Michelle Bauchman

[StMichael]

Bachmann is not a danger to the Republican party at all. Boehner, Cantor, McConnell on the other hand are.

Bachmann has been steadfast in her support for the US Constitution which is what all representatives are to be doing.

Things like Social Security, Welfare, Medicare, etc. are not Constitutional. Nor is Obamacare, as Congress does not have the power to force us to buy anything simply because we are alive.

Whether she is electable is another question that will be answered down the line, but the real danger here is if a Romney is GOP candidate, as he is nothing more than a billionaire version of Obama.

The person I would like to see get more attention is Thaddeus McCotter and/ or Rick Perry.

Regardless we need a change from the hedonistic administration we currently have that is destroying America, morals and the worth of our hard work.

[BG45]

[quote name='kamiller42' timestamp='1310765267' post='2267930']
It would be nice if the people who pass her off as a flake, idiot, crazy, neocon, etc. would backup their words with proof.

It seems to me there is a drumbeat against conservative women. Would these women haters please provide the names of 5 intelligent conservative women deserving of public office?
[/quote]

I don't know if you're accusing me of being one of the "women haters", but just in case you are:
1) Dr. Condoleeza Rice. She's well versed in matters of national security and diplomacy, well educated, and came out mostly untarnished through the Bush Administration.
2) Senator Kay Bailey Hutchinson (or if that sounds too "women hater", her legal name is Kathryn Ann Bailey Hutchison). Well respected by both parties, serves on a number of important subcommittees. Despite saying she's all for legal abortion, her voting record says otherwise, as would NARAL consistently rating her between 0-7%.
3) Dana Perino was the Press Secretary in the Bush Administration. She's well liked on both sides of the political aisle and is pretty widely regarded to be intelligent.
4) Bay Buchanan, less famous sister of Pat Buchanan. She was the treasurer for Reagan's presidential campaigns and would serve as the youngest person to ever hold the office of the Treasurer of the United States.
5) Phylis Schlafly is getting up there in age, but would count I think. Constitutional lawyer, founder of the Eagle Forum, and has written or edited at least 20 books.

A couple bonus ones:
6) Senator Kelly Ayotte. She's the junior Senator from New Hampshire and was the state's Attorney General, not a job you tend to get by lacking some intelligence. She undertook a number of high profile cases while AG, including against Planned Parenthood. Her Committee assignments reflect a broad range of topics from the armed services to commerce and transportation.
7) Elizabeth Dole. She went to Harvard and Duke. She served on the Cabinet of both President George H. W. Bush (Secretary of Labor) and the Reagan Administration (Secretary of Transportation). She was a one term Senator for North Carolina.


I'm unsure you read the first page, where people linked to news articles and videos linking to news stories for "proof" of what at least some in the thread are saying; though other than one or two posts, I don't think I've seen anyone call her any names. Also as covered on page one of the thread, "Bachmann", not "Bauchman".

Not trying to sound combative, I agree with you that there are no perfect candidates, and that Ms. Bachmann isn't one. Of this list, I think Senator Ayotte sounds like the closest to what Bachmann touts herself as, but if she ever chooses to run for President, then hopefully it will be after she gets what Bachmann (and then candidate Obama) lacked; experience.

Edited July 15, 2011 by BG45

[kujo]

[quote name='Amppax' timestamp='1310689646' post='2267558']
Vague sentiment worked pretty well last election......
[/quote]

So did an incredible lack experience. If that's the "new thing," Bachmann is a shoe-in!

[quote name='kamiller42' timestamp='1310765267' post='2267930']
In regards to the whole pope is an anti-Christ and Rev Wright comparison, there is none. Obama attended his hate spewing church for 20 years. And when video of the preacher he posed shoulder to shoulder with was shown shouting America be darned to hell, he did not immediately step away from the pastor and his church. When the doctrine against the pope was brought to Bauchman's attention, she left. Here are some interesting thoughts on the issue, [url="http://the-american-catholic.com/2011/07/14/is-it-anti-catholic-to-believe-the-pope-is-the-anti-christ/"]Is anti-pope anti-Catholic[/url]?
[/quote]

What are you smokin'?

