"meant To Be"

[Luigi]

I have married friends who disagree about this. HE believes that we choose to love, and that we will find a life partner wherever we are and whatever we are doing when we are an age to do so .

HE says, "If I joined the military and was stationed in Japan when I was of a mind to get married, I might find a Japanese woman to spend the rest of my life with. As it happened, I was in the States, I met a woman here, and I wanted to spend my life with her. I asked her, and she agreed. But I don't think God assigned her to me the day I was born, or me to her on the day she was born."

SHE didn't like to know that. But they've been married for 35 years or something, and I think she's come around to hid way of thinking the longer she's been married to him.





Love at first sight, true love, soul mates - all fine for country music.

But country music is also full of cheating, slippin' around, broken hearts, regrets, D-I-V-O-R-C-E, and drinkin' to forget.

[Norseman82]

Here is what CCC 2230 has to say (bolded emphasis mine):

"When they become adults, children have the right and duty to [i]choose their profession and state of life[/i] which corresponds to their own convictions. They should assume their new responsibilities within a trusting relationship with their parents, willingly asking and receiving their advice and counsel. Parents should be careful not to exert pressure on their children either in the [b]choice[/b] of a profession [b]or in that of a spouse[/b]. This necessary restraint does not prevent them - quite the contrary - from giving their children judicious advice, particulary when they are planning to start a family."

So, according to the CCC, people choose their spouses. This is the only place that I find that speaks of this topic.

Additionally, the concept of "God has created one spouse for you" and "what's meant to be" can lead to cultlike manipulation. For example, someone [b]here on phatmass[/b] (I even believe he may have had mod privileges at the time) actually sent me an email saying that my wishing to be equally yoked virginitywise was "disordered" and that I may be rejecting teh person God had picked out for me! (Unfortunately, I did not save that email, but I should have so I could have reported him to dUSt, as well as to the parish he worked for so he could be fired).

Using the "meant to be" line can also be a way of avoiding personal responsibility for wrong and hurtful choices that are made and how we treat others, or to justify not standing up for the victims.

[quote name='Brother Adam' timestamp='1310914475' post='2268734']
As others have said, no, there are likely many people in this world you are compatible with, and many you are not.
[/quote]

Correct, and Karl Keating of Catholic Answers addressed this in one of his e-letters (begins about halfway down):

http://www.catholic.com/newsletters/kke_080108.asp

[Norseman82]

[quote name='tinytherese' timestamp='1310961279' post='2269191']
What if I don't marry my soul mate?
Posted At : May 20, 2008 5:14 PM | Posted By : Anthony Buono
Related Categories: Ask Anthony
Dear Anthony,

Is it possible that someone now married did not actually marry his or her soul mate?

The concept of the "soul mate" is a very, very popular one. There are various ways that people look at this concept. The harmless way is to consider that your "soul mate" is someone that you just fit so well with, it is hard to imagine your life without that person. It almost feels like you are one soul meant for each other. That, of course, is what true love can feel like. Everyone wants to meet someone that they just love being with more than anyone else and want to spend the rest of their life with. That is actually the what the concept of becoming "one flesh" is all about. The "one flesh" is a very real thing that happens to a married couple. The souls are not fused, but the bodies are. No longer can the two individuals consider themselves as solely "individual". They are ONE. This has to be covered more in depth at another time, but the point here is that the healthy sense of "soul mate" is actually the beautiful movement of two souls who desire to become one flesh in Holy Matrimony. Therefore, I prefer that people say that they seek to find the person they will become one flesh with, rather than seeking their "soul mate".

A more harmful way to look at "soul mate", in my opinion, is the notion that there is one person out there who is the only one you can marry, as if God has taken one soul, split it in two, and put each part into two human beings who now spend their life longing for each other, and if not found, end up always having this unfulfilled longing. Perhaps not everyone goes that far, but certainly the influence of this concept has affected many people to the degree of firmly believing that God has only one person in mind for each person to marry, and if you don't find that person you are doomed to unhappiness.

