Women In Habits

[OnlySunshine]

[quote name='inperpetuity' timestamp='1311013416' post='2269532']
This was the very first community I visited when I began to think about religious life back in 1992. The sisters were very nice. I grew up near their monastery which had a very beautiful chapel and grounds. It has since been torn down and rebuilt because the sisters wanted a smaller monastery. Anyway, the sister to the priest's right was the novice mistress at the time, and when I asked her why she didn't wear a veil, she said,[b] "I believe it suppresses my femininity".[/b]
[/quote]


That's so sad to hear. I think veils bring out the femininity in Sisters. I so love the veils for the Sisters of Life, Nashville Dominicans, Ann Arbor Dominicans, and the Sister Servants of the Eternal Word because of how long they are. They also frame the face well. Veils are utterly beautiful. Last night, I read this on a Carmelite website:
[quote]
As many of you already know, our happiest news is the Final Profession and Veiling of one of our young novices. We present a few photographs of the day to share a little of that joy with you. The religious habit and veil in our days often raises questions. Although there is a definite “return to tradition” in the Church and among her religious orders, the habit is not that often seen. “Why a veil?” is a frequent query. The Catholic Encyclopedia acquaints us with a bit of the historical basis and reasoning behind the wearing of the veil by consecrated Religious women. We learn that in ancient Rome, a red veil, or a veil with red stripes, distinguished the newly-married women from the unmarried; so it was actually the married woman who wore a veil, to reveal to the world her status of belonging to one man. From the earliest times, Christ was represented to the Christian virgin as a husband, the only person, according to St. Paul (Corinthians 7:34) she had to think of, live for and please. It was natural that the bride of Christ should adopt the veil, which thus symbolized not only the purity but also the inviolable fidelity to Christ which was to be reverenced in her. “The taking of the veil then suggested an obligation of constancy.” In our own Veiling Ceremony, after the veil is blessed, the Sister sings this phrase from Psalm 118: “Accept me, Lord, according to Your word, and I shall live; and do not confound me of my hope.” And the celebrant, the bishop or priest who gives the veil, answers, “Receive the sacred veil, the symbol of modesty and reverence; and may you so ever carry it to the tribunal of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you may possess life everlasting and may live forever and ever. Amen.” It is worthy to note that the white veil of the novice is not blessed, only the black veil of Perpetual Profession; and it is the custom for us reverently to kiss our veil each time we put it on, the constant reminder of loving gratitude for our holy vocation of belonging only to Christ![/quote]

[Maximilianus]

[quote name='inperpetuity' timestamp='1311013416' post='2269532']
she said, "I believe it suppresses my femininity".
[/quote]

???. Okay.

[Mary Magdalene]

[quote name='inperpetuity' timestamp='1311013416' post='2269532']
and when I asked her why she didn't wear a veil, she said, "I believe it suppresses my femininity".
[/quote]


hmmm...

Prayers for her

[HopefulBride]

[quote name='inperpetuity' timestamp='1311013416' post='2269532']
This was the very first community I visited when I began to think about religious life back in 1992. The sisters were very nice. I grew up near their monastery which had a very beautiful chapel and grounds. It has since been torn down and rebuilt because the sisters wanted a smaller monastery. [b]Anyway, the sister to the priest's right was the novice mistress at the time, and when I asked her why she didn't wear a veil, she said, "I believe it suppresses my femininity".[/b]
[/quote]

Did she elaborate?

[faithcecelia]

I would be interested to hear if she still had the same opinion. Its nearly 20yrs since that comment, and I think there has been a general move since then. Women, both in religious life and secular life, no longer need to fight to be recognised as themselves they way they did. Look at the workplace - on the whole women are moving away from the 'powerdressing' of the 80s and early 90s, recognising that they do not need to dress that way to be accepted as good at their jobs, etc. Similarly, women religious, especially I think those in active orders, don't need to prove themselves either. We have seen some orders move back into slightly more traditional habits, others adapt more or give them up completely, both of which are absolutely fine and I am sure the decisions have been made after a lot of thought and prayer. I cannot, of course, read this sister's mind, but I would not be suprised if her view now was more that she chooses not to rather than because it supresses her femininity.

[BarbTherese]

[quote][u]Matthew Chapter 6[/u]
[25] Therefore I say to you, be not solicitous for your life, what you shall eat, [b][u]nor for your body, what you shall put on.[/[/u]b] Is not the life more than the meat: and the body more than the raiment?
[26] Behold the birds of the air, for they neither sow, nor do they reap, nor gather into barns: and your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are not you of much more value than they? [27] And which of you by taking thought, can add to his stature by one cubit?