This church is focused on being extremely-faithful to what they believe to be Luther's teachings, and that includes his views on the Catholic Church and the papacy. We're not talking about a slip of a tongue by an overzealous preacher! This is the "official stance" as stated on their [url="http://www.wels.net/about-wels/doctrinal-statements/antichrist?page=0,8"]frigin' website![/url]

On the whole, though, I agree with you: it's not a big deal, for the same reason that I don't care that Mitt Romney or John Huntsman are Mormon. The President is not the leader of one denomination or another. He (or she) is the chief executive of the country. I don't take my moral or theological cues from any politician and neither should anyone else.

[quote name='StMichael' timestamp='1310770144' post='2267963']
Things like Social Security, Welfare, Medicare, etc. are not Constitutional.
[/quote]

????

WTF?

[kamiller42]

BG45,

Thank you for your five. I probably should have phrased my question a little more specifics. Name 5 conservative women that have pursued or won elected office worthy of not getting the typical trashing.

Here's my assessment of your list...
1) They trashed her. And to be honest, I think her race shielded some public criticisms.
2) Pseudo-conservative. Not the best record.
3) They attacked her intelligence and likened her to a Barbie doll. I mean... women can't look good AND be smart of course.
4) I don't have enough info on her to know how she was treated. But if it was like anyone else Reagan's circle, I am sure it wasn't good.
5) She's more a social activist than a politician. In any case, plenty of hateful comments about her.
6) Not enough info to make a call. Not a national figure.
7) Ok. That's 1.

[quote name='BG45' timestamp='1310770770' post='2267969']
I'm unsure you read the first page, where people linked to news articles and videos linking to news stories for "proof" of what at least some in the thread are saying; though other than one or two posts, I don't think I've seen anyone call her any names. Also as covered on page one of the thread, "Bachmann", not "Bauchman".[/quote]
Let's go over those "proofs" from the first page and see if any of it disqualifies her from being president...

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N98rQ1A8_UY[/media]
Very persuasive argument.

A story on her [url="http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/michele-bachmann-exclusive-pray-gay-candidates-clinic/story?id=14048691"]husband's practice[/url]. Not very controversial to me. It's his lawful business. The media would like to equate this with waterboarding I'm sure. If it's that criminal, prosecute and shut it down. I know a president who supports clinics which commit far more heinous crimes every day.

A [url="http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2011/07/06/bachmann_in_the_bathroom.html"]bathroom incident[/url]... really? Getting desperate?

I don't know if [url="http://www.fairport-erpost.com/highlight/x1629186053/Michael-Winship-Bachmann-flunks-Canadian-history-too"]the story about Bachmann and Canadian history[/url] is accurate. But if so, fine. She is not qualified to hold Canadian office.

She got [url="http://boston.cbslocal.com/2011/03/12/tea-party-favorite-misfires-puts-lexington-and-concord-in-nh/"]Lexington and Concord mixed up.[/url] Campaigning can take a lot of you. Next thing you know she'll be saying she's campaigned in 57 states with 1 left to go... you know Alaska and Hawaii, the 1 left to go. [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpGH02DtIws"]Watch it[/url]. And don't get me started on Joe Biden. LOL

[url="http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/jun/17/exclusive-minn-lawmaker-fears-census-abuse/"]Bachmann submits census form with just number of household[/url]. Well, there's a national crisis.

Is this the best arguments against her? Then, there are no legitimate arguments.

[quote]Not trying to sound combative, I agree with you that there are no perfect candidates, and that Ms. Bachmann isn't one. Of this list, I think Senator Ayotte sounds like the closest to what Bachmann touts herself as, but if she ever chooses to run for President, then hopefully it will be after she gets what Bachmann (and then candidate Obama) lacked; experience.
[/quote]
Bachmann has been in political office since 2001. She's a mother and businesswoman too. How much experience do you need? What are you looking for?

[kujo]

[quote name='kamiller42' timestamp='1310775117' post='2267992']
Let's go over those "proofs" from the first page and see if any of it disqualifies her from being president...

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N98rQ1A8_UY[/media]
Very persuasive argument.

Bachmann has been in political office since 2001. She's a mother and businesswoman too. How much experience do you need? What are you looking for?
[/quote]

First off, that video was a joke that I made, not a serious political criticism.

