The Free Masons

[CatherineM]

My grandfather was a 33 degree Mason. He wasn't Catholic though.

[Maximilianus]

This book is short and to the point.

[url="https://www.tanbooks.com/index.php/page/shop:flypage/product_id/690/keywords/madden/"]Freemasonry Mankind's Hidden Enemy.
[/url]With Current Official Catholic Statements
By: Br. Charles Madden O.F.M. Conv.

Edited May 31, 2011 by Maximilianus

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='CatherineM' timestamp='1306874520' post='2248304']
My grandfather was a 33 degree Mason. He wasn't Catholic though.
[/quote]


My grandfather was also not Catholic and a Mason, I have no idea what degree he was, but i know he saw something or was told something that offended his very sincere Chirstianity. He would not let my mother or aunt be part of their youth groups, he would not let my grandmother be part of the Eastern Star, and he did not attend meetings anywhere he lived after they moved from the lodge he origionally joined (aparantly his attedance there was regular and then, abruptly, stopped) . He did however, send his dues home religiously. He told my grandmother something to the effect that "It would be unwise not to".

Edited May 31, 2011 by Don John of Austria

[xSilverPhinx]

[quote name='Amppax' timestamp='1306847991' post='2248125']
No Deism is the belief that there is (or may be) a God, but that God doesn't interfere in the world, and hasn't since creating it (thus rejecting all religions as fully true, and reducing them to mythologies). This presents a lot of problems for Catholics. And historically (as far as I know) the Masons were tied to Deism (at least, in US history, several of the prominent founders were both deists and masons). I'm not sure if this is still the case, but historically in the US it was.

[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism[/url]

[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Masons#The_Supreme_Being_and_the_Volume_of_Sacred_Law"]http://en.wikipedia....e_of_Sacred_Law[/url]
[/quote]

I short while back I read a part of one of their rather long and tedious books describing their rituals, origin and message but it didn't actively promote anything that looks like deism. Instead, they made a point of saying that different religious beliefs are welcome but are not part of masonry. They have everything from hindus to catholics but don't encourage the discussion of the particulars of every belief because it leads to inevitable conflict and division within the masonic lodge.

They're represent a more humanisitc religious thing, IMO, which is a difficult place to be because religions can and do cause division.

[CatherineM]

[quote name='Don John of Austria' timestamp='1306875659' post='2248326']
My grandfather was also not Catholic and a Mason, I have no idea what degree he was, but i know he saw something or was told something that offended his very sincere Chirstianity. He would not let my mother or aunt be part of their youth groups, he would not let my grandmother be part of the Eastern Star, and he did not attend meetings anywhere he lived after they moved from the lodge he origionally joined (aparantly his attedance there was regular and then, abruptly, stopped) . He did however, send his dues home religiously. He told my grandmother something to the effect that "It would be unwise not to".
[/quote]
If I remember correctly, my grandmother was more active in the Eastern Star than he was in the Masons. It's too bad that your grandfather never told you what happened. That would be interesting.

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='CatherineM' timestamp='1306876649' post='2248339']
If I remember correctly, my grandmother was more active in the Eastern Star than he was in the Masons. It's too bad that your grandfather never told you what happened. That would be interesting.
[/quote]


I got the impression that he thought breaking that oath of secrecy was dangerous to him and his.

My mother says he was quite adament about the youth group thing, my grandmother had apparntly signed she and her sister up and he went down and removed them. He had no problem with them being in other organizations, just nothing involving the Mason's .

[MithLuin]

A Freemason cannot be buried in a Catholic graveyard. Just sayin'.

I realize that's not a 'why not?' but it would perhaps be worth mentioning to your brother to drive home the point that one has to choose between being Catholic and being a Freemason; you can't be both at once. Basically, the Freemasons were historically very anti-Catholic, and the Church has wanted no part in the organization and continues to ban her members from participation.

It is possible that the 'modern' Freemasons are much less antiCatholic than their predecessors...but I wouldn't bet on it.

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='Ice_nine' timestamp='1306850011' post='2248134']
I thought it had something to do with them being a "secret society."

But i've been wrong before
[/quote]


Your not wrong, this is one reason. As a Catholic you are to have no secrets that one cannot tell your confessor, Masons make such a vow.

[White Knight]

The masons according to John Salva in their rituals, try to bring equality to all religions, and asks you to acknowledge this as fact.

Well any faithful, Christian, Catholic or Protestant, Catholic in this case, cannot do this in good conscience, it voilates the very essence of our Profession in a Monotheistic God, even though the Freemasons believe in "The Great Architect." meaning one supreme being, even though it trys to bring all religions together to this belief, it askes Christians, Jews, and Muslims to deannounce its very stances.

Well according to God's relevation the Deposit of Faith, given to us, He has revealed himself to us, and we know who He is and who He is not, and to say we must accept another religion as equal, who doesn't have that, would be asking us to spit in God's face so to speak, We as Catholics can't say that Jesus and Budda are equal, or Sheba and Jesus are the correct path, especially When God Himself, with what relevation He has given mankind, clearly states, that He will not allow other gods to be equal to Him, So Any good knowledgeable servant of God, will know that this would contradicting the first commandment God has given us.

Freemasonry attempts to say it doesn't matter what you call him.

Well Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, say it does matter what you call him.

