the 13th papist Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 This one is still my favorite: gay, married, womanpriest. TRIFECTA! http://www.ncronline.org/news/women/women%E2%80%99s-ordination-old-news Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Vega Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 From that article: "Janine Denomme has been fighting two courageous battles. First, the 45-year-old Detroit native has struggled with a persistent, compelling sense of being called to the priesthood that, sadly, has not been honored, affirmed or recognized by the institutional church." Wahwahwahwahwahwahwahwahwah I left a comment on that article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithcecelia Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 [quote name='nunsense' timestamp='1307947147' post='2253071'] I don't feel sickened by this. I feel deeply saddened. [/quote] Yes, me too. I know there are many women who do feel called to the priesthood, and actually when I began my discernment of religious life I spent a long time in prayer to be sure I truely felt called to be a nun, as I knew I would never be satisfied in religious life if I actually felt my calling was the priesthood (this was particularly of note to me as it had been expected I would enter the minisrty in my former denomination). Yet I, like the vast majority of the women who believe it their calling, accept absolutely that the church simply cannot ordain women. i think it shows far more faith that these women accept that and continue to worship and serve God in other states depending on their own situation. I don't see, however, that a direct comparison can be made between a man being a priest and a woman being a nun - a man can be a priest or a brother, a woman can only be a sister. I think those women who do feel called to the priesthood must have a real 'emptiness' however they choose to deal with it, and I pray for their courage to stand firm in their faith. I suppose this is also the same for most priests knowing they have to be celibate, but also knowing there are now many married priests. I pray for the women in this article, I pray they will realise that, for the many reasons already discussed, they are not actually priests, and that in time they will accept the church teachings and be reconciled. I also pray for their familes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thessalonian Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 [quote name='the 13th papist' timestamp='1307998255' post='2253301'] This one is still my favorite: gay, married, womanpriest. TRIFECTA! http://www.ncronline.org/news/women/women%E2%80%99s-ordination-old-news [/quote] This is the sad part in the article: She "taught high school theology". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissScripture Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 [quote name='thessalonian' timestamp='1308009385' post='2253370'] This is the sad part in the article: She "taught high school theology". [/quote] Honestly, it wouldn't shock me if one or two of my high school theology teachers were to do something like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thessalonian Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 "I think those women who do feel called to the priesthood must have a real 'emptiness' however they choose to deal with it, and I pray for their courage to stand firm in their faith" With all due respect this shows how careful we must be in what we "feel" we are called to and why prayer, time, and the input of the Church is a neccessary part of our "callings". We can trust that God does not give women callings to the priesthood as this would be contrary to how he established his Church and so such callings are a deception and are from our disorder and brokenness. I would attribute them to the society that we live in which plants seeds of false equality in all of us from a very young age. Even in the Church we are infected by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catholictothecore Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 [quote name='dUSt' timestamp='1307908243' post='2252822'] Yeah, but the media keeps saying they are Catholic, and members of the Catholic church. If this is to stop, I think we'll need a formal public excommunication. [/quote] Don't forget: the media WANTS them to be Catholic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AccountDeleted Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 An on the lighter side - a parody of the NPR article about male nuns! [url="http://insightscoop.typepad.com/2004/2011/06/this-just-in-npr-national-pathetic-radio-with-a-special-nod-to-this-news-piece-for-inspiration-in-1993-seven-men-were-s.html"]http://insightscoop.typepad.com/2004/2011/06/this-just-in-npr-national-pathetic-radio-with-a-special-nod-to-this-news-piece-for-inspiration-in-1993-seven-men-were-s.html[/url] Funny reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theresita Nerita Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Yeah, I actually spent time looking at the womenpriests website today. In order to give them their due, and not to jump to any conclusions. It's sort of sad. I mean, if their whole argument boils down to "sometimes Church tradition has evolved over centuries... and therefore this will certainly be one of those issues." But the sad thing is that it's obviously not... and it's not even because the issue itself is so self-evident! I've never found arguments on either side that compelling. But the thing is, real reformers of the Church, like St. John of the Cross for example, had a few qualities that these women don't have: 1) Personal holiness. When a person is really called to reform the church, they usually are so holy and renowned in their own hometown that they gain a LOT of support on a grassroots level, which disappointingly to the womenpriests has not happened with this issue. Also the reformer usually shows obedience to the church on every other issue, so that it's evident this is something different, an exception. I totally dont see that. 2) Willingness to face persecution because they're SO sure their cause is of God. These women obviously aren't at all sure because their biggest complaint is that they have to face any persecution at all. If this was really from God they would be willing not only to face censure but even to be locked up or to stand in front of the Inquisition like St. Teresa of Avila. I don't see that kind of courage here. 3) Most importantly, if a reform is from God I think the method of reform