Jesus Christ Said Pt2

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

Pax domine bretheren,sympathiesers and others...
Firstly let me re-itterate if everyone missed it in the past that i am ecumenical more so in the sense of christianity and not the modern take on the word though the vatican has stated and possibly i read it in the chatechism that there has been fragments of the light in all culture throught time. Heres what jesus said, "be baptised and believe and you will be saved." To say that salvation does not exist outside of the holy roman catholic church is contrary to the holy gospels and possibly a heresy,please think about it and get to reading the holy gospels many times over and examining your concience as to what the word truely means,i think the church reccomends lectio divina, me i just read it and examine as often as i remember through the day week year. And let me illuminate what i am saying with another verse from the holy gospels, jesus said "he whom drinks of my blood and eats of my flesh will have life and life to the full.", now lets examine a particular word and it's applications to christianity in general. The word full to me in this sense means it is true that the holy roman catholic and orthodox churches have the fullness of truth/light but this does not mean other christians whom do not or have never partakin of the most precious body and blood are void of some amount of the truth/light. What sayeth ye all ?

God bless you all.
Jess iz LORD.
God is good,God is love,God saves.

[BarbTherese]

[quote]To say that salvation does not exist outside of the holy roman catholic church is contrary to the holy gospels and possibly a heresy[/quote]
Dear [url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/user/8944-table-dubah-rye/"][color="#272727"]Tab'le Du'Bah-Rye[/color][/url], I think probably you dont quite grasp the fulness of what The Church is saying. I hope that these articles may be a stepping stone for you in your understanding of Church teaching on the subject :

[url="http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=674"]http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=674[/url]

[url="http://www.ewtn.com/expert/answers/outside_the_church.htm"]http://www.ewtn.com/expert/answers/outside_the_church.htm[/url]

[quote] but this does not mean other christians whom do not or have never partakin of the most precious body and blood are void of some amount of the truth/light. [/quote]

I can agree with that.

I dont think that this is a debate forum and your Pt 2. may be better addressed, do you think, in the OpenMic forum?

The Lord's Peace and His Joy to you and yours this Christmas and on into 2012 and beyond! And to all!.............Barb

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

that was all rushed out as per usual, because jesus also said that those outside of the faith will be judged by the law written on there own heart. I rush to much to get a point accross and what comes out on paper isn't always exactly the point i'm trying to get across, after reading what i posted agin i got to the second sentance and am like "that came out way wrong." Hence why i will never be a priest and god forbid i ever became pope, unless some miracle beyond comprehension happens. Ok god bless

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

but i don't wan't to debate it, i wan't to discuss it and have other peoples opinions. And sorry i can't click on any web posts because i have no real protection for my computer.

[BarbTherese]

Don't be discouraged, if God wants you in the priesthood then you have only to respond to His Call to you. And some of those thought most unlikely have gone on to become very holy priests - and I have a dear friend in mind.
I posted last night into another forum on Phatmass, and mine came out all wrong too - but I did not realize it until much later. It can happen and probably to the most of us here! God's blessings on you and yours this Christmas and in 2012 and beyond.

Here is a large portion of the text of the first link which might be helpful (some formatting is mine) :

[b] [u]Is There Salvation Outside the Church[/u]?[/b]

[url="http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=674"]http://www.catholicc....cfm?recnum=674[/url]

by Fr. Alfred McBride, O. Praem.