In short, Freemasonry promotes a path of Religious Indifference, that leads to Agnosticism, and/ or Atheism.

It has and always will be opposed to Catholicism.

[color="#0000FF"][b][url="http://www.catholicapologetics.info/modernproblems/freemasonry/pmasnry.htm"]Catholicism & Freemasonry[/url][/b][/color]

[White Knight]

[quote name='The Shover Robot' timestamp='1306867167' post='2248238']
They control the British Crown, keep the metric system down, keep Atlantis of the maps, and keep the martians under wraps. They're also responsible for holding back the electric car and keeping Steve Gutenberg a star. They've also been know to rob cavefish of their sight and rig every Oscar night.

They do.
They do.
[/quote]


LOL the Simpsons, Stone Cutters episode, it was funny.

[infinitelord1]

[quote name='White Knight' timestamp='1306910904' post='2248613']
The masons according to John Salva in their rituals, try to bring equality to all religions, and asks you to acknowledge this as fact.

Well any faithful, Christian, Catholic or Protestant, Catholic in this case, cannot do this in good conscience, it voilates the very essence of our Profession in a Monotheistic God, even though the Freemasons believe in "The Great Architect." meaning one supreme being, even though it trys to bring all religions together to this belief, it askes Christians, Jews, and Muslims to deannounce its very stances.

Well according to God's relevation the Deposit of Faith, given to us, He has revealed himself to us, and we know who He is and who He is not, and to say we must accept another religion as equal, who doesn't have that, would be asking us to spit in God's face so to speak, We as Catholics can't say that Jesus and Budda are equal, or Sheba and Jesus are the correct path, especially When God Himself, with what relevation He has given mankind, clearly states, that He will not allow other gods to be equal to Him, So Any good knowledgeable servant of God, will know that this would contradicting the first commandment God has given us.

Freemasonry attempts to say it doesn't matter what you call him.

Well Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, say it does matter what you call him.

In short, Freemasonry promotes a path of Religious Indifference, that leads to Agnosticism, and/ or Atheism.

It has and always will be opposed to Catholicism.

[color="#0000FF"][b][url="http://www.catholicapologetics.info/modernproblems/freemasonry/pmasnry.htm"]Catholicism & Freemasonry[/url][/b][/color]
[/quote]


Where is the syringe? I think we need to administer a dose of Catholicism....Muhahahahaha.

Edited June 1, 2011 by infinitelord1

[stevil]

[quote name='White Knight' timestamp='1306910904' post='2248613']
In short, Freemasonry promotes a path of Religious Indifference, that leads to Agnosticism, and/ or Atheism.

It has and always will be opposed to Catholicism.
[/quote]
I don't know much about Free Mason but from what you are saying it seems to promote religious tolerance more than religious indifference and seems to be tolerant of Catholicism more than opposed to.
It seems that it is Catholicism that is opposed to Free Mason.

Atheism is lack of belief in god, which has no dictated reference to tolerance or opposition of faiths.
Anti theist is about opposition

Edited June 1, 2011 by stevil

[xSilverPhinx]

[quote name='White Knight' timestamp='1306910904' post='2248613']
In short, Freemasonry promotes a path of Religious Indifference, that leads to Agnosticism, and/ or Atheism.
[/quote]

They're actually opposed to the idea of atheism in fact, and value a belief in god, though not any god in particular.

In fact, they refer to god as the "architect" while people are the masons (using their own symbology).

[White Knight]

[quote name='stevil' timestamp='1306915606' post='2248620']
I don't know much about Free Mason but from what you are saying it seems to promote religious tolerance more than religious indifference and seems to be tolerant of Catholicism more than opposed to.
It seems that it is Catholicism that is opposed to Free Mason.

Atheism is lack of belief in god, which has no dictated reference to tolerance or opposition of faiths.
Anti theist is about opposition
[/quote]


Freemasons attempt to call it that, however, the common sense factor kicks in with that path, and one can only ignore those questions for so long, before they start to get a "it doesn't matter policy." going on in their head. Ya it may start out as tolerance, but it evenually leads down a road, where people begin to even question the very meaning of religion, "if all lead to heaven, it doesn't matter." which makes people indifferent, because then they wouldn't care. thus it leads to agnostism, or even atheism. It may not be that at first, but thats how it turns out.


It may claim to promote tolerance among all religions, however this thinking is very much a mask to the deeper layers of the lifestyle for a freemason.

[stevil]

[quote name='White Knight' timestamp='1306945745' post='2248734']
Freemasons attempt to call it that, however, the common sense factor kicks in with that path, and one can only ignore those questions for so long, before they start to get a "it doesn't matter policy." going on in their head. Ya it may start out as tolerance, but it evenually leads down a road, where people begin to even question the very meaning of religion, "if all lead to heaven, it doesn't matter." which makes people indifferent, because then they wouldn't care. thus it leads to agnostism, or even atheism. It may not be that at first, but thats how it turns out.


It may claim to promote tolerance among all religions, however this thinking is very much a mask to the deeper layers of the lifestyle for a freemason.
[/quote]
Atheism isn't an "I don't care" path. Atheism is a stance where a person cannot hold onto a belief in gods, they don't and can't beleive, the theories don't match their ideas of reality and there is no bridge. A person that doesn't care is an Apathest.