faithcecelia Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 [quote name='Totus Tuus' timestamp='1325112721' post='2358724'] I agree, except that many of those discerning marriage are underage, and that forum is not appropriate for anyone that young. [/quote] My view on this (as I stated further up this thread) is that if they truely are too young to discuss sex and procreation, then they are also too young to be talking about sacrificing those things by making a vow of chastity. Good, solid formation includes dealing with the fact that we are sexual beings with natural desires and instincts. If we think it inappropriate for 14yr olds to read about sex, then they are too young to read about celibacy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totus Tuus Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 [quote name='faithcecelia' timestamp='1325113042' post='2358727'] My view on this (as I stated further up this thread) is that if they truely are too young to discuss sex and procreation, then they are also too young to be talking about sacrificing those things by making a vow of chastity. Good, solid formation includes dealing with the fact that we are sexual beings with natural desires and instincts. If we think it inappropriate for 14yr olds to read about sex, then they are too young to read about celibacy. [/quote] I totally disagree. First of all, VS focuses on vocations to religious life, not the vow of chastity specifically, so there isn't tons of focus on it, and therefore there isn't tons of focus on what it entails. RSH, on the other hand, is technically a forum to discuss NFP AND marriage and family. Much more focus on sex-related topics. You can vaguely discuss the vow of chastity on VS without getting into the kinds of detail you get into on RSH (for heaven's sake, we learn the two commandments against violating impurity when we're toddlers- that doesn't mean we need to know what sex entails). And another thing, talking about the vow of chastity is talking about something very general that applies to many, many people. A lot of the issues discussed in RSH are specific to particular individuals who would not feel free to openly discuss such things if they knew that young kids were reading. I for one would stop posting there if it were opened up to people under 18. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah147 Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 [quote name='AnneLine' timestamp='1325098255' post='2358628'] .....but I think this is worthy of some discussion and definitely for some prayerful thought about what the Holy Spirit is saying here. …. But I would be curious to know what the board users would find helpful, too. What would help you in your discernment? Perhaps ... could the the Holy Spirit be prompting a new category? [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithcecelia Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Totus Tuus' timestamp='1325113406' post='2358729'] I totally disagree. First of all, VS focuses on vocations to religious life, not the vow of chastity specifically, so there isn't tons of focus on it, and therefore there isn't tons of focus on what it entails. RSH, on the other hand, is technically a forum to discuss NFP AND marriage and family. Much more focus on sex-related topics. You can vaguely discuss the vow of chastity on VS without getting into the kinds of detail you get into on RSH (for heaven's sake, we learn the two commandments against violating impurity when we're toddlers- that doesn't mean we need to know what sex entails). And another thing, talking about the vow of chastity is talking about something very general that applies to many, many people. A lot of the issues discussed in RSH are specific to particular individuals who would not feel free to openly discuss such things if they knew that young kids were reading. [b]I for one would stop posting there if it were opened up to people under 18.[/b] [/quote] But most countries allow marriage (with parental consent) from 16. Indeed, its 14 for the Vatican! These young brides are as likely to need guidance in NFP, pregnancy, breastfeeding etc as older women - possibly more for the very young as their menstrual cycles may not have become regular. Edit - many Southern US Stares also allow vey young marriages too - 13 for the girl in New Hampshire! They could have 4 kids before they were old enough to read RSH! I'm not actually saying make RSH an unprotected forum, more let VS be protected. Edited December 28, 2011 by faithcecelia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totus Tuus Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 [quote name='faithcecelia' timestamp='1325114057' post='2358743'] But most countries allow marriage (with parental consent) from 16. Indeed, its 14 for the Vatican! These young brides are as likely to need guidance in NFP, pregnancy, breastfeeding etc as older women - possibly more for the very young as their menstrual sycles may not have become regular. I'm not actually saying make RSH an unprotected forum, more let VS be protected. [/quote] I personally have not seen one person on PM get married at the age of 14 or 16. If you know one, point them out to me. But my comments were *clearly* directed at PM posters, not people in countries where little girls are mature enough to get married in their young teens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithcecelia Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 [quote name='Totus Tuus' timestamp='1325114233' post='2358748'] I personally have not seen one person on PM get married at the