Amppax Posted June 2, 2011 Share Posted June 2, 2011 [quote name='PennyLane' timestamp='1307057580' post='2249321'] Thank you all on the feedback. I looked over the material on the web earlier today and can understand what you all are saying. It is what we make of it. Hopefully we can make it orthodox and increase vocations!! [/quote] Amen [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/clap2.gif[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisa Posted June 2, 2011 Share Posted June 2, 2011 (edited) [quote name='PennyLane' timestamp='1307057580' post='2249321'] Hopefully we can make it orthodox and increase vocations!! [/quote] Edited June 2, 2011 by Lisa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
add Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 [quote name='dUSt' timestamp='1307021925' post='2249141'] the founder of Lifeteen, Dale Fushek, was excommunicated for starting his own praise and worship center. [/quote] Lifeteen is Dale Fushek, personified Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 [quote name='AudreyGrace' timestamp='1307027235' post='2249164'] There are 5 teens (that i know of) who claim to be either gay, lesbian, or bisexual and are open and unashamed of it. Just last week at our pastor's going away party, I had to see girls flirting with girls, couples practically all over each other, and other things I'd rather not see at Church. We haven't had a life night on homosexuality in a while, I believe it's because my youth minister does not want to "scare away" anyone. Which i think is ridiculous, and that there is an appropriate approach to the topic that she needs to find. Other than those types of issues, our Life Teen program is pretty orthodox. I'll rant later, the 6th period bell rang, gotta go to class. [/quote] Yeah...it's [i]terrible[/i] for people to be "unashamed" that they're homosexual. Anyway, it sounds like your YM and CORE Members--not to mention your clergy and religious education staff-- are doing a poor job at catechesis. And that's kinda the rub in this whole thing, one which dUst hit on perfectly in his post above; the LIFE TEEN program is nothing but a couple of booklets and resources on Church doctrine and teachings. In other words, they're just words on a page; however, as with anything else (see: the Bible, the Constitution), it becomes fodder for peoples previously-existing ideas and notions. That can sometimes be good--my YM in high school constructed the program in such a way that it engaged the entire family instead of just we high schoolers, based on a desire to foster deeper relationships between parents in their children. But, as evidenced by some of the bad experiences you can read about here and elsewhere, there are times when the preconceived notions, biases and disdain for one or another of the Church's teachings, held by the YM and the other leaders, percolate into their ministry. But that isn't a failing of LIFE TEEN itself; rather, it's evidence that no one is perfect and that humans project their attitudes and beliefs onto everything they do. [quote name='add' timestamp='1307088975' post='2249418'] Lifeteen is Dale Fushek, personified [/quote] So, LIFE TEEN--a program which has brought thousands, perhaps millions, of young people and adults into a fully, deep relationship with Christ-- is the personification of a child-molesting Lothario who used his position in the Church and in the community to profit personally and sexually, before being excommunicated for wanting to exploit that same position to create his own denomination of Christianity? Makes me wonder whether someone has ever been to a LIFE TEEN program. Or maybe he/she wasn't hugged enough as a baby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Adam Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 Life teen as a program is basically a "textbook". You get a box with lesson plans in it. You've mentioned what's wrong with how they run the youth ministry program at your parish, those are all terrible things, but what is wrong with life teen? Is it the methodology? The content? I use elements of Life Teen in our parish. I think if the staff at Life Teen knew what your parish was doing, especially during adoration, they would be horrified. The Life Teen staff runs many of Steubenville conferences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Brother Adam' timestamp='1307109289' post='2249449'] Life teen as a program is basically a "textbook". You get a box with lesson plans in it. You've mentioned what's wrong with how they run the youth ministry program at your parish, those are all terrible things, but what is wrong with life teen? Is it the methodology? The content? I use elements of Life Teen in our parish. I think if the staff at Life Teen knew what your parish was doing, especially during adoration, they would be horrified. The Life Teen staff runs many of Steubenville conferences. [/quote] The program at my parish hosted weekly adoration sessions on Wednesday night. A priest or a deacon would show up to our parish hall at 8ish (we did praise & worship songs beginning at 7:30) and expose the Sacrament for us. We'd have silent adoration