kujo Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='HisChildForever' timestamp='1307205882' post='2249893'] I think, like all of us, that there is a serious catechesis problem in the Church today and it begins with our youth. I think a lot of youth ministers have the right intentions but the wrong methods - you might be able to temporarily pull kids into Church life by getting them involved in reading, and the music program, and serving on the altar, and doing little plays and whatnot, but that's pretty much community-based rather than theologically-based, all external and no internal. (I'm sure that Life Teen programs have Adoration though, I mean that's been mentioned in this thread.) The right methods would be to introduce the kids to Catholic teaching, the kind that's not discussed in CCD class, especially since CCD ends in the 8th grade (where I'm from at least) and kids are in youth group up until they're seniors in high school. Once they really get into what the Church teaches they'll get hungry for more and develop a really sound theological mind. Then they won't care if they read at Mass or not. [/quote] That's a good point. And LIFE TEEN takes the catechesis problem seriously; in fact, each year is broken into semesters where a particular theme (ex: the saints, Seven Deadly Sins, Beatitudes, the Mass) is exhaustively examined via 10-12 LIFE Nights. Each LIFE Night has a resource guide with relevant scripture, catechismal, and Saint/Pope quotes. It's meant to direct you towards the Church and it's richness. Of course, different YMs or programs have varying levels of adherence to this goal, but, as you said, that's a failing of the leadership within the particular program, not LIFE TEEN itself. They don't enforce quality standards or anything, which probably explains some of the horror stories people use to levy criticism at the program as a whole. I'd also like to say that LIFE TEEN is incredibly Eucharistically-focused, encouraging each program to set up a weekly adoration session for the whole program. They are also very devoted to the Virgin Mother and feature her (and her rosary) prominently in all of their nights and retreats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominicansoul Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1307205557' post='2249892'] Come on, Missy. Don't play the semantics game with me. In a very literal sense, it IS a responsiblity--there needs to be a certain amount of EMs at a given mass so as to serve the needs of the congregation. And when a parish or pastor or deacon decide to ask someone to be one, it ought to be a tremendously humbling honor. It's not an issue of being "worthy" for a "reward" and I never insinuated it was. So spare me the theology lesson. [/quote] i think what we're trying to get across, is that the role of Eucharistic Minister in the Catholic Church is EXTRAORDINARY, and has been abused to the point it has become an ORDINARY role. You don't "reward" peeps with this role, (teen or adult,) nor do you use this role to make people feel like they are taking an active participation in their Faith. Before the Church gave the permission for this ministry (again, only for extraordinary means), distribution of the Holy Eucharist didn't seem to be a problem with just the priests/deacons giving It out... ...fast forward to today, with a vastly lower percentage of Mass attendance than 40 years ago...why do we feel we need 10 to 15 EMs at every Mass now??? Its to the point of absurdity... I think teens would have more of a benefit if they weren't taught to abuse these roles... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='HisChildForever' timestamp='1307206260' post='2249894'] What are the "needs" of the congregation, though? I think too many parishioners rush out the door after Mass, a bunch after receiving. People need to be encouraged to stay in the pews, and especially encouraged to pray, pray, pray. If distribution of Holy Communion took an extra 10 or 15 minutes because there are two priests and one deacon distributing, you would have time to pray the Rosary or the Chaplet of Divine Mercy. There is too much rush, rush, rush and I believe MissScripture is just concerned that Christ is not getting the reverence He deserves. As an aside, I know in my parish that the pastor does not ask you to be an extraordinary minister, extraordinary ministers volunteer - and not a single volunteer is turned away (my dad is an usher so I'm "in the know" lol). [/quote] Again, semantics. The "needs" I refer to are the amount of EMs required to ensure an orderly, parsimonious distribution of Communion. Having laity and teens fulfill those roles has nothing to do with any of the problems you speak of, so I don't know how to respond to the rest of it. [quote name='HisChildForever' timestamp='1307206401' post='2249896'] Kujo, I understand that you are passionate about the Life Teen program. Clearly your participation in the program has made you the orthodox Catholic you are today. But let's not fight snideness with snideness. [/quote] Fair enough. I feel protective of the program because, as you said, it shaped me and I truly believe that doing so saved my life. I became involved during an immensely tumultuous time in my life and the structure and community and love I found in my community of faith gave me the strength to persevere through those hellish trials. Christ used it to rescue me from despair and hopelessness, and, for that, I will be eternally grateful. That said, I'm not blind to its flaws and don't agree with everything they do. I just don't think the attitude towards it around here is fair. Probably because of the many quasi-traditionalist/conservatives that populate this particular board. Some go so far as to lump it in with Protestantism, and that tends to set me off. It's like if someone insults your mom; even if what they said was true, you'd still feel like you wanted to pummel them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='dominicansoul' timestamp='1307206654' post='2249900'] i think what we're trying to get across, is that the role of Eucharistic Minister in the Catholic Church is EXTRAORDINARY, and has been abused to the point it has become an ORDINARY role. You don't "reward" peeps with this role, (teen or adult,) nor do you use this role to make people feel like they are taking an active participation in their Faith. Before the Church gave the permission for this ministry (again, only for extraordinary means), distribution of the Holy Eucharist didn't seem to be a problem with just the priests/deacons giving It out... ...fast forward to today, with a vastly lower percentage of Mass attendance than 40 years ago...why do we feel we need 10 to 15 EMs at every Mass now??? Its to the point of absurdity... I think teens would have more of a benefit if they weren't taught to abuse these roles... [/quote] Okay. But a) that is your opinion (one which I share, in some measure), b) that is neither the fault or the purpose of LIFE TEEN (teens doing EM stuff isn't an official component of their mission or something). That's a parish problem and not something that you can use to criticize LIFE TEEN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissScripture Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1307207589' post='2249905'] Okay. But a) that is your opinion (one which I share, in some measure), b) that is neither the fault or the purpose of LIFE TEEN (teens doing EM stuff isn't an official component of their mission or something). That's a parish problem and not something that you can use to criticize LIFE TEEN. [/quote] I was not addressing LifeTeen. I was addressing your comment that it should be an "award" for people. I don't care if it is or is not part of LifeTeen, anywhere that is using EMHC as an award has an issue. And I don't care if they are teenagers or adults, no one deserves it as an award. And don't tell me that's semantics. YOU used the word award. If that's not what you meant, then you should've chosen a different word, because it IS in fact a responsiblity that is given, and not an award for anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='MithLuin' timestamp='1307191927' post='2249848'] Wait. If someone speaks heresy, I have a problem with that. I really don't care what kind of music people sing at mass (yes, yes, you can sing 'Like a Sunflower' and I probably won't cringe too badly - childhood memories count for something). I really don't care if Life Teen is someone's 'thing' or not. I even don't care if nuns wear what I think looks like a habit or not. But if someone is preaching heresy to the youth, that needs to stop and be condemned. Granted, in the post above, it was not clear to me what the nun had to do with Life Teen. Nor do I know if what was being said was actually heretical. I am a teacher, and I've heard students misrepresent what was said in the classroom many times. A teacher tried to explain something, and all they heard was...something else. So, I'll give the person the benefit of the doubt (innocent until proven guilty), but... If someone is preaching heresy to the youth, that needs to stop. Tell the pastor, tell the bishop, tell the parents, do [i]something[/i] about it. [/quote] the way i read was 'the nun doesn't wear a habit, so she probably teaches heresy.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1307205557' post='2249892'] Come on, Missy. Don't play the semantics game with me. In a very literal sense, it IS a responsiblity--there needs to be a certain amount of EMs at a given mass so as to serve the needs of the congregation. [/quote]well, we could also start arguing if EMEs are even necessary lol [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1307205557' post='2249892']And when a parish or pastor or deacon decide to ask someone to be one, it ought to be a tremendously humbling honor. [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amppax Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='AudreyGrace' timestamp='1307205542' post='2249891'] hope you like stinky clothes. [/quote] NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1307213315' post='2249936'] well, we could also start arguing if EMEs are even necessary lol [/quote] We [i]could[/i] have that discussion. It would not have anything to do with the original topic of this thread, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='kujo' timestamp='1307216239' post='2249969'] We [i]could[/i] have that discussion. It would not have anything to do with the original topic of this thread, though. [/quote] i was being extremely facetious. i would not [i]want[/i] to have that discussion for the 8,500,000,000,000,000,000th time. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1307216428' post='2249970'] i was being extremely facetious. i would not [i]want[/i] to have that discussion for the 8,500,000,000,000,000,000th time. lol [/quote] I know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Adam Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 yikes. 8 pages. What was said? Did everyone agree that Life Teen is neither inherently good or evil, but is one of the top youth ministry programs available to Catholics today? If so amesome. I love how the national Life Teen staff is constantly going to Adoration and praying for the needs of anyone who asks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePenciledOne Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 [quote name='Brother Adam' timestamp='1307225427' post='2249990'] yikes. 8 pages. What was said? Did everyone agree that Life Teen is neither inherently good or evil, but is one of the top youth ministry programs available to Catholics today? If so amesome. I love how the national Life Teen staff is constantly going to Adoration and praying for the needs of anyone who asks. [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
add Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 When Life Teen received the Papal blessing in the late ’90′s the then frail Pontiff became animated and enlivened by the enthusiastic teens who were present, not because of their energy but because they signified everything that is right with the future of our Church and everything that the Pope believed in when he told the youth that he “consigned (his) hope to them” (WYD Toronto 2003). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Add, I was there for those words by our beloved Pope. As beautiful then as it is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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