Aspies In The Church

[Lil Red]

[quote name='arfink' timestamp='1340818086' post='2449468']
It's all good, thanks for playing the game with me.
[/quote]

it's all good? seriously?

[arfink]

[quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1340818367' post='2449472']
it's all good? seriously?
[/quote]

I imply merely that I was not offended by your statements. My apologies.

Sorry I compared your attitude to that of "getting the job done." I arseumed that when you said

[quote] but give youth ministers a break. unless they have something from a parent or doctor that says, "Hey, this kid has this disorder", they shouldn't just trust a kid who says "hey, i have aspberger's (or whatever disorder)". otherwise (and I've seen it), kids will try to pull anything to get out of doing something they don't want to, because they can blame it on such-and-such disorder.[/quote]

you were meaning that such an approach must be done out of expediency.

[franciscanheart]

[quote name='arfink' timestamp='1340817727' post='2449465']
Back on topic then: There will always be people with attitudes like Lil Red's. They mean well and just need to get their jobs done, but they don't trust you.

This is remarkably common, and while I'd like to say there's an easy way to deal with this, there isn't. You sometimes just have to suffer with the fact that people will not accept you easily.
[/quote]
That was rude.

To the OP: Not everyone will have every answer. There is certainly beauty in a solitary life, but it's not common or for everyone. Asperger's is a relatively newly diagnosed disorder, and I'm not sure there's really a cultural norm in the Church for people who have it.

There would be, it seems to me, a pretty common sense approach to events like would be held in youth ministries though. That is, if you are uncomfortable by large group settings and places where the NORM is to engage with lots of other people on a pretty consistent basis, maybe it isn't for you! That's okay. No one is suggesting that you must participate in such ministries.

[arfink]

[quote name='franciscanheart' timestamp='1340818717' post='2449474']
That was rude.

To the OP: Not everyone will have every answer. There is certainly beauty in a solitary life, but it's not common or for everyone. Asperger's is a relatively newly diagnosed disorder, and I'm not sure there's really a cultural norm in the Church for people who have it.

[/quote]

Except to act as though it isn't real unless a trained pro tells you otherwise. That's offensive to me.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='arfink' timestamp='1340818710' post='2449473']I imply merely that I was not offended by your statements. My apologies.

Sorry I compared your attitude to that of "getting the job done." I arseumed that when you said


you were meaning that such an approach must be done out of expediency.[/quote]

[quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1340818228' post='2449471']
honestly, i'm really offended by your post, arfink. you have no idea what i was like as a youth minister. it wasn't just "a job" to me. i loved my kids. (i still love them!) but there will always be kids who try to pull stunt after stunt. and a youth minister will know when a kid is bs'ing them. that's what i was trying to say when i don't "trust a kid" like that. you have no idea the heart & soul & blood I put into youth ministry. and you have no idea what it's like to be a youth minister until you're in the trenches. it's easy to sit up on a pedestal and judge from up there, but youth ministers get crap from all sides.
[/quote]

[franciscanheart]

[quote name='arfink' timestamp='1340818809' post='2449475']
Except to act as though it isn't real unless a trained pro tells you otherwise. That's offensive to me.
[/quote]
I'm sorry, have you been diagnosed with Asperger's?

You are getting your panties in a wad over nothing at all, over something that doesn't even affect you. Kids LIE. All the time. That's all we're saying. If a child actually does have Asperger's, you'd better believe parents are sharing that information with the right people.

Pretty sure no one here has said or suggested that anyone would be forced to do anything. If you don't like group activity, don't go.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='arfink' timestamp='1340818809' post='2449475']
Except to act as though it isn't real unless a trained pro tells you otherwise. That's offensive to me.
[/quote]
so, every youth minister should just trust every kid who comes along and says, "I have Aspberger's, I can't do that."? seriously? so someone is "offensive" because they'd trust a diagnosis over an opinion?

Edited June 27, 2012 by Lil Red
worded too strongly

[Lil Red]

[quote name='franciscanheart' timestamp='1340818973' post='2449477']
I'm sorry, have you been diagnosed with Asperger's?

You are getting your panties in a wad over nothing at all. Kids LIE. All the time. That's all we're saying. If a child actually does have Asperger's, you'd better believe parents are sharing that information with the right people.

Pretty sure no one here has said or suggested that anyone would be forced to do anything. If you don't like group activity, don't go.
[/quote]

EXACTLY!

[franciscanheart]

Another thing, most kids with Asperger's aren't going to be able to TELL YOU that they can't do something for one reason or another. Most of the people I know who live with Asperger's have different ways of coping with situations that are uncomfortable to them. They don't pick up on social cues, vocal cues, or body language. They are not just introverts, they have Asperger's.