age of 14 or 16. If you know one, point them out to me. But my comments were *clearly* directed at PM posters, not people in countries where little girls are mature enough to get married in their young teens. [/quote] No, but there are discerners of those ages, and that is what concerns me. I do not think it appriopriate that we have one rule for those seeking one vocation and another for those seeking another. I havent yet had the right opportunity, but if it comes up I would certainly be interested to know if a girl of 12/13 who is *certain* they are called to religious life would feel ready to get married if they felt their calling was marriage. I suspect none would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah147 Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) If another board were made for marriage, I question how many people would visit? It just seems that when we allow marriage threads here, everyone discerning various vocations, coming from different walks of life, notice the threads on VS and chime in, and it really helps the marriage threads. I think vocation station should be broadened to include marriage. Otherwise, please give a place where I can continue posting on the marriage threads on VS that I've been posting on...and please make a way to let others know the threads are open so people around here will give their wonderful comments. Edited December 28, 2011 by JoyfulLife Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FutureCarmeliteClaire Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Holy cow, that is crazy to ban VS to people under 14 because there is no conceivable way for anyone to know how much someone's parents have talked to them yet about sexuality, and if parents are letting their kids be on Phatmass and/or roam the internet on their own, then the teen should use discretion which 12 and 13 year olds (the ages of the two youngest members that I know of) are perfectly capable of. Marriage is totally different from the religious life in the aspect of sex, and I certainly am not fond of the hostility presented on certain occasions to young ones discerning their vocations. It seriously stinks when no one believes you, and I think I speak on behalf of the younger members of Phatmass when I say that we should not be banned from discerning or talking to others about it. I know for a fact that we young ones have questions for those who were in the religious life previously that we may be uncomfortable asking a nun outright.[quote name='JoyfulLife' timestamp='1325114720' post='2358755'] If another board were made for marriage, I question how many people would visit? It just seems that when we allow marriage threads here, everyone discerning various vocations, coming from different walks of life, notice the threads on VS and chime in, and it really helps the marriage threads. I think vocation station should be broadened to include marriage. Otherwise, please give a place where I can continue posting on the marriage threads on VS that I've been posting on...and please make a way to let others know the threads are open so people around here will give their wonderful comments. [/quote] I love your attitude with this, Joyful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithcecelia Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 [quote name='FutureCarmeliteClaire' timestamp='1325115047' post='2358762'] Holy cow, that is crazy to ban VS to people under 14 because there is no conceivable way for anyone to know how much someone's parents have talked to them yet about sexuality, and if parents are letting their kids be on Phatmass and/or roam the internet on their own, then the teen should use discretion which 12 and 13 year olds (the ages of the two youngest members that I know of) are perfectly capable of. Marriage is totally different from the religious life in the aspect of sex, and I certainly am not fond of the hostility presented on certain occasions to young ones discerning their vocations. It seriously stinks when no one believes you, and I think I speak on behalf of the younger members of Phatmass when I say that we should not be banned from discerning or talking to others about it. I know for a fact that we young ones have questions for those who were in the religious life previously that we may be uncomfortable asking a nun outright. I love your attitude with this, Joyful. [/quote] Its not a specific ban I am after, its a more level playing field. I for one have no issue whatever with there being some marriage threads here in VS - I think its a good idea - as the people who post here are the serious discerners seeking Gods will in their life, whatever it may be. You won't see it now as you are in the age group affected, but young teens usually do need reeling in a bit. Teens get over enthusiastic and quite 'black and white' about things. This is not a criticism, just an observation over the 11yrs I have worked with 11-14/5yr olds. I am sure in time you will see that, as I do having been one of the teens myself 3million years ago! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyAnn Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 [quote name='FutureCarmeliteClaire' timestamp='1325115047' post='2358762'] Holy cow, that is crazy to ban VS to people under 14 because there is no conceivable way for anyone to know how much someone's parents have talked to them yet about sexuality, and if parents are letting their kids be on Phatmass and/or roam the internet on their own, then the teen should use discretion which 12 and 13 year olds (the ages of the two youngest members that I know of) are perfectly capable of. Marriage is totally different from the religious life in the aspect of sex, and I certainly am not fond of the hostility presented on certain occasions to young ones discerning their vocations. It seriously stinks when no one believes you, and I think I speak on behalf of the younger members of Phatmass when I say that we should not be banned from discerning or talking to others about it. I know for a fact that we young ones have questions for those who were in the religious life previously that we may be uncomfortable asking a nun outright. [/quote] I agree that banning younger members is not the way to go. We need to encourage young people to discern God's will for them and allow them access to the wonderful resources this forum has to offer because lets face it the opposition in the world to discernment of religious life is growing. Younger members may also be more limited than older ones, perhaps less able to establish contact with communities, visit, simply meet nuns, etc. so this forum provides that as well. Though I will say try not to be too harsh on those who seem discouraging. There truly are some wisdoms that come with age - I feel hideously old and cliche when I say that but it really is true. Try to remember they are only trying to help. At 12 or 13 kids know about sex. They may be foggy in the particulars but they know about it, I sure did. Especially in our world, with the ever more 'liberal' views on sex we need more than ever to educate kids about sexual theology as soon as they are exposed to that knowledge, before they get sucked in by the culture. I often think my life would have been a lot different if I had ever been properly taught about sex (I wasn't, not at school and not by my parents). Chastity is part of that education, whether one is discerning marriage or religious life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i<3LSOP Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I really hope that they don't put an age limit on VS. I know I don't post on here much.... but I love reading all of the stories and posting my sense once in a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinaSt.Cecilia2772 Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Okay I'm probably gunna be shot down for this, but I'm gunna say it anyway. This is just an idea but I was wondering if in any way there could be a board specifically on topics about Catholic dating/courtship and marriage? In all honesty, I don't think Open Mic is the most appropriate place to post topics about marriage and dating/courtships because it can get lost in all the other topics about fifty bagillion other things, which can cause many distractions and not enough attention to these important topics. There are a lot of people on this phorum who are discerning different vocations and I agree that marriage and dating/courtship topics shouldn't be posted in VS, but they need a place of their own so they can be explored by discerning people in all its beautiful components and entirety. Open mic, in my opinion, isn't the place for it. Also many people want courtship and dating advice, and it needs more focus because marriage can't necessarily happen without it. I'm 17 and I'm starting to explore many different options in my vocational journey, and I know that would be beneficial not only to me but to many others on this phorum. It also is a phorm of phormation because if done in God's way it can make two people grow in holiness and in faith. It also helps for single people discerning because it really helps turn your life and yourself to Jesus and His plan. So it is a very important aspect of vocations that needs its own attention and more emphasis. As I said before, it's just an idea or suggestion. Agree or disagree on it, but ultimately I know its up to dUst to decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hermanita Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 [b]Many religious communities open their vocation retreats and days of discernment to young women 13 and older. I do believe it is important to remember when posting, the diversity we have here at Phatmass. It is a blessing and a responsability.[/b] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah147 Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) Please allow marriage threads on vs or a special place. Open mic isn't appropriate as others have said, and RSH is more about raising kids than dating, dating websites, courting, husbands, wives, etc. My own life may soon totally change; theses two orders may tell me I'm not called, and I really will need phatmass to help me in discerning consecrated virginity and especially marriage. Phatmass has gotten me through so much in my discernment and I've learned so much and made some great friends. Please help us out Dust! I say this from the bottom of my heart and with all respect. I really need to be able to talk to people on here about marriage in the appropriate place where it will get attention, and vs has been great; it doesn't mean we can't experiment with subforums and see what works best. I just really need a place. Edited December 29, 2011 by JoyfulLife Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyAnn Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I wonder if maybe the answer is to split VS in two, one for marriage/dating discernments and one for religious life/priest discernments. Kind of like 'The "Special" Boards are split. It keeps separate places for each of them but without really creating a whole new board for marriage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts