The Texas Unmiracle

[Socrates]

[quote name='Marie-Therese' timestamp='1313709511' post='2290927']

OK, I can concede that point. For the record, though, I never stated any opposition to secession as a philosophical stance. It's a perfectly legitimate option and well within the purview of the people of Texas (or any state) to choose that option, if circumstances warrant. My point was that the appearance of a candidate for office advocating a position that seemed to run counter to the point of that office made for bad public relations. However, I can agree that there are merits to the bigger argument in terms of the presentation of the idea as a possibility.[/quote]
Sorry if I misinterpreted your posts. You just seemed pretty adamantly opposed to the whole succession thing.

If his speech was bad pr, that only hurts Perry, whom you don't appear to be much of a fan of to begin with, so I'm not sure why this is a big issue.



[quote]That was my entire point. Perry is just one more pop-up in a giant political game of whack-a-mole. You could throw a dart, hit one, and get pretty much the same result from any of them. They just have different routes to the same end. Eventually the lure of power will be one too potent for the vast majority of candidates for that office to withstand. That had nothing to do with Perry specifically at all.[/quote]
I guess I'm just not quite as cynical as you on this (which is ironic, because most people who know me consider me extremely cynical). I'm as frustrated with the political scene as anyone, but wouldn't go so far as to say it makes absolutely no difference who is elected to office. I think the agenda of the Obama administration will prove absolutely disastrous for this country in the long run, and must be opposed. Whether Perry is the best man to do that is a whole other debate. I think it does make a difference who is elected, even if the difference is not as great as it should be. Sometimes the best we can do in the end is limit the damage done, but that's better than nothing. If all good Catholics and conservatives drop out of the political process altogether, out political leadership will be left to the absolutely worst people. All that it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing.

But I must say that for one who believes it makes no difference who people vote for or don't vote for, you've spent a lot of time on political debate.
No need to work so hard at drumming up apathy.

[Marie-Therese]

[quote name='Socrates' timestamp='1313798464' post='2291614']
Sorry if I misinterpreted your posts. You just seemed pretty adamantly opposed to the whole succession thing.

If his speech was bad pr, that only hurts Perry, whom you don't appear to be much of a fan of to begin with, so I'm not sure why this is a big issue.




I guess I'm just not quite as cynical as you on this (which is ironic, because most people who know me consider me extremely cynical). I'm as frustrated with the political scene as anyone, but wouldn't go so far as to say it makes absolutely no difference who is elected to office. I think the agenda of the Obama administration will prove absolutely disastrous for this country in the long run, and must be opposed. Whether Perry is the best man to do that is a whole other debate. I think it does make a difference who is elected, even if the difference is not as great as it should be. Sometimes the best we can do in the end is limit the damage done, but that's better than nothing. If all good Catholics and conservatives drop out of the political process altogether, out political leadership will be left to the absolutely worst people. All that it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing.

But I must say that for one who believes it makes no difference who people vote for or don't vote for, you've spent a lot of time on political debate.
No need to work so hard at drumming up apathy.
[/quote]

You misconstrue. I am not apathetic in the slightest. Don't misread disenchantment with the current political establishment with apathy, because they are not the same.

Apathetic about one candidate over another? You might call it apathy, I suppose, but solely in that regard. Our current system is so rife with corruption that, in my most humble opinion, it is at the point where it is irredeemable in its present construct. To patronize one party or another with a vote is simply to perpetuate the same basic problems, to prop up the same power players. What is needed is a radical reinvention of the way politics is dealt with in this country, to return it to its most foundation level where people determine the extent to which they are governed, and not the present system where we're ruled at gunpoint and have no say in what happens. I just don't think that settling for the "lesser of two evils" choice is a feasible one any more. To use a blunt descriptor, our choices right now are to choose which party's candidate is going to try to shove ten pounds of cr[acronym=''][/acronym]ap into our five pound bag. Neither of those choices really work. In the end, it's all still cr[acronym=''][/acronym]ap.

Being reticent to participate in the reindeer games of the current political establishment isn't apathetic. I simply have come to a point where I feel morally compelled to refuse to give support to candidates supporting the ideals of either party. The individual party planks no longer matter; the issues aren't the issue. The real issue is money, and who's going to bring more of it, and where special interests determine that it gets spent. Not being willing to lend my assent to that system isn't apathetic, it's the only way I can assuage my conscience and sleep at night. What I do support, vigorously, is a discussion that leads to a radical reformation of American politics. That's why I am involved in the present discussion.