would be sinless and holy - full of virtues like patience, charity, humility, etc. I definitely don't see that. 4) Also, I feel like if the Holy Spirit is guiding the church in a new direction, the reformer will be able to state her case concisely and eloquently and according to the Church's inner logic, and at the level of real Catholic theological discourse. These women don't even cite their sources on the website! It's full of half-truths and twisted quotes - I feel like a real reformer can always support their argument with endless quotes from scripture (not one or two) and the catechism. Even if they're uneducated, the Holy Spirit comes to their aid if it's form God. anyway. this was bugging me today. consider brain dumped. g'night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Vega Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 [quote name='Theresita Nerita' timestamp='1308029150' post='2253499']... [/quote] You clearly spent a lot of time on and gave much attention to this group - indeed, likely much more than they deserve. This was a very well written post though, with many good points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chamomile Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 (edited) [quote name='USAirwaysIHS' timestamp='1308030086' post='2253501'] You clearly spent a lot of time on and gave much attention to this group - indeed, likely much more than they deserve. This was a very well written post though, with many good points. [/quote] Amen. All the points you (Teresita) raised speak to the witness of Christ, as He reformed death to life by submitting to death itself and all sorts of persecution, humiliation, physical & emotional pain and much more in silence. This is not what the women "priests" are imaging. Either you are with Christ - you follow Him and His example - or you are against Him - not following Him and doing things contrary to how He did them. Edited June 14, 2011 by Chamomile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MithLuin Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 (edited) Well, there are probably a good number of guys who become priests for the wrong reasons too (if we're being entirely fair, here), but I agree that if you want to be a [i]reformer[/i] - you should be exemplary in your virtue and holiness, so that no one can really call you to task at all (except for criticizing the 'reform'). Talking about how much you've always wanted something just makes you sound...grasping, or selfish. There are lots of things we might really want in life...but be denied. You can't marry someone without their agreement, for instance! And wanting a job and getting a job are two entirely different things. And really....a broken heart is the only possible ending I can see for this. Surely these women realize they aren't 'really' priests, and if so....must feel a bit disappointed to be taking part in a sham version of what they think they truly want? Here's the leader of 'womenpriests' at the ACC conference in Detroit this past weekend. [url=http://cmsimg.freep.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/bilde?NewTbl=1&Site=c4&Date=20110612&Category=NEWS&ArtNo=106120802&Ref=PH&Item=6](photo)[/url] She's the one on the left, though the one next to her is also a member of the group. Basically, that's a catch-all for dissent and anger and frustration with the Church. As someone on another site pointed out, someone needs to teach them Ignatian spirituality, so they can learn to discern spirits. Desolation is not the place to make decisions from! Though probably the spiritual problems are a lot deeper than that. Edited June 14, 2011 by MithLuin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AccountDeleted Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 [quote name='MithLuin' timestamp='1308058573' post='2253571'] Well, there are probably a good number of guys who become priests for the wrong reasons too (if we're being entirely fair, here), but I agree that if you want to be a [i]reformer[/i] - you should be exemplary in your virtue and holiness, so that no one can really call you to task at all (except for criticizing the 'reform'). Talking about how much you've always wanted something just makes you sound...grasping, or selfish. There are lots of things we might really want in life...but be denied. You can't marry someone without their agreement, for instance! And wanting a job and getting a job are two entirely different things. And really....a broken heart is the only possible ending I can see for this. Surely these women realize they aren't 'really' priests, and if so....must feel a bit disappointed to be taking part in a sham version of what they think they truly want? [/quote] It is so good that we can see this. I am so sad for these women because they aren't doing this just to be in opposition to the Church but because they truly want this in their hearts. The problem with that is that we can't always have what we want in our hearts - sometimes God is asking something else of us. Maybe Jesus would have like to have had a wife and kids - at least He certainly didn't want to go ahead with the Passion, but He surrendered His will to God's will. These women could be serving the Church in so many other ways, but they insist on this one particular expression of their faith, which is quite clearly denied to them, just as motherhood is denied to men. It is sad, terribly sad that they can't see this because you are right, it will end in broken hearts. Or in anger and more sin.... either way it is sad and bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatherineM Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 St. Catherine was a reformer. She started every letter to the Pope with her humility. When you think you are right and the church is wrong, that is a position of pride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carmenchristi Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 (edited) [quote name='MithLuin' timestamp='1307969002' post='2253112']But yes, these women have been automatically excommunicated, and the two who gave their names to NPR might find themselves formally excommunicated as well, should their bishops find out about it. [/quote] Well I doubt it, I'm originally from the Rochester diocese.... where "Fr." Patti is from. I agree... terribly sad. No possibility for a happy ending unless they realize that they are mistaken and repent. Edited June 14, 2011 by carmenchristi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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