the novitiate! Every day I pray for new strong vocations for your Community as well as for the Dominican Sisters of St. Joseph in England, where Laetitia Crucis/Sister Mary Catherine is finishing her canonical novitiate year.

That's TWO Sister Mary Catharine/Catherine's for Phatmass! However, and please correct me if I'm wrong, but if I remember correctly from the Summit blog, besides the differences in spelling, your name is in honor of St. Catherine of Alexandria and LC/Sister Mary Catherine's name is in honor of St. Catherine of Siena--both very important and revered saints!

To fellow VS'ers--If you don't regularly read the blog of the Summit Dominicans, you are missing something special. The blog is not only well-written and fun, but I have also learned something of what life is like in a cloistered monastery, as well as about various saints, Catholic church history, the Dominican order--I could go on and on.......But, for once, I won't.

The blog address is [url="http://www.nunsopsummit.org"]www.nunsopsummit.org[/url]. This is also the address for the home page of the Community, as well as for the Cloister Shoppe with its wonderful soaps and other things (both serious and fun).

Edited August 7, 2012 by IgnatiusofLoyola