I have addressed this concept before, but it is worth touching on again. Marriage is a decision by a human being created with free will, just as love is a decision. It is the gift of free will created by God in all human beings that is the most meaningful aspect of love and marriage because it requires a decision on the part of two individual persons to give themselves to the other with a commitment to fidelity, permanence, and openness to life.

This free-will act is one-dimensional to each person, meaning that the requirement is that YOU say "I love you" in the marriage sense, and say "I do" in the marriage ceremony, and that YOU carry out those commitments for the rest of your life, despite anything the other person does. That is why the Sacrament of Matrimony is the only sacrament that does NOT have a priest as the "ordinary" minister of the sacrament. The two individuals are the "ordinary ministers". They give each other their free-will consent and that is when the sacrament is confected.

Again, marriage is a free-will act of the individuals, and the love they commit to is a love that must continue until death, even if the other person decides to no longer do so. This is a tough reality of marriage for people to accept, but it is also the most beautiful. The marriage vow/commitment is meant to provide security for both individuals and the children that come within the marriage. That is precisely why there is no divorce permitted in the Catholic Church. Jesus Himself declared that marriage is indissoluble, and the Church holds true to this teaching by also declaring that a sacramental marriage can never be dissolved. This subject also requires much more expounding than time here permits, but suffice it to say that marriage is in and of itself an institution that two people should not enter into lightly because it requires a commitment to "permanence". That means, I'm sorry to say, that even those marriages that seem to be not-so-great, or where one is no longer in love with the other, are still very much indissoluble marriages. Yes, that is a hardship for the individuals because of the sufferings that come along with a challenging marriage, but there are no guarantees that every marriage will be perfectly happy.

And that is the critical mistake of the modern notion of marriage. People believe they have a "right" to a happy marriage, and therefore feel they have a "right" to divorce someone if things are not going as they want them to. What they don't realize is that God is not so far away in a marriage, particularly a Christian marriage. God has a vested interest in every marriage, and is available to help a marriage if two people are willing to submit to God's will and not their own will. God, however, never guarantees any marriage will always have bliss and great feelings of happiness. On the contrary, all marriages have their ups and downs, and it is the "choice" of the individuals that affects the outcome. A married couple must wake up every day and make a renewed "decision" to love the other, and pray to God for the grace to love perfectly, especially when it is most difficult to do so. And in God's great wisdom, He allows there to be crosses in marriage that are meant to draw the individuals closer to each other and closer to God. That's what makes marriage such a path to sanctity for people. For most people, they are called to the marriage vocation, primarily to make each person a SAINT! They become a saint by living out their commitment to love the other. And we should all know full well that the path of the saint in this life is the way of the cross, in the footsteps of the Master.

Getting back to the dangerous aspect of "soul mate", it is therefore absolutely NOT required that you marry your "soul mate" in order to have a valid and/or sacramental marriage. There really is no such thing as a "soul mate" in the sense of only one person out there meant for each person. The beauty of having free will is that you can choose anyone out there. BUT … once you choose, it is for life, and it forsakes all others until death, and (this is the kicker) at that moment of giving free-will consent at the marriage ceremony, that person IS the only person for you.

I would very much like to see people stop making so much of finding what they believe is the only person out there meant for them, which only serves to put off marriage, which puts off having babies. I would prefer they focus on making a decision (of course, this is primarily on the man, because he is the one who does the asking out on dates, as well as asking for the woman's hand in marriage). It actually wastes time to look for that "one person meant for you" and does not guarantee anything, because there is no way of knowing "for certain" what God's will is, let alone who God wants you to marry. But the fact is God is helping us come into contact with good prospects, but He does not have just one person set aside for us. We do the choosing, God does the blessing of the choice.