Secondly, she is utterly inexperienced, just as Obama was. He actually had [b]more[/b] experience than she, with his 7 years in the Illinois state senate, and 3 years as a U.S. senator (sorta...he campaigned for 2/3 of his time as a senator). Still, I found him bereft of anything resembling a suitable amount of tangible, leadership-driven experience.

Bachmann--with her 10 years of total experience--is somewhere beneath Obama and his paltry resume.

That's why I can't/won't vote for her. That and she's a flake.

[kamiller42]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1310772706' post='2267977']
What are you smokin'?

This church is focused on being extremely-faithful to what they believe to be Luther's teachings, and that includes his views on the Catholic Church and the papacy. We're not talking about a slip of a tongue by an overzealous preacher! This is the "official stance" as stated on their [url="http://www.wels.net/about-wels/doctrinal-statements/antichrist?page=0,8"]frigin' website![/url][/quote]
The Catholic Church has a web site, thousands of churches, a council of bishops in the U.S. with a web site, numerous publications including the important Catechism, its own press office, thousands of evangelists, and a powerful voice in the world called the pope. Yet, there are still Catholics walking around thinking contraception is okay, attending mass for Easter and Christmas is enough, and being pro-life is just good advice. There are people in my parish, including me, who do not read their church's bulletin. (Ok, I do scan it from time to time.) Many have never even visited its web site.

So, if you ask me if it's possible Bachmann did not know about this corner of her church's doctrine? I say, with great certainty, yes!

[kujo]

[quote name='kamiller42' timestamp='1310776581' post='2268001']
The Catholic Church has a web site, thousands of churches, a council of bishops in the U.S. with a web site, numerous publications including the important Catechism, its own press office, thousands of evangelists, and a powerful voice in the world called the pope. Yet, there are still Catholics walking around thinking contraception is okay, attending mass for Easter and Christmas is enough, and being pro-life is just good advice. There are people in my parish, including me, who do not read their church's bulletin. (Ok, I do scan it from time to time.) Many have never even visited its web site.

So, if you ask me if it's possible Bachmann did not know about this corner of her church's doctrine? I say, with great certainty, yes!
[/quote]

I wonder if you would have espoused the same amount of deference to Obama during the Rev. Wright uproar...

[kamiller42]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1310775445' post='2267994']
Secondly, she is utterly inexperienced, just as Obama was. He actually had [b]more[/b] experience than she, with his 7 years in the Illinois state senate, and 3 years as a U.S. senator (sorta...he campaigned for 2/3 of his time as a senator). Still, I found him bereft of anything resembling a suitable amount of tangible, leadership-driven experience.

Bachmann--with her 10 years of total experience--is somewhere beneath Obama and his paltry resume. [/quote]
I guess she's been too busy going to law school, being a foster mother for 23 kids, a social activist for the pro-life cause, and running a business to be a politician. Obama clearly has accomplished much more in his life.

Obama's experience in the Illinois senate can be summed up in one word: "present." LOL

[quote]That's why I can't/won't vote for her. That and she's a flake.[/quote]
Quantify "flake."

[BG45]

Knowing members of state legislatures, way more experience than they provide. As to what I expect; I expect experience at a national level to handle national issues, and on the national level she has 3 years. I'd prefer at least six, because as a member of the House of Representatives, you have a two year term. One year is spent doing stuff, then the next year is pretty much spent campaigning for money so you can go back and serve another year before you have to ask people for money and votes again.

The bathroom incident is hardly worthy of being dismissed. It shows a level of political amateurism to scream that you're being cornered in a bathroom and run out the door as the lesbians stare bewildered at what just happened, all because you're doing poorly at a town hall meeting. The police even dismissed the case for lack of evidence of what she reported happening. If you do that at a town hall meeting, what do you do when you become President?

Bachmann's advocacy to not fill out the Census, no not a national crisis. But it is another show of just how amateurish she is as a politician. Grandstanding against the thing that helps determine how funds are allocated.

And yeah, I've seen Obama's 57 states gaffe before, as well as his saying "internets". Unfortunately, he wasn't held to the same level of mockery as George W. Bush was in regards to saying "Internets". I think it's quite patriotic to lampoon whomever is in power at the time, lest they become too complacent in their authority. I have to admit, I laughed a lot at Obama's limo getting stuck on a high ramp when he was doing a recent overseas tour.

