Amppax Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 [quote name='Papist' timestamp='1313716463' post='2290992'] Seems that the authors went much too far to be delicate in order to not offend certain readers that the teaching is lost in the ambiguity. By doing so, there are multiple interpretations for this with some in conflict with each other. [/quote] exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I think the whole book is poorly written/translated. It definitely is not written in a language easily understandable, even for a learned adult, let alone a yoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amppax Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 [quote name='dUSt' timestamp='1313718000' post='2291014'] I think the whole book is poorly written/translated. It definitely is not written in a language easily understandable, even for a learned adult, let alone a yoot. [/quote] I've heard that it is great from a bunch of people, but I've not read much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Adam Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 [quote name='dUSt' timestamp='1313718000' post='2291014'] I think the whole book is poorly written/translated. It definitely is not written in a language easily understandable, even for a learned adult, let alone a yoot. [/quote] Interesting. When I first started reading it, I really liked the language - it seem to communicate the Churches teachings in the language of youth. Now I am having my doubts. There is definitely no consensus yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 My translation follows... [quote][size=4]There is no man on earth who is not descended from a union of a mother and father. Therefore it is a painful experience for many homosexually oriented people that they do not feel erotically attracted to the opposite sex and necessarily miss out on the physical fruitfulness of the union between man and woman according to human nature and the divine order of creation. Nevertheless, God often leads souls to himself along unusual paths: A lack, a loss, or a wound—if accepted and affirmed—can become a springboard for throwing oneself into the arms of God. - YouCat 65[/size] [/quote] Everyone on earth came from a union of a mother and father. It may be painful for many homosexuals, who do not feel sexually attracted to the opposite sex, because they miss out on the physical union between a man and a woman, which is human nature--the order of creation, authored by God. Even so, God often leads souls to Himself in unusual ways. Even a disorder such as homosexuality, if lived with according to the guidance of the Church, can become a springboard for throwing oneself into the arms of God. - PhatCat 65 ...or something like that. All I know is the wording, phrasing, and vocabulary used in the YouCat is as confusing as heck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 [quote name='Brother Adam' timestamp='1313718545' post='2291023'] Interesting. When I first started reading it, I really liked the language - it seem to communicate the Churches teachings in the language of youth. Now I am having my doubts. There is definitely no consensus yet. [/quote] This is the language of the youth? [size=4]"... and necessarily miss out on the physical fruitfulness of the union between man and woman according to human nature and the divine order of creation..."[/size] What youth do you hang out with? LOL... I don't even have any idea what that sentence is trying to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaPetiteSoeur Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 [quote name='dUSt' timestamp='1313719181' post='2291032'] This is the language of the youth? [size=4]"... and necessarily miss out on the physical fruitfulness of the union between man and woman according to human nature and the divine order of creation..."[/size] What youth do you hang out with? LOL... I don't even have any idea what that sentence is trying to say. [/quote] The sentence should be reworded and made into multiple sentences. Maybe in the 2nd edition it will have phatmass's new translation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 We should take the YouCat and re-translate it into the PhatCat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Adam Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 [quote name='dUSt' timestamp='1313719181' post='2291032'] This is the language of the youth? [size=4]"... and necessarily miss out on the physical fruitfulness of the union between man and woman according to human nature and the divine order of creation..."[/size] What youth do you hang out with? LOL... I don't even have any idea what that sentence is trying to say. [/quote] The whole thing isn't written like that though. I like this one: What is Confirmation? ‎"To be confirmed means to make a 'covenant' with God. The confirmand says, "Yes, I believe in you, my God; give me your Holy Spirit, so that I might belong entirely to you and never be separated from you and may witness to you throughout my whole life, body and soul, in my words and deeds, on good days and bad." It is less complicated than the CCC but still communicates the faith and not only answers what, but why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amppax Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I'm a nerd, but i kinda like the Youcat's wording. At least what I've seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papist Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 [quote name='Brother Adam' timestamp='1313720086' post='2291049'] The whole thing isn't written like that though. I like this one: What is Confirmation? ‎"To be confirmed means to make a 'covenant' with God. The confirmand says, "Yes, I believe in you, my God; give me your Holy Spirit, so that I might belong entirely to you and never be separated from you and may witness to you throughout my whole life, body and soul, in my words and deeds, on good days and bad." It is less complicated than the CCC but still communicates the faith and not only answers what, but why. [/quote] Does it state that Confirmation completes your Initiation into the Church? And that Confirmation is the special outpouring of the Holy Spirit. Its effects are to: [list] [*]Root us more deeply in divine filiation[being children of God] [*]Unites us more firmly to Christ [*]Increases the gifts of the Holy Spirit in us [*]Strengthens our bond with the Church [*]Associates us more closely to her mission of bearing witness to Christ [*]Helps us and more strictly obliges us to spread and defend the faith by word and deed [/list] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Adam Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 [quote name='Papist' timestamp='1313753740' post='2291220'] Does it state that Confirmation completes your Initiation into the Church? And that Confirmation is the special outpouring of the Holy Spirit. Its effects are to:[list] [*]Root us more deeply in divine filiation[being children of God] [*]Unites us more firmly to Christ [*]Increases the gifts of the Holy Spirit in us [*]Strengthens our bond with the Church [*]Associates us more closely to her mission of bearing witness to Christ [*]Helps us and more strictly obliges us to spread and defend the faith by word and deed [/list] [/quote] In other spots, yes it does. That is totally beside the point though. The format of the youth catechism is exactly what a youth catechism needs to be - abbreviate the full catechism in one paragraph with a reference of where to find it in the full catechism and then explain the why behind the doctrine or moral. It often does not use the exact same language as the full catechism for the precise reason that it is geared towards teens who wouldn't understand that language or frankly, care. A teen catechism that just quoted the full catechism would be an abysmal failure. The only thing in question here is the way the catechism is worded. It doesn't make a youth catechism less needed, just in need of revision, which is common. Targeting teens doesn't mean we have to water down the faith, in fact that would be a grave disservice, however it also doesn't mean that we can't approach them where they are at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FutureSister2009 Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I love YouCat. I think it should've come out a long time ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papist Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 [quote name='Brother Adam' timestamp='1313760407' post='2291250'] In other spots, yes it does. That is totally beside the point though. The format of the youth catechism is exactly what a youth catechism needs to be - abbreviate the full catechism in one paragraph with a reference of where to find it in the full catechism and then explain the why behind the doctrine or moral. It often does not use the exact same language as the full catechism for the precise reason that it is geared towards teens who wouldn't understand that language or frankly, care. A teen catechism that just quoted the full catechism would be an abysmal failure. The only thing in question here is the way the catechism is worded. It doesn't make a youth catechism less needed, just in need of revision, which is common. Targeting teens doesn't mean we have to water down the faith, in fact that would be a grave disservice, however it also doesn't mean that we can't approach them where they are at. [/quote] So then the youcat is an abridged CCC using "teen" language, that points them to the CCC? Now, how old are the authors of this youcat that are deciding what "teen" language is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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