There's a real difference.

Arfink, you're making horrible as[i][/i]sumptions about people and really harping on Red like she's done something wrong. She's not hateful, judgmental or as[i][/i]sumptive and yet that is how you are painting her to a new member of our phorums. In fact, that's how you're painting the CHURCH. How awful! You don't know Red, you didn't experience her youth group, you aren't a youth minister, and you don't have Asperger's.

I understand being pas[i][/i]sionate, compas[i][/i]sionate, and empathetic, but there is a line and you have sprinted past it in this short thread. You have no idea, and yet you are smearing someone TO THEIR FACE. Cut it out, dude. It's not razzle dazzle.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='franciscanheart' timestamp='1340819370' post='2449481']Another thing, most kids with Asperger's aren't going to be able to TELL YOU that they can't do something for one reason or another. Most of the people I know who live with Asperger's have different ways of coping with situations that are uncomfortable to them. They don't pick up on social cues, vocal cues, or body language. They are not just introverts, they have Asperger's.[/quote]

good point.

[arfink]

Lil Red- I have been burned more times than I can count by people who have your exact same attitude. I don't know if it's a result of that viewpoint which you share or if it's just a coincidence, but you should know that.

As an added bonus hint, if you ever really want to cut an introvert deep, make him burn inside, and generally make him hate you, just tell him you don't trust him. Tell him his intuition is wrong, and the only reason you give is because you've had some other kid lie to you about this stuff.

Sorry I tried to fire back at you.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='arfink' timestamp='1340821192' post='2449495']
Lil Red- I have been burned more times than I can count by people who have your exact same attitude. I don't know if it's a result of that viewpoint which you share or if it's just a coincidence, but you should know that.

As an added bonus hint, if you ever really want to cut an introvert deep, make him burn inside, and generally make him hate you, just tell him you don't trust him. Tell him his intuition is wrong, and the only reason you give is because you've had some other kid lie to you about this stuff.

Sorry I tried to fire back at you.[/quote]

you have so mis-understood what I was saying, it's not even funny. i'm talking about diagnosis of disorders, not introvertedness (not a word, but oh well). [b]i have specifically said that many times in this thread.[/b] why would i, when a kid says, "oh i'm an introvert", respond, "oh, you're lying"???? for realz? i wouldn't even say that if a kid said, "i have aspbergers" (I'd go to their parent and talk with them about it).

edit: I think you're still trying to paint me as this hateful, awful youth minister-y person. if you want to hate me because of what I've posted in this thread, if you want to make me stand in for every person who has cut you down, go ahead. but that's not what I've done or who i am, in my life as a youth minister or in my life now.

Edited June 27, 2012 by Lil Red

[MissScripture]

[quote name='arfink' timestamp='1340821192' post='2449495']
Lil Red- I have been burned more times than I can count by people who have your exact same attitude. I don't know if it's a result of that viewpoint which you share or if it's just a coincidence, but you should know that.

As an added bonus hint, if you ever really want to cut an introvert deep, make him burn inside, and generally make him hate you, just tell him you don't trust him. Tell him his intuition is wrong, and the only reason you give is because you've had some other kid lie to you about this stuff.

Sorry I tried to fire back at you.
[/quote]
So, please tell us how Youth Ministry *should* be done.

[franciscanheart]

[quote name='arfink' timestamp='1340821192' post='2449495']
As an added bonus hint, if you ever really want to cut an introvert deep, make him burn inside, and generally make him hate you, just tell him you don't trust him. Tell him his intuition is wrong, and the only reason you give is because you've had some other kid lie to you about this stuff.
[/quote]
I know this wasn't directed at me, but why does this have anything to do with being an introvert? Most everyone I know would be insulted if you they were told they were not trusted.

[IcePrincessKRS]

[quote name='arfink' timestamp='1340821192' post='2449495']
Lil Red- I have been burned more times than I can count by people who have your exact same attitude. I don't know if it's a result of that viewpoint which you share or if it's just a coincidence, but you should know that.

As an added bonus hint, if you ever really want to cut an introvert deep, make him burn inside, and generally make him hate you, just tell him you don't trust him. Tell him his intuition is wrong, and the only reason you give is because you've had some other kid lie to you about this stuff.

Sorry I tried to fire back at you.
[/quote]

Sorry if this comes across as a bunch of people ganging up on you... but your second paragraph... perhaps you missed the post where Red says she IS an introvert, too. I don't think you need to give her any lessons in how to treat them; she's lived it, youth ministry aside.

(This thread has really changed drastically since I looked at it last night. )