How Can A Faithful Catholic Be A Democrat?

[Groo the Wanderer]

Personally, I do not understand how a FAITHFUL Catholic can be a democrat. Let me preface this discussion by stating I am neither a Democrat nor a Republican. When it comes to politics, I am a Catholic - I follow the guidelines of the Church when voting and evaluate the candidates first on the 'non-negotiables' then on anything that is important to me individually.

That said, the published platform of the Democrat Party ([url="http://www.democrats.org/about/party_platform"]http://www.democrats.org/about/party_platform[/url]) has clear contradictions to the non-negotiables of the Catholic Church ([url="http://www.politicalresponsibility.com/voterguide.htm"]http://www.politicalresponsibility.com/voterguide.htm[/url]):

1. Democrat Party supports abortion rights and birth control to all women - violates point 1 of the Catholic non-negotiables
2. Democrat Party supports embryonic stem cell research - violates point 2 of the Catholic non-negotiables
3. Democrat Party supports the UN Population Fund which calls for the spread of abortion and contraception services throughout developing countries - violates point 1 of the Catholic non-negotiables
4. Democrat Party supports eliminating any discrimination based on gender identity in any situation, including allowing same-sex 'marriage' - violates point 5 of the Catholic non-negotiables

Additionally, the published platform of the Democratic Party states:
1. Faith-based organizations are not a replacement for government programs
2. A quality public (government run) education is the birthright of every child - a slap in the face of private and parochial school systems, including that of the Catholic Church

I will not go into the many other points within their platform with which I disagree. The purpose here is to focus on those point in direct opposition to the Church and her teachings.


So with all that - please please please tell me how in good conscience a faithful, practicing Catholic can be a member of the Democrat Party? (the same argument can likely be said of the Republican Party, but that is another thread for another time)

[Kia ora]

Oh boy...

[Basilisa Marie]

You can "belong" to a party and still not agree with everything they stand for. Catholic Answers and their "Voter's Guide" isn't the Vatican (NOT to say it doesn't have good points, just that it doesn't have the same weight as the Vatican). Faith-based programs AREN'T a [i]replacement [/i]for government programs. Government programs have a broader audience. Every child should have the opportunity for education, and last time I checked Catholic schools were still expensive, generally speaking. Public school doesn't mean it's the [i]only [/i]school.

Republicans would rather give the rich tax cuts and get the money to cover our national debt from everyone else, particular programs that serve the poor and fund education. Most Republicans support the death penalty (which is completely inexcusable for pro-life Americans). I only bring it up because even though it may be another thread for another time, talking about how Catholics supposedly can't be Democrats makes it sound like the only other option is to be a Republican. BOTH parties smell of elderberries.

[MIKolbe]

[quote](the same argument can likely be said of the Republican Party, but that is another thread for another time)
[/quote]

indeed, and more.

[Groo the Wanderer]

[quote name='Basilisa Marie' timestamp='1336739793' post='2429736']
You can "belong" to a party and still not agree with everything they stand for. Catholic Answers and their "Voter's Guide" isn't the Vatican (NOT to say it doesn't have good points, just that it doesn't have the same weight as the Vatican). Faith-based programs AREN'T a [i]replacement [/i]for government programs. Government programs have a broader audience. Every child should have the opportunity for education, and last time I checked Catholic schools were still expensive, generally speaking. Public school doesn't mean it's the [i]only [/i]school.

Republicans would rather give the rich tax cuts and get the money to cover our national debt from everyone else, particular programs that serve the poor and fund education. Most Republicans support the death penalty (which is completely inexcusable for pro-life Americans). I only bring it up because even though it may be another thread for another time, talking about how Catholics supposedly can't be Democrats makes it sound like the only other option is to be a Republican. BOTH parties smell of elderberries.
[/quote]

respectfully, you didn't read what i posted. this is not a rep vs dem thing. this is a discussion about how one can in good conscience be a member of a party whose espoused, published platform lies in diametric opposition to the teachings of the Church.

you can find the same in the USCCB guide ([url="http://www.usccb.org/issues-and-action/faithful-citizenship/upload/forming-consciences-for-faithful-citizenship.pdf"]http://www.usccb.org/issues-and-action/faithful-citizenship/upload/forming-consciences-for-faithful-citizenship.pdf[/url])


[quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1336742762' post='2429744']
indeed, and more.
[/quote]

same for you

Edited May 11, 2012 by Groo the Wanderer

[MIKolbe]

stop trying to put Jesus in a box, with either a "D" or an "R" on it.

[Groo the Wanderer]

please actually read the question. this is not a D or R thing. i have a legitimate question about something that seriously confounds me. all you yahoos want to do is turn it into a dem/rep thing.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Groo the Wanderer' timestamp='1336737907' post='2429733']
Personally, I do not understand how a FAITHFUL Catholic can be a democrat. Let me preface this discussion by stating I am neither a Democrat nor a Republican. When it comes to politics, I am a Catholic - I follow the guidelines of the Church when voting and evaluate the candidates first on the 'non-negotiables' then on anything that is important to me individually.