[28] [b][u]And for raiment why are you solicitous?[/u][/b] Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow: they labour not, neither do they spin. [29] But I say to you, that not even Solomon in all his glory was arrayed as one of these. [30] And if the grass of the field, which is today, and tomorrow is cast into the oven, God doth so clothe: how much more you, O ye of little faith? [/quote]
I could not, it seemed, detach myself from vanity and its many expressions until I was truly and literally poor - and then I could not afford what otherwise, I most certainly would have bought for myself. Journeying on that unchosen road in its stark literalness for a few years, I eventually found I was no longer actively concerned about expressions of identity in any way shape or form, except that I am careful to present myself as well as possible for the sake of my two sons when in their company. I said to a nun I knew one day that human beings cannot resist advertising and that we advertise identity in the clothing we wear. She replied "Only the truly poor cannot". Right she was! The blessings and benefits of actual literal poverty are truly stunning and only literal poverty, short of a miracle of Grace, can be the channel I think.
I love the religious habit and it has a place and witness I think, but not the only place and witness - and if religious choose to modify the habit or return to secular clothing, I respect them and their decisions. The same if they choose to go back to a more traditional habit. God bless em all in anything at all!

[inperpetuity]

[quote name='HopefulBride' timestamp='1311030751' post='2269716']
Did she elaborate?
[/quote]

No, I think I just changed the subject.

Edited July 19, 2011 by inperpetuity

[krissylou]

[quote name='faithcecelia' timestamp='1311069486' post='2269915']
I would be interested to hear if she still had the same opinion. Its nearly 20yrs since that comment, and I think there has been a general move since then. Women, both in religious life and secular life, no longer need to fight to be recognised as themselves they way they did. Look at the workplace - on the whole women are moving away from the 'powerdressing' of the 80s and early 90s, recognising that they do not need to dress that way to be accepted as good at their jobs, etc. Similarly, women religious, especially I think those in active orders, don't need to prove themselves either. We have seen some orders move back into slightly more traditional habits, others adapt more or give them up completely, both of which are absolutely fine and I am sure the decisions have been made after a lot of thought and prayer. I cannot, of course, read this sister's mind, but I would not be suprised if her view now was more that she chooses not to rather than because it supresses her femininity.
[/quote]

There are so many ways in which practices have changed their meaning over the years.

Not just religious practices.

So, for instance, a lot of young women of my mother's generation were advised "don't ever learn how to type" -- because if people know you can type then no matter what else you can do you'll just be expected to be a typist.

(Note: Sandra Day O'Connor graduated I believe #3 in her class from Stanford Law School and kept getting job offers as a legal secretary.)

Nobody says that anymore. Typing is just an important skill to have, for everybody.

Or there's this revitalization of interest in homesteader-sort of things such as canning or knitting. For my grandmother's generation, this was her WORK. And, unsurprisingly, my mother's generation stopped doing a bunch of them. And it seems like everywhere you turn these days a new yarn shop is opening up, as many people in my generation are picking such things up as hobbies. It's the same practice -- but it means something very different now than it did for my grandmother.

Same sort of thing can be true for religious practices. In a lot of the cultures where habits were developed, all married women covered their heads in various ways. It didn't mean "nun" it meant "I'm not looking for a husband, I'm taken." Over time, customs and conventions changed and a veil clearly meant "nun." And that clear and visible witness can be a very good thing -- but that itself is an evolution.

And of course there have been all sorts of different cultural shifts over the last fifty years of the Church. (For instance, choosing to seek out a Latin Mass means something different now than it meant in 1955 when that's just what it was, no questions asked.) And cloisters are almost inevitably their own separate world. So for someone who entered in 1950, it's easy to still think of the world in 1950s terms, and for someone who entered in 1970, etc.

All of which is to say that the same practices may take on different meanings over time, in different contexts. This happens all over everywhere, not simply when it comes to religious life, but it also happens in religious life. This is totally a part of life, and trying to fight against it is tilting against windmills. And it's not necessarily bad. (Habits generally were not that conspicuous in their original contexts -- but that doesn't mean that becoming more conspicuous is necessarily bad! It could be a very good evolution!)

Err, enough of that. Back to fun pictures!

[dominicansoul]

[quote name='krissylou' timestamp='1311104623' post='2270270']
There are so many ways in which practices have changed their meaning over the years.

Not just religious practices.