for about 45 minutes or so, and the priest or deacon would offer a benediction before reposing the Sacrament. The only time a non-clergy member ever exposed/reposed the Sacrament was if the YM (who was a Eucharistic Minister) had to do it during a LIFE Night when a priest or deacon was unavailable. That only ever happened a handful of times and I can assure you that he was well aware that laity aren't to be "blessing" people with the Monstrance. Edited June 3, 2011 by kujo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AudreyGrace Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1307107612' post='2249445'] Yeah...it's [i]terrible[/i] for people to be "unashamed" that they're homosexual. Anyway, it sounds like your YM and CORE Members--not to mention your clergy and religious education staff-- are doing a poor job at catechesis. And that's kinda the rub in this whole thing, one which dUst hit on perfectly in his post above; the LIFE TEEN program is nothing but a couple of booklets and resources on Church doctrine and teachings. In other words, they're just words on a page; however, as with anything else (see: the Bible, the Constitution), it becomes fodder for peoples previously-existing ideas and notions. That can sometimes be good--my YM in high school constructed the program in such a way that it engaged the entire family instead of just we high schoolers, based on a desire to foster deeper relationships between parents in their children. But, as evidenced by some of the bad experiences you can read about here and elsewhere, there are times when the preconceived notions, biases and disdain for one or another of the Church's teachings, held by the YM and the other leaders, percolate into their ministry. But that isn't a failing of LIFE TEEN itself; rather, it's evidence that no one is perfect and that humans project their attitudes and beliefs onto everything they do. [/quote] There is a difference between being unashamed and being unreserved. I have no problem with someone acknowledging having same sex attraction, but when somone has the disrespect to go into a Church that they know is against same sex relationships and bring members of the same sex with them whom they are either dating or hoping to date in the future, while making blatant sexual innuendos all night, is uncalled for IMO. The concept that they have no consideration for the religious community that they are choosing to associate themselves with is what I meant by "unashamed." I probably should have used a different word or explained myself better, and for that I apologize. To what you said about the organization: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinaSt.Cecilia2772 Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 I don't think lifeteen is more liberal, i think it's a more contemporary way of teaching the Catholic Church teachings. Like alot of people have said before me, Lifeteen has brought alot of youth to Chirst and the Eucharist more prominently, including myself. I think in our more contemporary world we need a more contemporary way of teaching youth the true Church Teachings, because that's what alot of youth are familiar with. I'm not saying that's all we should teach, i think everyone should know how the traditional Masses and traditional Catholic ways are Celebrated too, and everyone can decide which one they enjoy and get more out of. For me, i love contemporary because it's something new, but i also think that traditional ways are beautiful. it's all in the way you see it. I'm a big fan of Lifeteen, it has helped me alot through my Faith Journey and learning more about the Catholic Church. I agree that it's also a program in how the leaders in the parish of running it, for me being a bad experience as well. But i've been to other Lifeteen youth groups and it's fantastic. so it all depends on various things. Lifeteen has also led me to discern being a youth minister. I love youth ministry and i want to lead youth to the true church, because i believe the youth are the future of the church. So i think lifeteen is a great way of helping youth and students realize their place in role within the church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 I regard LifeTeen in a similar way to the so-called Charismatic Renewal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithcecelia Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 I have no experience of Life Teen, but from years of working with Teen's in both my former denomination and the Catholic Church, I'd say they tend to meet your expectations, whatever they are. If you go into something praying and believing they will grow in love and faith through it, they will. Likewise, if you go into it thinking 'well, whats the point they wont take it seriously' then that is exactly what you will get from them. Teenagers can smell hypocrisy at a thousand paces, and will respond better to honest confusion than false knowledge/ I try to view any teen programme as a learning process for all involved - I have learnt so, so much from the teens I have worked with and I thank God for each and every one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominicansoul Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 its not for me... i was taught the mystical beauty and splendor of the Mass by my mom at a very early early age...i've always believed this is what teens need, not the rock n roll guitar choirs or the Priest who celebrates the Mass like Jay Leno does the Tonite Show... ...no need to make the Mass more "exciting.." I mean, what can be more exciting than Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ giving Himself to us in the Sacrament of the Eucharist? I've recognized a real hunger in teens, and it isn't satisfied by "gimmicks." All you need to feed them is Truth... Again, I'm not familiar with the "reverent" version of LifeTeen, as the only version I've witnessed is some psuedo-protestant, wishy washy stuff--a failure in every sense of the word...it hasn't evangelized the youth in my parish, and after confirmation, our Mass attendance is missing a whole generation of youth.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG45 Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1307109655' post='2249450'] The program at my parish hosted weekly adoration sessions on Wednesday night. A priest or a deacon would show up to our parish hall at 8ish (we did praise & worship songs beginning at 7:30) and expose the Sacrament for us. We'd have silent adoration for about 45 minutes or so, and the priest or deacon would offer a benediction before reposing the Sacrament. The only time a non-clergy member ever exposed/reposed the Sacrament was if the YM (who was a Eucharistic Minister) had to do it during a LIFE Night when a priest or deacon was unavailable. That only ever happened a handful of times and I can assure you that he was well aware that laity aren't to be "blessing" people with the Monstrance. [/quote] Ditto at the parish I go to now when a Festival of Praise is hosted. The only time we had a non-priest do it, he had to go through about a month's worth of training first before Fr. trusted him not to try and do anything that wouldn't be allowed. And that was essentially just respectfully take Christ from the Tabernacle and put Him in the Monstrance. [quote name='dominicansoul' timestamp='1307119168' post='2249490'] our Mass attendance is missing a whole generation of youth.... [/quote] That's every Catholic parish I've been in except the university parish I'm at now, which is literally 20 feet from the university's parking garage. :heh: Though granted, it does sometimes result in some cool kindness. A friend and I were standing in line for Confession and he was going to be late for a play he had to go to for class, and was wondering if he'd have to leave and not receive, and was working himself into a tizzy (rightfully so) over it. I just leaned over to the 40-some year old women in front of him and asked if he could skip the line because he had a class event to get to where the doors would be locked, and they were overjoyed someone his age was at Confessions and nearly tossed him into the Confessional when the door opened! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 [quote name='dominicansoul' timestamp='1307119168' post='2249490'] its not for me... i was taught the mystical beauty and splendor of the Mass by my mom at a very early early age...i've always believed this is what teens need, not the rock n roll guitar choirs or the Priest who celebrates the Mass like Jay Leno does the Tonite Show... ...no need to make the Mass more "exciting.." I mean, what can be more exciting than Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ giving Himself to us in the Sacrament of the Eucharist? I've recognized a real hunger in teens, and it isn't satisfied by "gimmicks." All you need to feed them is Truth... Again, I'm not familiar with the "reverent" version of LifeTeen, as the only version I've witnessed is some psuedo-protestant, wishy washy stuff--a failure in every sense of the word...it hasn't evangelized the youth in my parish, and after confirmation, our Mass attendance is missing a whole generation of youth.... [/quote] Sometimes I wish I could bring all you LIFE TEEN haters on Phatmass to my parish. You all seem to have these really snooty, condescending attitude towards it, based probably on some combination of bad personal experiences and YouTube videos that show things that don't conform to your vision of holiness or whatever. It's actually pretty infuriating, and while I love me some DS (you know it, sis!), I feel the need to come to the defense of the program I know and love, to save it from the disparaging remarks that get thrown at it around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1307117718' post='2249488'] I regard LifeTeen in a similar way to the so-called Charismatic Renewal. [/quote] Have you read through the Life Teen program materials? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted June 3, 2011 Share Posted June 3, 2011 [quote name='dUSt' timestamp='1307123270' post='2249506'] Have you read through the Life Teen program materials? [/quote] Something is telling me the answer is no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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