A Memo From Obama

[Papist]

I have heard people say the the feminine and masculine roles are constructs of society. By looking on the near surface, I might be inclined to believe that. However, I have not come across an adequate explanation of why all societies through thousands of years have basically constructed the same feminine and masculine roles.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Papist

[Ice_nine]

[quote name='Kia ora' timestamp='1324305216' post='2353682']
Some of my female friends are great athletes. One is a basketball referee and a marathon runner, another is a mountain bike fanatic who recently won a race, others are rock climbers. Are they unfeminine or boyish? That sort of question, I think is misplaced. Because whether I say that they're feminine or unfeminine, it's still just my opinion isn't it? And I don't think it's my place to impose my opinions on other people. I prefer to leave it up to them, and accept what they say.[/quote]

Some people may think athletic prowess is masculine, but I don't think it's inherently so. Biologically it tends to be that way. This doesn't mean it's "wrong" when women exhibit athletic skill even if it's not the norm.

[quote]When I say that females find 'it' for themselves, I meant that it's really their choice whether to think of it as feminine or masculine. Maybe that is relativistic. I watch My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic or at least I used to when time permitted. I didn't think of myself as pursuing a feminine activity.[/quote]

You and nihil should talk about that.

[quote]Many feminists and post-modernists have explored the issue of gender roles in society. You should check them out. Even though they may not be Catholic, they still have lots of interesting stuff to say.[/quote]

I've dabbled, albeit in a very disorganized way. This is something of interest of me so I'm inclined to read up when I can. It's just sitting in my head as a jumbled mess right now.

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1324312653' post='2353727']
I have heard people say the the feminine and masculine roles are constructs of society. By looking on the near surface, I might be inclined to believe that. However, I have not come across an adequate explanation of why all societies through thousands of years have basically constructed the same feminine and masculine roles.
[/quote]

all societies? that's a bold claim! i think very basic things like motherhood and fatherhood maybe, but what gender roles are you talking about specifically? Because with a brief survey of world cultures I think you may be surprised to find what the gender roles are

[Papist]

[quote name='Ice_nine' timestamp='1324325472' post='2353833']

all societies? that's a bold claim! i think very basic things like motherhood and fatherhood maybe, but what gender roles are you talking about specifically? Because with a brief survey of world cultures I think you may be surprised to find what the gender roles are
[/quote]

Other than the Oprah Winfrey Show, I know of no other society that the male/masculine role is the mother and nurturer.

[Ice_nine]

huh? I don't get the Oprah reference but whatever.

Mother, sure. Nurturer? That term is still a little vague. Do you mean in a biological sense?

[Kia ora]

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1324312653' post='2353727']
I have heard people say the the feminine and masculine roles are constructs of society. By looking on the near surface, I might be inclined to believe that. However, I have not come across an adequate explanation of why all societies through thousands of years have basically constructed the same feminine and masculine roles.
[/quote]
Most of that probably has to do with why men have been the head of families, auctioning off women in arranged marriages, maintaining control of dowries and so forth. Men can beat women up. Or maybe I'm just being too cynical?

[Papist]

[quote name='Kia ora' timestamp='1324344114' post='2354029']
Most of that probably has to do with why men have been the head of families, auctioning off women in arranged marriages, maintaining control of dowries and so forth. Men can beat women up. Or maybe I'm just being too cynical?
[/quote]

Ya think?