So, for instance, a lot of young women of my mother's generation were advised "don't ever learn how to type" -- because if people know you can type then no matter what else you can do you'll just be expected to be a typist.

(Note: Sandra Day O'Connor graduated I believe #3 in her class from Stanford Law School and kept getting job offers as a legal secretary.)

Nobody says that anymore. Typing is just an important skill to have, for everybody.

Or there's this revitalization of interest in homesteader-sort of things such as canning or knitting. For my grandmother's generation, this was her WORK. And, unsurprisingly, my mother's generation stopped doing a bunch of them. And it seems like everywhere you turn these days a new yarn shop is opening up, as many people in my generation are picking such things up as hobbies. It's the same practice -- but it means something very different now than it did for my grandmother.

Same sort of thing can be true for religious practices. In a lot of the cultures where habits were developed, all married women covered their heads in various ways. It didn't mean "nun" it meant "I'm not looking for a husband, I'm taken." Over time, customs and conventions changed and a veil clearly meant "nun." And that clear and visible witness can be a very good thing -- but that itself is an evolution.

And of course there have been all sorts of different cultural shifts over the last fifty years of the Church. (For instance, choosing to seek out a Latin Mass means something different now than it meant in 1955 when that's just what it was, no questions asked.) And cloisters are almost inevitably their own separate world. So for someone who entered in 1950, it's easy to still think of the world in 1950s terms, and for someone who entered in 1970, etc.

All of which is to say that the same practices may take on different meanings over time, in different contexts. This happens all over everywhere, not simply when it comes to religious life, but it also happens in religious life. This is totally a part of life, and trying to fight against it is tilting against windmills. And it's not necessarily bad. (Habits generally were not that conspicuous in their original contexts -- but that doesn't mean that becoming more conspicuous is necessarily bad! It could be a very good evolution!)

Err, enough of that. Back to fun pictures!
[/quote]


the veil and the habit are timeless and transcend cultures, styles and other worldy improvisations

[Little Flower]

Dominican Nuns of Summit, New Jersey

[img]http://nunsopsummit.org/wp-content/gallery/cache/107__320x240_sjm-profession.jpg[/img]



[img]http://nunsopsummit.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/novitiate2011web.jpg[/img]

[img]http://nunsopsummit.org/wp-content/gallery/community-photo-gallery/nunsnovicesweb.jpg[/img]

[img]http://nunsopsummit.org/wp-content/gallery/community-photo-gallery/smtchoir.jpg[/img]

[img]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-Ov2qhNOIk_4/ThkC92_q58I/AAAAAAAADS8/q62aEwWqj-E/s400/IMG_3073.JPG[/img]

[emilier98]

I'm going to visit the Summit Dominicans in September!!!!

[Little Flower]

[quote name='emilier98' timestamp='1311191380' post='2271847']
I'm going to visit the Summit Dominicans in September!!!!
[/quote]
Yay!!!!!!! I just visited them a couple weeks ago! I was only able to stay for a couple hours though so I'm hoping to visit again soon. How long are you staying for?

[size="1"]edited to make my clapping person clap[/size]

Edited July 20, 2011 by Little Flower

[emilier98]

[quote name='Little Flower' timestamp='1311191643' post='2271855']
Yay!!!!!!! I just visited them a couple weeks ago! I was only able to stay for a couple hours though so I'm hoping to visit again soon. How long are you staying for?

[size="1"]edited to make my clapping person clap[/size]
[/quote]

I'll be there September 2-5. I cannot wait to meet Sr. Mary Catherine. She is so much fun to talk to.

[Little Flower]

[quote name='emilier98' timestamp='1311191760' post='2271857']
I'll be there September 2-5. I cannot wait to meet Sr. Mary Catherine. She is so much fun to talk to.
[/quote]

Now I'm jealous! I wish I could have stayed for that long. Ya, she is really fun to talk to. A lot better than the novice mistress of another community I talked to, where I kinda felt like she was just waiting until she could be done talking to me. She didn't really answer my questions as much as I would have liked.

Did you know she's on phatmass?

[emilier98]

[quote name='Little Flower' timestamp='1311192518' post='2271872']
Now I'm jealous! I wish I could have stayed for that long. Ya, she is really fun to talk to. A lot better than the novice mistress of another community I talked to, where I kinda felt like she was just waiting until she could be done talking to me. She didn't really answer my questions as much as I would have liked.

Did you know she's on phatmass?
[/quote]

I did know that. We've had a few conversations about phatmass and some of the things on it. I cannot wait to sit down and talk with her. Also did you know she has a thing for pecan pie?