Tradition Within Cloistered Convents

[FutureCarmeliteClaire]

I know that it is a somewhat common belief that cloistered convents are more traditional. For those of you who have been to Mass at a convent like this or have even been a live-in or visited, is that the case? What are the Masses like that you have encountered at cloistered monasteries? I like to think I am quite conservative on matters of the liturgy (veiling, kneeling for Communion, Communion on the tongue, a huge fan of the Latin Mass, etc.) But I do believe the Novus Ordo is valid, and I most definitely do not hate on non-veilers and people who do not receive kneeling or on the tongue. These things are just my personal choices to show reverence for my Beloved. As these are my choices to show reverence, I come back to wondering about what Masses are like at cloistered convents. I have contacted the [url="http://www.sistersofcarmel.org/index.htm"]Tridentine Carmelites[/url], but they seemed less than inviting and quite condescending (almost) to how young I am (I am only 13, and I can't stand it when people tell me that I'm so young and that I have time, of course the nuns didn't say that, but I caught on to what they were saying). I have since come in contact with an amazing Mother Superior, and I think I may be called to this convent. I am planning on visiting and going to Mass there soon, and I can't wait.

Claire

[Chiara Francesco]

Well, don't worry about those Sisters of Carmel as they are not in line with the Pope nor Rome I believe. I don't know if they are SSPX or what but if your are true Roman Catholic, forget about them! Look to the Harrisburg Carmelites and Valapraiso - many threads on them here - besides other great Carmels - if you are feeling you have a Carmelite vocation.

There are also very traditional Poor Clare Colettine communities and others. Some communities may be like that with you due to your age. If you were closer to 16 or 17 you'd possibly be offered a visit or live-in. But many may feel 13 is too far away from any serious discernment and probably tell you to increase your prayer time, daily mass if possible, pray the rosary, the Divine Office, get a spiritual director, etc. - if you aren't already doing these things.

So don't be to disheartened. And check PM here for the 1990 Carmelite threads started over the past several years and other threads for the orders and communities who love and follow the Pope and are obedient to him and the Holy See.

[FutureCarmeliteClaire]

[quote name='Chiara Francesco' timestamp='1319326956' post='2325339']
Well, don't worry about those Sisters of Carmel as they are not in line with the Pope nor Rome I believe. I don't know if they are SSPX or what but if your are true Roman Catholic, forget about them! Look to the Harrisburg Carmelites and Valapraiso - many threads on them here - besides other great Carmels - if you are feeling you have a Carmelite vocation.

There are also very traditional Poor Clare Colettine communities and others. Some communities may be like that with you due to your age. If you were closer to 16 or 17 you'd possibly be offered a visit or live-in. But many may feel 13 is too far away from any serious discernment and probably tell you to increase your prayer time, daily mass if possible, pray the rosary, the Divine Office, get a spiritual director, etc. - if you aren't already doing these things.

So don't be to disheartened. And check PM here for the 1990 Carmelite threads started over the past several years and other threads for the orders and communities who love and follow the Pope and are obedient to him and the Holy See.
[/quote]
Thank you for the great info, that actually helps a lot. Yes, I know that I am young, but seeing as other orders have been a lot more inviting, this was kind of odd. I do not expect to be offered a live-in until 16, 17, or 18; in fact, the Carmel that I am most interested in does not allow live-ins until 18, but nonetheless, I adore them. I did not know the Sisters of Carmel are not in line with the Pope, wow, I'm glad you gave me that info, thanks.
Does anybody know how you would ask someone to be your spiritual director? I have a priest I consider my Confessor and he is amazing, and he has helped me more than you can imagine. He is so razzle dazzle

[Chiara Francesco]

If your priest doesn't know anyone and can't be your SD because he is busy with his parish, etc, you can call or email your diocese and if they have a Vocations dept, speak with the priest in charge and see if they have a list of names of priests to be SDs.

I did that with my parish and got a list of names. In my parish there a few priests, sisters and lay people for SD work. But, my vocations dept priest told me to NOT use the sisters in our diocese because they are to modern/liberal and then lay people are not good for vocation SD work. He then emailed me a list of 3 priest's names.