[Jesus_lol]

im just gonna repost this part of my post since it seems everyone only paid attention to the pictures under it

Rick Perry had an innocent man executed when he refused to stay the execution of Cameron Todd Willingham when new forensic evidence exonerated him.
[url="http://articles.cnn.com/2009-10-01/justice/texas.execution.probe_1_willingham-case-cameron-todd-willingham-execution?_s=PM:CRIME"]http://articles.cnn....ion?_s=PM:CRIME[/url]

He then squashed the investigation into it, replacing everyone on it
[url="http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/04/14/texas.arson.review/index.html"]http://www.cnn.com/2...view/index.html[/url]

after raising 11 million dollars from oil and gas companies, he then said that climate scientists are lying to increase their cashflow.

sounds like an amesome guy

[dominicansoul]

[quote name='Jesus_lol' timestamp='1313943081' post='2292590']
im just gonna repost this part of my post since it seems everyone only paid attention to the pictures under it

Rick Perry had an innocent man executed when he refused to stay the execution of Cameron Todd Willingham when new forensic evidence exonerated him.
[url="http://articles.cnn.com/2009-10-01/justice/texas.execution.probe_1_willingham-case-cameron-todd-willingham-execution?_s=PM:CRIME"]http://articles.cnn....ion?_s=PM:CRIME[/url]

He then squashed the investigation into it, replacing everyone on it
[url="http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/04/14/texas.arson.review/index.html"]http://www.cnn.com/2...view/index.html[/url]

after raising 11 million dollars from oil and gas companies, he then said that climate scientists are lying to increase their cashflow.

sounds like an amesome guy
[/quote]

that's disappointing

[Jaime]

He also has accused the fed chair of treason and said that Obama didn't love the US. It only took a week for me to go from hopefully intrigued to disgusted.

[dominicansoul]

i still like him more than obama, though

[MIKolbe]

not sure if that says more about you or Obama.... lol

[dominicansoul]

idgi

[MIKolbe]

those are the smallest words i have.. so sry.

[Winchester]

[quote name='jaime (the artist formerly known as hot stuff)' timestamp='1313943752' post='2292597']
He also has accused the fed chair of treason and said that Obama didn't love the US. It only took a week for me to go from hopefully intrigued to disgusted.
[/quote]
I don't think debasing the currency is treason, but it is an assault upon the citizens. Perry's opposition to the Federal government is hopefully sincere, but I don't think it is.

[Jaime]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1313961609' post='2292876']
I don't think debasing the currency is treason, but it is an assault upon the citizens. Perry's opposition to the Federal government is hopefully sincere, but I don't think it is.
[/quote]

I agree completely. I've also heard some very disappointing things from people who have worked on his campaigns in the past. When Obama (who's approval ratings stink) gives you a mulligan, you must be really saying some stupid things.

[Jesus_lol]

well, if Rick Perry and George W. Bush were brothers (would anyone be surprised?) they would have grown up with people referring to George as "the smart one"

[Winchester]

[quote name='Jesus_lol' timestamp='1313976920' post='2293081']
well, if Rick Perry and George W. Bush were brothers (would anyone be surprised?) they would have grown up with people referring to George as "the smart one"
[/quote]
It's a mistake to view someone as stupid because he does things that you don't deem intelligent. Perry appears to be doing quite well for himself, as did Bush. That both have upset people who don't understand that they want by their political beliefs the very things both have done in their political careers.

[Marie-Therese]

This is the sum total of my position.

[img]http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lnfpiq5h7t1qgbuj7o1_500.jpg[/img]

[Socrates]

[quote name='jaime (the artist formerly known as hot stuff)' timestamp='1313943752' post='2292597']
He also has accused the fed chair of treason and said that Obama didn't love the US. It only took a week for me to go from hopefully intrigued to disgusted.
[/quote]
I'm disgusted at the Fed and Obama too.

I'm with Governor Perry on this.

Barrack Obama loves Barrack Obama, and political power. If he loved his country, he'd resign.