That said, the published platform of the Democrat Party ([url="http://www.democrats.org/about/party_platform"]http://www.democrats.../party_platform[/url]) has clear contradictions to the non-negotiables of the Catholic Church ([url="http://www.politicalresponsibility.com/voterguide.htm"]http://www.political.../voterguide.htm[/url]):

1. Democrat Party supports abortion rights and birth control to all women - violates point 1 of the Catholic non-negotiables
2. Democrat Party supports embryonic stem cell research - violates point 2 of the Catholic non-negotiables
3. Democrat Party supports the UN Population Fund which calls for the spread of abortion and contraception services throughout developing countries - violates point 1 of the Catholic non-negotiables
4. Democrat Party supports eliminating any discrimination based on gender identity in any situation, including allowing same-sex 'marriage' - violates point 5 of the Catholic non-negotiables

Additionally, the published platform of the Democratic Party states:
1. Faith-based organizations are not a replacement for government programs
2. A quality public (government run) education is the birthright of every child - a slap in the face of private and parochial school systems, including that of the Catholic Church

I will not go into the many other points within their platform with which I disagree. The purpose here is to focus on those point in direct opposition to the Church and her teachings.


So with all that - please please please tell me how in good conscience a faithful, practicing Catholic can be a member of the Democrat Party? (the same argument can likely be said of the Republican Party, but that is another thread for another time)
[/quote]

I can belong to it because in my area the republicans can't get elected to anything, and if I want to have any impact in a primary I have to register Democrat. I look for the candidate that does the least damage in the primary, and them vote my choice in the general election,

[Groo the Wanderer]

that makes sense cmom. thank you.

[BG45]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' timestamp='1336746695' post='2429768']
I can belong to it because in my area the republicans can't get elected to anything, and if I want to have any impact in a primary I have to register Democrat. I look for the candidate that does the least damage in the primary, and them vote my choice in the general election,
[/quote]

What she said. Which is usually what this has come down to every time it comes up.

[PadrePioOfPietrelcino]

[quote name='Basilisa Marie' timestamp='1336739793' post='2429736']
You can "belong" to a party and still not agree with everything they stand for. Catholic Answers and their "Voter's Guide" isn't the Vatican (NOT to say it doesn't have good points, just that it doesn't have the same weight as the Vatican).
[/quote]

Except the voter guide provided DOES have the quotations from the CCC and applicable encyclicals. So the five points ARE from the Vatican...

I think cmom has pointed out the only legitimate time one can be BOTH a D and faithful, although...I think a legitimate argument can be made that voting for the lesser of two evils is still evil, and that it is not a "wasted" vote to vote for the person who upholds the views the best even if popular culture is saying they are "unelectable"

[havok579257]

[quote name='Groo the Wanderer' timestamp='1336745744' post='2429762']
please actually read the question. this is not a D or R thing. i have a legitimate question about something that seriously confounds me. all you yahoos want to do is turn it into a dem/rep thing.
[/quote]

except you made this a democrat and republican thing by singling out one party and attacking it while leaving the other party untouched. if you would have asked how can a catholic be a republican and a democrat since both are pro death then you wouldn't have this arguement but when you single out one party and leave the other untouched, this is what you will get.

[qfnol31]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1336758001' post='2429824']


except you made this a democrat and republican thing by singling out one party and attacking it while leaving the other party untouched. if you would have asked how can a catholic be a republican and a democrat since both are pro death then you wouldn't have this arguement but when you single out one party and leave the other untouched, this is what you will get.
[/quote]He could be a Libertarian like most people here and still ask the same question without implying anything about Republicans.

[Groo the Wanderer]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1336758001' post='2429824']
except you made this a democrat and republican thing by singling out one party and attacking it while leaving the other party untouched. if you would have asked how can a catholic be a republican and a democrat since both are pro death then you wouldn't have this arguement but when you single out one party and leave the other untouched, this is what you will get.
[/quote]

No i did not. I specifically mention it WAS NOT an R/D thing. I also stated I am neither.

I singled out the Dems because to me they seem more reprehensible as a party than the GOP. GOP smells of elderberries the big one too as far as I am concerned. But I am strongly pro-life, pro-marriage, pro-family, pro-Catholic and it seems to me that the Dems are anti all of that. That is why I framed my thread in this way.

This ain't an either or. There are many many choices other than GOP if you are not a Dem. Your statement is fallacious and smacks of partisanship. Report to the IAABC thread immediately.

[Anomaly]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1336758001' post='2429824']
except you made this a democrat and republican thing by singling out one party and attacking it while leaving the other party untouched. if you would have asked how can a catholic be a republican and a democrat since both are pro death then you wouldn't have this arguement but when you single out one party and leave the other untouched, this is what you will get.
[/quote]We all know that politicians often say one thing and do another. I personally find it hilarious that Catholics will defend a political party that specifically says it is pro-abortion when the alternate party has anti-abortion as part of it's platform.

Makes perfect Catholic sense to say it's more likely to get a political party to do the [b]opposite[/b] of what it says it wants to do instead of getting the opposing party to [b]actually do [/b]what it says it wants to do regarding the Catholic non-negotiables of abortion, same sex marriage, etc. The dead horse debate of the morality of a Catholic voting for an imperfect candidate to justify voting for Obama who is pro-abortion and pro-same sex marriage is also ridiculous since most Catholics voted for Obama and Democrats. I guess it's just natural for the majority of Catholics to prefer being told what's nicer and 'gooder' then reasoning it out for themselves.