So try to get a good priest. You may luck out and get a good one the first time or you may have to hunt and try more than one!

Also, if you are near a monastery of monks/friars (active or cloistered), some times these priests will do SD work for people discerning vocations.

As you are just starting out, for now, even a good nun or sister in a local order (if there are any) would be helpful until you found a good priest.

[FutureCarmeliteClaire]

Thank you very, very much. The priest who is my confessor is the associate pastor, so maybe I can get him to do it. Do you juts have regular meetings or something with your SD? I am new to how this works

[LaPetiteSoeur]

[quote name='FutureCarmeliteClaire' timestamp='1319330555' post='2325362']
Thank you very, very much. The priest who is my confessor is the associate pastor, so maybe I can get him to do it. Do you juts have regular meetings or something with your SD? I am new to how this works
[/quote]

I meet with mine about once a month, usually in the first week. We talk for a while, about EVERYTHING. I really like mine...and I can hardly wait to go see him again next week! I have so much to tell him!

[FutureCarmeliteClaire]

That is great, I am new, as I said, to this. I do everything I can to prepare for my vocation, but I have never thought of getting a SD before... Now, my confessor has given me vocation advice before, and he is actually a recently ordained priest. He is wonderful.

[the171]

I'm fifthteen. The community I'm an aspirant with is totes AMAZE-CAKE. I mean.... they are modified habits (not to the extreme) but they're postulants wear veils in the Holy Presence. Check it: Laffy Carm. lafayettecarmel.org Tell Sr.Mary John that Dylana sent you She'll know who. haah they used to have Byzantine mass every once in a while and also the Ex. Form. Latin rite. Very diverse community. Traddies. (the good kind.) Not sure which constitutions. I'll email Sr.MJ, but she's on retreat right now.... Anyone know? I don't want to bother her. Claire, I think you might like my Carmies.

BTW- your confessor makes the best SD. Mine are those two and my sponsor for Confirmation. SCHYEAH. Prayer, service, writing them, etc. has a lot to do with prep. {I've been discerning for about two or three years.}

[AccountDeleted]

[quote name='the171' timestamp='1319346665' post='2325483']
I'm fifthteen. The community I'm an aspirant with is totes AMAZE-CAKE. I mean.... they are modified habits (not to the extreme) but they're postulants wear veils in the Holy Presence. Check it: Laffy Carm. lafayettecarmel.org Tell Sr.Mary John that Dylana sent you She'll know who. haah they used to have Byzantine mass every once in a while and also the Ex. Form. Latin rite. Very diverse community. Traddies. (the good kind.) Not sure which constitutions. I'll email Sr.MJ, but she's on retreat right now.... Anyone know? I don't want to bother her. Claire, I think you might like my Carmies.

BTW- your confessor makes the best SD. Mine are those two and my sponsor for Confirmation. SCHYEAH. Prayer, service, writing them, etc. has a lot to do with prep. {I've been discerning for about two or three years.}
[/quote]


These Carmelites sound lovely. Keep us updated on them!

As for the Confessor/SD thing, I have had experience with this and it has good points and bad points. Remember that your confessor is not supposed to remember anything that you had told him in Confession, so if you want to discuss something that you said there, you need to say it again, or remind him of it and say that you are giving him permission to talk about it.

When I had my Confessor in Melbourne as my SD, he was the one who told me about this. When I started to bring up things that I knew he knew already, he said to me, "I can't even acknowledge what you said to me before unless you say it is ok since it is bound by the seal of the Confessional." I then realized that these are two very separate roles - the Confessor and the SD, so be sure to make it easy on your SD by remembering that it can get hard for him to remember what he heard in the Confessional vs what he heard as your SD - not that he would talk about either to anyone else, but officially, he is not even supposed to remember the things told him in Confession so perhaps you need to say them again so he can talk about them with you as SD!

[InPersonaChriste]

Oh I know exactly how you feel when people are totally confused about young women/men discerning a religious calling. Sometimes God just plants it in our hearts at different times, and I am so thankful for religious discernment, I have grown in my faith so much since the begining.