So, to answer your question, no, a person who is married does not have to be concerned that he/she did not marry their "soul mate". They should be content that they are where God wants them to be and concentrate on giving the other love and being "loveable". It might be that they made an unwise choice of the person to marry, but that does not mean they are not really married. It might end up being true that a marriage was not a sacramental marriage as declared by a marriage tribunal of the Church, but this should never be assumed. Marriage is hard work, and love is something that has to be developed. If two people are not as happy as they would like to be, it is much more productive for them to work at finding how to love the other more deeply than it is to consider if they made the wrong choice, or worse, to consider ending the marriage in the name of seeking someone "better". That is definitely a step in the wrong direction, and something the devil would do to influence the ending of a real marriage.

And so is poisoning a person's mind with thoughts like, "Oh, perhaps I really did not marry my soul mate and need to end this marriage so I can continue looking for that soul mate". What a disaster of an approach to marriage and to life itself. It's as if to say that what is most important in marriage is that I be as happy as possible. NO!!! That is not what is most important in marriage. What is most important in marriage is that two people made a decision in faith to marry someone and work hard at their marriage to love each other and make the other as happy as THEY can be, and to have babies and raise children for God. That is the joy of marriage and the glory we give to God in marriage. And, it is sad to say, something that too many are missing out on because they are focused on the wrong things, like "Where is my soul mate?"

I will pray for your friend and hope you will advise that person to be at peace and work hard at loving, in the example of our Lord, Jesus Christ, who made His whole life about service to others with a love that was unconditional and without need of reciprocation. God willing, all of us receive this kind of love in return in our marriages, but it is not a "requirement", by any means. God rewards most those who decide they will love, regardless of feelings, and live their commitment through the hard work required to make marriage successful.


Source http://www.6stonejars.com/index.cfm/2008/5/20/What-if-I-dont-marry-my-soul-mate

Believing that there is only one person out there for you that God wills you to be with makes me think of the Calvinistic concept of predestination.
[/quote]

That can lead to a lot of people seeking annulments on the grounds of "Oops, I just figured out that the person I married was not the one set aside for me by God since the beginning of eternity". Very dangerous ground to tread.

[kujo]

[quote name='dominicansoul' timestamp='1310965100' post='2269238']
if there is supposed to be just one person meant for me, than I'm outta luck, with abortion being made legal at the time of my birth, i'm pretty sure my husband was killed
[/quote]

That's really truly absurd, sis.

[quote name='Norseman82' timestamp='1310969013' post='2269263']
Here is what CCC 2230 has to say (bolded emphasis mine):

"When they become adults, children have the right and duty to [i]choose their profession and state of life[/i] which corresponds to their own convictions. They should assume their new responsibilities within a trusting relationship with their parents, willingly asking and receiving their advice and counsel. Parents should be careful not to exert pressure on their children either in the [b]choice[/b] of a profession [b]or in that of a spouse[/b]. This necessary restraint does not prevent them - quite the contrary - from giving their children judicious advice, particulary when they are planning to start a family."

So, according to the CCC, people choose their spouses. This is the only place that I find that speaks of this topic.
[/quote]

I don't think that's what the CCC was implying with that italicized statement.

[dominicansoul]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1310986965' post='2269311']
That's really truly absurd, sis.
[/quote]


when am I not?


no, but seriously, when you think of the millions that have been killed by abortion, and you start to wonder about all that the world has lost because we didn't allow these humans to be born, it kinda blows your mind ...

[homeschoolmom]

No, I don't think there's just one person you're supposed to marry, and that God manuvers people towards each other little by little... I believe that are many people with whom people can build a successful marriage.

When we got engaged, I asked myself if I could see myself building a life with HSdad. Of course, at 20 I had ZERO idea of what that would even be like. I asked myself if I could see myself without him. I could, but I didn't want to.

