Lcwr Communities

[EmilyAnn]

The video on 'Sisters in Crisis' is very interesting. And I think the first video really emphasises a key point that the media seems to overlook - the LCWR represents the superiors who are members, not all sisters.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='andibc' timestamp='1341943448' post='2454376']
I have not read all of this thread so perhaps someone has already suggested "Sisters in Crises" which devels deeply into what happened and why both psychologically, politically and culturally. The author of "Sisters in Crises" spent years studying the situation; it's a very enlightening read showing that it's not all as simple as it may seem at first glance. You can also watch interviews with her, here
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3QJw5_sbEo[/media]
and here
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xv3qvEbOAzc[/media]
[/quote]
Excellent summation.

[she_who_is_not]

Has anyone read the Systems Thinking Handbook? I downloaded it and skimmed through it and I found it troubling.

[HopefulBride]

Where can it be found?

[she_who_is_not]

https://lcwr.org/resources/systems-thinking-handbook

[she_who_is_not]

I was thinking about this over dinner. I'm a member of the Democratic party, due to the fact that the local government where I grew up and now live again is entirely run by Democrats and I need to vote in the Democratic primary to have any control over who holds local office. If someone were to publish a list of all Democrats and label us "Abortion Supporters" or something similar, I would be sad and probably offended. This perspective helps me to understand where many sisters and communities in the LCWR are coming from. It also seems sad to me that some of the orders who are entirely orthodox in their theological opinion may not feel welcome in the CMSWR because they do not wear a habit. There has to be some way to bridge the gap. We need to remember how susceptible all religious are to spiritual attack and pray for them with vigilance and fervor.

Just musing.

[emmaberry]

[quote name='she_who_is_not' timestamp='1341963022' post='2454511']
I was thinking about this over dinner. I'm a member of the Democratic party, due to the fact that the local government where I grew up and now live again is entirely run by Democrats and I need to vote in the Democratic primary to have any control over who holds local office. If someone were to publish a list of all Democrats and label us "Abortion Supporters" or something similar, I would be sad and probably offended. This perspective helps me to understand where many sisters and communities in the LCWR are coming from. It also seems sad to me that some of the orders who are entirely orthodox in their theological opinion may not feel welcome in the CMSWR because they do not wear a habit. There has to be some way to bridge the gap. We need to remember how susceptible all religious are to spiritual attack and pray for them with vigilance and fervor.

Just musing.
[/quote]

Good musings for reflection, SWIN. I really like your post because it states your opinion but is not accusatory. I wish all my posts were the same!

Of course, the Church says that your duty is to vote for the candidate that will do lesser harm...in this case you are valid in voting democrat because a republican vote that might be more pro-life would almost be like not voting at all. This could be compared to those in the LCWR who do not agree with its statements against the Church, but for various reasons, as Sister Marie explained when she was here, feel obligated to remain members. I am sure you know all this, I am just musing as well. As for the habits, I wasn't aware the CMSWR only included habited communities, so that is interesting.

Regardless, I think a lot of members of PM (and the general public) seem to think that we need to trip over ourselves to say that there are innocents in these dissonant groups...but they are the exception, not the rule. I can understand the hurt that may be happening to these orthodox sisters, just as you might be hurt by comments about pro-abortion Dems, but it almost seems like you are wanting people to stop saying abortion is wrong in the Democratic group (and others) because it hurts your feelings, and this cannot be done. Again, it almost seems like those who keep saying 'There are innocent communities in the LCWR!' and trying to make people feel guilty for standing behind the Church in its investigation of the LCWR. This is not right...we cannot refuse to say that Democrats tend towards being pro-choice or that the LCWR has serious problems in order to make everyone in those groups feel happy or accepted. In the name of love and charity, we cannot disintegrate into the 'Your okay, I am okay' relativism of today. It is a hard balance to strike.

My only problem comes with people who say 'shame on you' for saying the LCWR has issues because they know innocent sisters within. Orthodox communities within the LCWR need to not be defensive, but accept that the benefits of being in the LCWR outweigh the explanations they will have to give for being in the organization. This is opportunity cost.

I don't think it is mine (or any other orthodox Catholic's) job to put disclaimers on every statement about the LCWR so as not to defend the innocent sisters within. When the Vatican put out the official statements about investigating the LCWR, they did not say 'but there are many orthodox communities within, etc.' We can use those disclaimers for the sake of charity, especially on PM, but it is not our duty. Just as when we say couples living together before marriage is wrong and don't name all the exceptional circumstances where this is okay, so we can say the LCWR is under investigation and not feel the need to go on about innocent sisters within. If people are living together for some extraordinary reason but living chastely, they can't get upset at everyone who assumes they are living in sin. They would accept that it is their job to explain their circumstances to people so as not to scandalize them. I don't see how the LCWR situation is any different. Situations like this are great for learning not to judge others, but some form of discernment (another way of saying judge) is needed for choosing a community in line with Rome.

Sorry for the long post, again I am just musing.