When I first started looking into this seriously I contacted 2 convents who both told me to enjoy my youth and live out my single vocation. Though this is not an exact quote (they did say some nice things like how it is good that I want to be close to Christ) Only one convent took my inquires seriously and gently. I am not saying that the previous convents were not nice, but just not helpful.

Sorry if this is coming off mean now.. This is what happes when I stay up to late watching Sherlock Holmes with my mum. Or if its coming of confusing..

Edited October 23, 2011 by InPersonaChriste

[the171]

[quote name='nunsense' timestamp='1319349908' post='2325495']


These Carmelites sound lovely. Keep us updated on them!

As for the Confessor/SD thing, I have had experience with this and it has good points and bad points. Remember that your confessor is not supposed to remember anything that you had told him in Confession, so if you want to discuss something that you said there, you need to say it again, or remind him of it and say that you are giving him permission to talk about it.

When I had my Confessor in Melbourne as my SD, he was the one who told me about this. When I started to bring up things that I knew he knew already, he said to me, "I can't even acknowledge what you said to me before unless you say it is ok since it is bound by the seal of the Confessional." I then realized that these are two very separate roles - the Confessor and the SD, so be sure to make it easy on your SD by remembering that it can get hard for him to remember what he heard in the Confessional vs what he heard as your SD - not that he would talk about either to anyone else, but officially, he is not even supposed to remember the things told him in Confession so perhaps you need to say them again so he can talk about them with you as SD!
[/quote]

Yes, I meant more that it is easier to talk to him. I feel as though I can confide with him. Great guy. I can't stress it enough. He should start a blog, make a phatmass account... oh wait, he's too busy sheperding me around.haah and leading men through pre-seminary formation and heading christian formation for the whole flipping dipping diocese. BUSY MAN

OH AND THEY ARE.

[AccountDeleted]

Every Carmelite convent I have been in has been different with regard to Mass. A lot depends on what is available to them from priests. At Wolverhampton, they had their own chaplain, who lived in a flat provided by them and was paid a salary. He was also allowed to do Masses for other parishes if asked or other sacraments, but his first priority was our convent. He was a missionary from Africa - a beautiful and holy soul - he did the NO Mass but was always full of love and tenderness that was so inspiring. We also had the occasional priest from the nearby parish when our priest had his day off or holidays. We also had the occasional priest from the Birmingham Oratory - one time for St Teresa of Avila's feast day - and it was so amazing! And I think we must have had a Bishop on occasion because we had him visit inside during Recreation a couple of times.

At Edmonton, we had a couple of priest - because they had a long drive through the snow to get to us. Once we had a Cardinal spend a holiday with us, and he gave us a second Mass each day because he didn't want anyone to know he was there, including the local priests! They were all NO as well.

At KE, we had alternating priests provided to us by the Bishop - some good and some even better! All NO.

In Perth, the Jesuits took care of us, and the younger ones were a bit too liberal for my tastes, but they had an older priest who was very good IMO and he became my confessor as well. We did have an occasional visiting priest who was not a Jesuit. All NO. In Perth I asked if I could speak with the local Latin Mass priest for some spiritual counselling but my Novice Mistress refused to allow this because she said she didn't believe that it would be conducive to community unity - they were very liberal and they considered the Latin Mass priests too conservative. I took it to the Prioress but she said that whatever the NM said was okay with her. We did have the Bishop do the Mass for a final Profession but he was also NO. I think that it would be lovely to have the occasional EF Mass because it is so beautiful but it is just one of those things that you have to surrender to God if you enter a community where they don't like it or can't get it.

[Strictlyinkblot]

The Benedictines I did my live in had mass and divine office in Latin but I believe the mass was NO as the priest was facing the congregation. I'm not sure because my Latin is restricted to the Hail Mary and a few medical terms. They had two lovely customs though. One was that before receiving the Eucharist and Blood of Christ they would geneflect or bow and then take Communion standing. It was very, very reverend. The second was for the sign of peace they would bow to the person beside them and then embrace them and kiss them on the cheek. It was lovely.

[the171]

I wish my parish was like that... I go to my cathedral for EFM. One of the perks of living closer to the Bishop's See.

[OnlySunshine]

The moment I read the title of this thread, I thought of this song:

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRdfX7ut8gw[/media]