[Papist]

I never knew and still don't know what this 'soul-mate' is. I choose to love my wife for many reasons. Maybe there is a woman out there that is a better 'fit' for me. Regardless, my wife is not my ultimate fulfillment, that would be Jesus Christ, and fortunately my wife is helping me with that...my children are helping me with that also.

[Nihil Obstat]

I don't know about fate or destiny or anything like that, but I do know with 100% certainty that God wants Katy and I to be married. There have been dozens of small things that confirm this for me.

[MissScripture]

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1310995828' post='2269368']
I never knew and still don't know what this 'soul-mate' is. I choose to love my wife for many reasons. Maybe there is a woman out there that is a better 'fit' for me. Regardless, [b]my wife is not my ultimate fulfillment, that would be Jesus Christ[/b], and fortunately my wife is helping me with that...my children are helping me with that also.
[/quote]
I think a lot of people forget about that part, or, in our culture, completely ignore it, and want that other person to be their EVERYTHING. And hey, we're only human, people are going to mess up, and hurt us, even the people who love us and we love the most. And I think the concept of "soul-mate" tends to lead people to thinking it will be sunshine and roses, and no work involved, which is another huge mistake on the part of our society, because they expect the "soul-mate" to just understand everything without the necessary communication.

[Cherie]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1311007714' post='2269477']
I don't know about fate or destiny or anything like that, but I do know with 100% certainty that God wants Katy and I to be married. There have been dozens of small things that confirm this for me.
[/quote]

Yeah, that's my concept of "soul mate," so yes, I do believe that -- from all eternity, God willed my husband and I to be together, just as He willed that I be born, just as He willed to create the Heavens and the earth. Pretty humbling, huh? Therefore, my husband IS my "soul mate."

Doesn't mean it doesn't require work. Doesn't mean it's going to be all sunshine and roses. Doesn't mean some sort of weird new-agey thing about one soul being divided and placed into different bodies and all that weird stuff. But it does mean that God, in His Loving Providence, saw to bring us together. Whether it's His ordained Will or permissive Will (haha! I definitely hope it's the former) ... it's still His Will, He knew about it from all eternity, and we do all we can to live our marriage in accordance with His Will and help one another toward Heaven.

[Papist]

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1311008639' post='2269485']
I think a lot of people forget about that part, or, in our culture, completely ignore it, and want that other person to be their EVERYTHING. And hey, we're only human, people are going to mess up, and hurt us, even the people who love us and we love the most. And I think the concept of "soul-mate" tends to lead people to thinking it will be sunshine and roses, and no work involved, which is another huge mistake on the part of our society, because they expect the "soul-mate" to just understand everything without the necessary communication.
[/quote]
Yes. That is what those eharmony ads are implying. That it must be your soul-mate if the first time you talk on the phone is 5 hours or your lunch date is 3 hours.

[kujo]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1311007714' post='2269477']
I don't know about fate or destiny or anything like that, but I do know with 100% certainty that God wants Katy and I to be married. There have been dozens of small things that confirm this for me.
[/quote]

I hear ya, dude. Same with me and my lady. When I met her, I felt like Adam when he recognized Eve as being "from his flesh." She's all the best parts of me, and a better form of all of the worst parts. I love her to pieces and thank God when I wake up, when I fall asleep, and all throughout the day, that He made her, and entrusted her to me.

[Norseman82]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1311028258' post='2269676']
When I met her, I felt like Adam when he recognized Eve as being "from his flesh." [/quote]

Feelings can be deceiving.

A few years ago, I felt "this one, at last" about the lady I was dating.

Then she entered a religious community.

Go figure.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='CherieMadame' timestamp='1311010786' post='2269506']Yeah, that's my concept of "soul mate," so yes, I do believe that -- from all eternity, God willed my husband and I to be together, just as He willed that I be born, just as He willed to create the Heavens and the earth. Pretty humbling, huh? Therefore, my husband IS my "soul mate."[/quote]
yeah, i don't know if i believe that.

[CatherineM]

I blame Julia Roberts' movies.