Edited July 11, 2012 by emmaberry

[Gemma]

[quote name='emmaberry' timestamp='1339965003' post='2445560']
Hello!

My dad keeps firing questions at me about whether or not the communities I am looking at, all cloistered contemplatives, are members of the LCWR. I am having a hard time finding whether PCCS are a part of the LCWR. I know each Poor Clare community is autonomous, and some are members of federations (for example the Federation of Mary Immaculate.) so does that mean they aren't part of the LCWR/CMSR/etc? Are there any traditional cloistered communities in the LCWR?

Thanks!!
[/quote]

To answer your original question, I do not know of any cloisters that are members of LCWR. I had been under the impression that membership in that organization was primarily for active communities, but I may be incorrect on that.

Blessings,
Gemma

[Gemma]

[quote name='she_who_is_not' timestamp='1341963022' post='2454511']
I was thinking about this over dinner. I'm a member of the Democratic party, due to the fact that the local government where I grew up and now live again is entirely run by Democrats and I need to vote in the Democratic primary to have any control over who holds local office. If someone were to publish a list of all Democrats and label us "Abortion Supporters" or something similar, I would be sad and probably offended. This perspective helps me to understand where many sisters and communities in the LCWR are coming from. It also seems sad to me that some of the orders who are entirely orthodox in their theological opinion may not feel welcome in the CMSWR because they do not wear a habit. There has to be some way to bridge the gap. We need to remember how susceptible all religious are to spiritual attack and pray for them with vigilance and fervor.

Just musing.
[/quote]

There is a non-habited community in the CMSWR. They were founded in Poland during persecution. I think the Society Devoted to the Sacred Heart, which does not wear a veil, is also a member.

Blessings,
Gemma

[Gemma]

[quote name='EmilyAnn' timestamp='1341948234' post='2454412']
The video on 'Sisters in Crisis' is very interesting. And I think the first video really emphasises a key point that the media seems to overlook - the LCWR represents the superiors who are members, not all sisters.
[/quote]

You'll find very few actual Christians in the media. Most of it has been infiltrated by leftists, among them are pagans. It's exceptionally bad in Canada. Wherever you see an emphasis on "reproductive rights," you're likely dealing with pagans. It is their stated purpose to destroy the Judeo-Christian God. They have deliberately gone into the media for the sake of obtaining this goal.

That tidbit aside, most reporters are unevangelized, or are of other faith traditions, and just simply don't understand Catholic religious life.

Nobody produced a press kit for this. We can only expect mistakes because of it. Perhaps EWTN can pick up the slack on that.

Blessings,
Gemma

[Antigonos]

[quote name='Gemma' timestamp='1342173969' post='2455268']
You'll find very few actual Christians in the media. Most of it has been infiltrated by leftists, among them are pagans. It's exceptionally bad in Canada. Wherever you see an emphasis on "reproductive rights," you're likely dealing with pagans. It is their stated purpose to destroy the Judeo-Christian God. They have deliberately gone into the media for the sake of obtaining this goal.

That tidbit aside, most reporters are unevangelized, or are of other faith traditions, and just simply don't understand Catholic religious life.

Nobody produced a press kit for this. We can only expect mistakes because of it. Perhaps EWTN can pick up the slack on that.

Blessings,
Gemma
[/quote]

Somehow, I doubt that they are really "pagans". I think you meant either agnostics, atheists, or just plain religiously indifferent. "Pagan" refers to a definite belief system in which there is worship of a physical god or gods.

[Mary's Margaret]

Gemma....are you Canadian?

[Lumiere]

[quote name='Gemma' timestamp='1342173969' post='2455268']
You'll find very few actual Christians in the media. Most of it has been infiltrated by leftists, among them are pagans. It's exceptionally bad in Canada. Wherever you see an emphasis on "reproductive rights," you're likely dealing with pagans. It is their stated purpose to destroy the Judeo-Christian God. They have deliberately gone into the media for the sake of obtaining this goal.

That tidbit aside, most reporters are unevangelized, or are of other faith traditions, and just simply don't understand Catholic religious life.

Nobody produced a press kit for this. We can only expect mistakes because of it. Perhaps EWTN can pick up the slack on that.

Blessings,
Gemma
[/quote]

What absolute nonsense!

[Gemma]

[quote name='Antigonos' timestamp='1342176040' post='2455277']


Somehow, I doubt that they are really "pagans". I think you meant either agnostics, atheists, or just plain religiously indifferent. "Pagan" refers to a definite belief system in which there is worship of a physical god or gods.
[/quote]

Yes, I do mean pagans. It's all over the place now. But that is not what this thread is about, so I must end this particular post here.

Blessings,
Gemma

[Gemma]

[quote name='Mary's Margaret' timestamp='1342176106' post='2455278']
Gemma....are you Canadian?
[/quote]

No, but I have fielded a lot of prayer requests from Canada. The film board up there produced a pagan movie. Abortion is part of their nationalized healthcare, and sidewalk counseling is prohibited.

Blessings,
Gemma