Some years ago, a popular Jesuit writer named Father Leonard Feeney charmed readers with his humorous essays and books, such as "Fish on Friday." A lighthearted apologist and defender of the Church, his insistence on doctrine delivered with a sense of humor prompted the comment that he was "as Catholic as St. Thomas Aquinas and as American as Mark Twain."
In 1943, Father Feeney became the popular chaplain for the students at St. Benedict's Center, which served Catholics from Harvard and Radcliffe.
And then something happened, He began to preach that the axiom of Pope Boniface VIII (1294-1303) — "Outside the Church, no salvation" — meant that formal membership in the Catholic Church was necessary for salvation. The Vatican's Holy Office rejected his restrictive view by distinguishing between those who really belong to the Church [i](in re)[/i] and those who belong by desire ([i]in voto).[/i] The desire would be explicit in those who were catechumens and implicit in those people of goodwill who would join the Church if they knew it to be the one, true Church of Christ.
Father Feeney refused an order from his Jesuit superiors to leave St. Benedict's Center. The following year he was dismissed from the Society of Jesus. In the meantime, he established a religious community for men and women for his followers at Still River, Mass. In 1972, through the efforts of Bishop Bernard Flanagan of Worcester, Father Feeney and some of his followers were reconciled to the Church. He died in 1978.
The Fathers of the Church often taught that "outside the Church there is no salvation" (e.g., St. Augustine, Sermon 96, 7, 9). Stated positively, this means that all salvation comes from Christ, the Head, through the Church, which is His Body.
[b](following formatting is mine) : Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Second Vatican Council teaches that the Church is necessary for salvation. Christ is the mediator and way of salvation. He is present to us in His body, which is the Church. He explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and baptism. By doing so, He affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church, which people enter through baptism. Because of that, there are people who could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or remain in it (cf. Catechism of the Catholic Church, no. 846).
Vatican II teaches that the Church is the "Sacrament of Salvation." (Dogmatic Constitution on the Church, no. 1; Catechism, no. 780). Christ intended that the Church be a sacrament of the inner union of all people with God. This means that the Church is an effective sign of salvation for all who will be saved. Not just a signpost — like "exit 34" on a freeway — but an actual instrument of salvation. Jesus accomplishes His saving work in and [i]through[/i] the Church.
[u]But what about the billions of people who do not know Christ or the Church[/u]?
"Those, who through no fault of their own do not know the Gospel of Christ or His Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and moved by grace, try in their actions to do His will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience — those too may attain eternal salvation" (Catechism, no. 847). Sincere non-Christians can be moved by grace to seek God and know and do His will. When they do so according to the dictates of their conscience they can be saved, for by God's will they are associated with the paschal mystery of Christ.
What about those outside the Church who belong to other Christian faiths or world religions? I do not have enough space here to give an adequate answer to this question. I strongly recommend studying the Catechism's coverage of this matter in nos. 836-845. The opening statement is instructive: "All men are called to this catholic unity of the People of God. . . . And to it, in different ways, belong or are ordered: the Catholic faithful, others who believe in Christ, and finally all mankind, called by grace to salvation" (no. 836).[/b]
Members of other Christian churches who believe in Christ and have been properly baptized are in a certain, though imperfect, union with the Catholic Church. With the Orthodox churches, this union is so close that it lacks little to attain the fullness that would permit a common celebration of the Eucharist.
The Church maintains a special relationship with the Jewish people. As the People of God in the New Covenant, the Church has a deep link with the Jewish people, who were the first to hear God's Word. "Unlike other non-Christian religions, the Jewish faith is already a response to God's revelation in the Old Covenant."

[i]Norbertine Father Alfred McBride is the author of "Essentials of the Faith: A Guide to the Catechism of the Catholic Church" (Our Sunday Visitor).[/i]
© Our Sunday Visitor, Inc.

This item 674 digitally provided courtesy of CatholicCulture.org
Here is the text :

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

okay got all that,muchos gracious... the chatechism also states that the bible is equal to the sacrements but should never fully replace them and jesus said be baptised and believe and you will be saved but surely there is at least a partial absolution and absolution in the holy word not that i only wan't a partial indulgence and absolution,i assume the chatechism is talking for catholics alone mostly with such manner of things that as catholics we need not look outside of the church for salvation possibly and is dangerous for us to do so ? And that thesis is freaking me out big time but kinda heartining too now that i process it more. I was baptised at st benedicts,was born in 1978 and GOD told me to find out where i was baptised when he called me home. You must have a very powerful guardian angel that is warning me to be careful and to guard my faith and the church in general with the courage of a lion (and the gentleness of a lamb too i assume,working on that one ). And more to the point i do wan't to dialogue opinions but not debate

God bless you all.

Edited December 29, 2011 by Tab'le Du'Bah-Rye

[BarbTherese]

Nothing to loose and everything to gain by meditating and pondering Scripture in the light of our Catholic Church interpretation and teaching - and prayerfully! God bless you richly.