organwerke Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 [quote name='Antigonos' timestamp='1341373598' post='2452232'] Married life is an extremely complex business -- just look at the advice columns, or the number of married couples who seek counseling. I can think of a number of topics: in a Catholic marriage, how authoritative should the husband be? How submissive the wife? Who decides how and how much religious instruction should be given to the children? What if the wife is extremely devout but the husband less so, and this causes friction? And we haven't even mentioned the dread words "sex" and "money" yet! [/quote] Most of all I think married life is much simpler when a person is discerning. This is marriage and there are not too many other options. Instead, when you are sure you want to pursue religious life...you've only answered the first 10% of the question, because then you have to decide: do I prefer cloistered or monastic or active or semi-contemplative communities...and then: Carmelite, or dominican or benedectine or franciscan....and then which congregation of this order...and then with habit or without.... What a complicated matter!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antigonos Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 [quote name='organwerke' timestamp='1341409754' post='2452304'] Most of all I think married life is much simpler when a person is discerning. This is marriage and there are not too many other options. Instead, when you are sure you want to pursue religious life...you've only answered the first 10% of the question, because then you have to decide: do I prefer cloistered or monastic or active or semi-contemplative communities...and then: Carmelite, or dominican or benedectine or franciscan....and then which congregation of this order...and then with habit or without.... What a complicated matter!!!! [/quote] But you aren't marrying "marriage" -- there's another person attached to it, and it's finding the right person that is the first challenge. Not for nothing is the Yiddish term "bashert" used to mean "your perfect match" -- it means "the destined one". And life, even with the right person, isn't all skittles and beer [neither is religious life, of course] If marriage were so simple, so many people wouldn't wind up divorcing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhuturePriest Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Antigonos' timestamp='1341413416' post='2452309'] But you aren't marrying "marriage" -- there's another person attached to it, and it's finding the right person that is the first challenge. Not for nothing is the Yiddish term "bashert" used to mean "your perfect match" -- it means "the destined one". And life, even with the right person, isn't all skittles and beer [neither is religious life, of course] If marriage were so simple, so many people wouldn't wind up divorcing [/quote] Nobody argues that marriage is not tough, especially when trying to find someone to marry. But it is quite difficult discerning the Religious life as well. You're not just marrying God, you are marrying into a community of sometimes over a hundred people, each with their own faults and different personalities. Personality conflicts, arguments, disagreements, these are all involved and can sometimes be a daily affair. I can't remember the name of the Saint, but one Saint said the hardest part of Religious life is living with other people. Married people only have to learn to live with one person and eventually a family (Which on average is 1.2 children, sadly) while Religious have to live with however many are in their community. Edited July 4, 2012 by FuturePriest387 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indwelling Trinity Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 (edited) Marriage is just as great a challenge as religious life for it is also a call to holiness in a very beautiful and specific way. It is much more difficult to get a dispensation from marriage than it is to get a religious dispensation, perhaps with the exception of Solemn vows. That loving sacrifices of marriage are often more difficult that that of most religious. If a community does not want you they can easily send someone away until final vows. In some communities that is as long as 9-13 years as in the Jesuits. In religious life in many communities if one is having problems in a specific house or with a superior one can be transferred to another house. Before final vows if one gets sick the community can send you home. In marriage, there is no in house testing period of living together first. Yes you date, become engaged, attend pre-cana, but it is not the same as living with the person 24/7 before making ones Sacramental vows. For better or worse implies living a lifetime with whatever comes down the pike. If your children or husband or wife get sick, there is no sending them away as they might be a burden . They are yours to love and hold no matter what. If a marriage turns out less than expected one cannot simply ask for a transfer out..... Marriage requires great love and faith and indeed offers sacrifices as well as joys that can lead speedily to holiness. Each lifestyle whether religious or married or ordained has its specific sacrifices. I have been a religious since age 18. I am now soon to be 56. I have lived an intense life as a religious but when i see the sacrifices that my sisters have made for their husband and children. I sometimes feel ashamed at my response in loving Jesus. My only point here being is let not any of us secretly in our hearts look down on those called to married life. I sometimes get that impression/. Let us always remember that it is a sacrament with a BIG S.... I myself have found in seeing those who are married, encouragement to live my love for Jesus ever more intently each day. I deeply love my life as a hermit and religious; but i rejoice in the beauty that is marriage. I think a Marriage forum would be a wonderful idea, for such a life is not as simple as it seems. Edited July 4, 2012 by Indwelling Trinity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
organwerke Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 Your post is really beautiful IT! Anyway I do not think there are persons who are looking down on those called to married life, but, at least for me, it is true that I admire those who are discerning religious life because for me it is really a hard life and, from my perspective, it is more difficult than married life. I have had many up and down periods in my life discerning wether I was called to married life or religious life because at first I was not accepted into a community, and then got engaged in a relationship in which the circumstances were really complicated and then continued "dreaming" religious life...trying to transform those dreams in reality. and my modest opinion is that I have to admit that in front of my eyes those who happily live religious life are a sort of super heroes. It has so many sacrifices that in my opinion it requires much more detachment (no more family visits whenever a person desires, no more own possessions, you can't freely go out of the convent and do a walk or go to seaside if a day you wish to, you have to ask for permission for everything, no sex, no your own children, no friends that you can call and see whenever you want, no free use of PC, television, cinema etc etc etc...) But all of this is said from a person who do not dismiss at all married life, but, simply, recognizes that religious life has its challenges, and which challenges! For this reason I am really happy to see so many persons here who feel called to it, and at the same time I am super happy when I see persons happy of their life as religious! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlySunshine Posted July 4, 2012 Author Share Posted July 4, 2012 (edited) I don't mean to be rude, but I feel like this topic has gotten off track. Could the marriage talk be taken to either Open Mic or Raising Small Humans since dUSt doesn't want this board turning into marriage discussion? Edited July 4, 2012 by MaterMisericordiae Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
organwerke Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 [quote name='MaterMisericordiae' timestamp='1341438532' post='2452391'] I don't mean to be rude, but I feel like this topic has gotten off track. Could the marriage talk be taken to either Open Mic or Raising Small Humans? [/quote] Sorry! I too have not the intentions to go on on the topic of married life. I was the one who started the derailing of the thread and I'm sorry for this. This was simply because seeing how many options and different kinds of living religious life there are, I thought that it was quite complicated to discern the "right" place in religious life (maybe more complicated then discerning marriage). This was my simple idea but I'm not interested in develop it furthermore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie de Sales Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Personally, I feel drawn to the cloistered life, but I would also like taking care of sick or old people. I'm not very sure of my vocation, but in this period I picture myself as a carmelite nun, I love them, I'm taking as a model St Teresa of Lisieux. Hopefully I will become one of them one day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i<3franciscans Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 missionary and active/contemplative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheresaThoma Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 active/contemplative or active. Probably more towards the active/contemplative side though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emmaberry Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Julie de Sales' timestamp='1342109889' post='2454979'] Personally, I feel drawn to the cloistered life, but I would also like taking care of sick or old people. I'm not very sure of my vocation, but in this period I picture myself as a carmelite nun, I love them, I'm taking as a model St Teresa of Lisieux. Hopefully I will become one of them one day [/quote] Julie, you should look into the: -Carmelite sisters for the Aged and Infirm. Link: [url="http://www.carmelitesisters.com/"]http://www.carmelitesisters.com/[/url] -Carmelites sisters of the Divine Heart of Jesus. Here is a link for their one of their homes for the aged: [url="http://www.carmelitedcjnorth.org/pages_ministries/stjosephsaged.html"]http://www.carmelite...osephsaged.html[/url] Link for all provinces in the US: [url="http://www.carmelitedcj.org/convents_n_amer.asp"]http://www.carmelite...ents_n_amer.asp[/url] From the central province DCJ site: [b]"Apostolate[/b] [size=4][font=Times New Roman,Georgia,Times]We provide "A Home Away from Home" for children and the elderly. In our Central Province, the Sisters care for the elderly at [b][url="http://www.stagneshome.com/"]St. Agnes Home[/url] [/b]in Kirkwood, MO and [url="http://www.carmelhomeky.org/"][b]Carmel Home[/b][/url] in Owensboro, KY. "[/font][/size] [size=4][font=Times New Roman,Georgia,Times]Prayers for your discernment![/font][/size] Edited July 30, 2012 by emmaberry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlySunshine Posted July 31, 2012 Author Share Posted July 31, 2012 [quote name='Julie de Sales' timestamp='1342109889' post='2454979'] Personally, I feel drawn to the cloistered life, but I would also like taking care of sick or old people. I'm not very sure of my vocation, but in this period I picture myself as a carmelite nun, I love them, I'm taking as a model St Teresa of Lisieux. Hopefully I will become one of them one day [/quote] It's tough to figure these things out, isn't it? If you feel called to both Carmelites and the care of the aged, I would 100% recommend the Carmelite Sisters of the Divine Heart of Jesus. They have 3 provinces in the USA. My friend, Sr. Mary Elizabeth, is a first year novice in the [url="http://www.carmelitedcj.org"]Central Province located in Kirkwood, MO[/url] (they also have an elderly home in Owensboro, KY). I discerned with the [url="http://www.carmelitedcjnorth.org/"]Northern Province[/url] in 2009 and nearly entered there. They have houses in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Indiana. It's also worth mentioning if you enter a monastery that has elderly nuns, you could be stationed in the infirmary. When I considered the idea of Carmelite monasteries, the Vocation Director told me this too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emmaberry Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 [quote name='MaterMisericordiae' timestamp='1343692865' post='2460451'] It's also worth mentioning if you enter a monastery that has elderly nuns, you could be stationed in the infirmary. When I considered the idea of Carmelite monasteries, the Vocation Director told me this too. [/quote] Great advice here-since so many (like myself) don't feel comfortable taking care of the aged and infirm-aka I would if asked under obedience but I am not confident in this area at all-if you made your desire known, I am sure the nuns would love to station you in the infirmary with their ill! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tally Marx Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 1. Semi-contemplative 2. Active/contemplative 3. Missionary In that order. I'm open to all of them, but I've only ever really felt drawn to these three, and the first far more than the other two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Flower Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 I've been changing my mind a lot in the past few years, but right now I feel strongly called to contemplative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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