And my list is rendered mostly invalid by the quantification on the question.

[kujo]

[quote name='kamiller42' timestamp='1310777405' post='2268005']
I guess she's been too busy going to law school, being a foster mother for 23 kids, a social activist for the pro-life cause, and running a business to be a politician. Obama clearly has accomplished much more in his life. [/quote]

So her ignorance of what seems like a fairly central tenet of the teachings of the church she attended up until about a year ago (coincidence?) is forgivable because she's "busy?"

Because that's what it boils down to--either she was "ignorant" of the teaching, or she knew of it. There's no middle ground here. If she didn't know it, I'd find that hard to believe. But if she DID know it, and continued attending that church--until, of course, she became more "busy" visiting early primary states about a year ago-- then she's got a problem to answer for.

But again, I have to wonder whether your eagerness to write this off would manifest itself if we were talking about a Democrat.

[quote]Obama's experience in the Illinois senate can be summed up in one word: "present." LOL[/quote]

Better than his experience in the U.S. senate! I read once that he had the worst attendance during his brief stint as a senator! :smh:

[quote]Quantify "flake."
[/quote]

What, you want a number?

How about L-7 weeny?

[Jesus_lol]

Its funny Kujo, as soon as you make fun of a conservative lady because she is kooky and a political minefield, you get lambasted as a sexist. also noted with Sarah Palin, another person with a tenuous grip on reality at best.

It seems the white knights defending the conservative ladies are more willing to make it about gender than anyone else. "for qualifications, well she is a mother, that is practically enough right there."

no, sorry that does not count. I am aware that being a mother is hard, but every married woman on this site is one, and so has been every single female ancestor of everyone on earth. Being a mom is hard, but i dont see why it is brought up as a qualification for the job of president. My mum is a mother, and she sure as heck isnt presidential for the experience.

For all the crowing about Obama's lack of experience, and getting elected on personality alone, the Republican party seems to be sprouting unexperienced, loud mouthed and ignorant candidates who amass votes from pure emotion and soundbytes..

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='Jesus_lol' timestamp='1310780220' post='2268024']
Its funny Kujo, as soon as you make fun of a conservative lady because she is kooky and a political minefield, you get lambasted as a sexist. also noted with Sarah Palin, another person with a tenuous grip on reality at best.

It seems the white knights defending the conservative ladies are more willing to make it about gender than anyone else. "for qualifications, well she is a mother, that is practically enough right there."

no, sorry that does not count. I am aware that being a mother is hard, but every married woman on this site is one, and so has been every single female ancestor of everyone on earth. Being a mom is hard, but i dont see why it is brought up as a qualification for the job of president. My mum is a mother, and she sure as heck isnt presidential for the experience.

For all the crowing about Obama's lack of experience, and getting elected on personality alone, the Republican party seems to be sprouting unexperienced, loud mouthed and ignorant candidates who amass votes from pure emotion and soundbytes..
[/quote]

Just because someone doesn't have the same point of view that you do doesn't mean that they have a tenuous grip on reality.

[kujo]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' timestamp='1310783475' post='2268035']
Just because someone doesn't have the same point of view that you do doesn't mean that they have a tenuous grip on reality.
[/quote]

Very true.

However, Sarah Palin has a tenuous grip on reality.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1310772706' post='2267977']
WTF?
[/quote]
please don't use that abbreviation.

[Lil Red]

[u]this is not a mod statement, just a Lil Red statement:[/u]

fyi, i would just like to say that i have spoken out of turn when stating that it is against the guidelines when name-calling politicians. it might not be - it's a case by case basis. if you feel a violation has occurred, please utilize the 'report' button.

wherever possible though, i will, as a phatmasser and not a mod, point out if i feel someone is being intellectually lazy and/or being uncharitable. as Protestants, as Catholics, and especially those who have the Church Militant/Church Scholar tag - we are called to a higher standard than name-calling politicians just because they are public officials - it's uncalled for and not appropriate on a Catholic phorum to attack them as a person. don't like someone, fine, say that you don't like someone. If you want to disagree with a politician's positions or actions, that's fine. But again, I think to just make statements such as, "She's nuts.", is in poor form for any discussion and again is being lazy with the words we use. (I'm paraphrasing another phatmasser here.)

*stepping off soapbox now*