Female Altar Severs In Choir Dress...

[Cam42]

This question was posed at another blog and I thought it might be a good topic for discussion here....

[quote]What would be a proper response to a priest who not only allows his female altar servers to wear the black cassock and white surplice, but also tells the parishioners that it is perfectly acceptable to do so?
It doesn’t seem right and I am uncomfortable telling my children that it is o.k when they have questioned it. This priest also feels that Exposition in front of the Blessed Sacrament is of no additional benefit, would not allow a display of Vatican approved Eucharistic Miracles because it encouraged the “superstitious”, and wants nothing to do with our Perpetual Eucharistic Adoration Chapel. Thank you for your help…[/quote]

My response to the question follows...

[color="#FF0000"]Realistically, it is very simple.

Female altar servers are not necessary. They are needed when there is a particular need. I don’t see that need. Seminaries are filling back up, which means that young men are becoming more interested in the priesthood again. This being the case, the recruitment of boys to serve should not be all that difficult. All one has to do is make it appealing to young men.

Boys, being boys don’t want to serve with girls. Boys are not lazy, boys are not misguided by not going to Mass. Boys don’t want to sit next to girls. Take the girls out, the boys will return. It really is that simple. If you don’t believe me, then ask them. I have mentioned that I’ve worked as an MC in my parish. I’ve asked. That is the answer I got. When I get a group of boys, without girls to serve, they are happy to do it. But the second a girl shows up in the sacristy, heads go down and the boys become very quiet. That is called emasculation, in case you were keeping score.

However, from a more formal point of view, the role of a server is an extraordinary one to the ministries of the Church. Lector, acolyte, and deacon. If those roles are proper to males only, which they are, wouldn’t it follow logically that the extraordinary role would fall to males only? Logic says yes. Unfortunately the leadership of the Church, spurred by the American and German liberal politico pushed for and got passed the contrary.[/color]


What do you think? Please provide reasoning in the thread, if you vote....if you don't vote, just say why.....thanks...

Edited May 26, 2011 by Cam42

[MIKolbe]

I am not sure even if there was a need, which I don't think there was, is, or will be, that I would like the idea or practice of having female altar servers.

[MithLuin]

I was a female altar server growing up, and it was great to have that opportunity. We wore white robes with rope cinctures in the liturgical color, as did the male altar servers. The only time I wore what you are referring to as 'choir dress' was when I was asked to be thurifer at my cousin's wedding in an Episcopal church.

Certainly, there are situations where it would be silly to use female altar servers (ie, at a seminary, where there are plenty of young men around who should be practicing serving at the altar). But I see no problem with the average parish making use of both male and female children for these roles.

[Winchester]

[quote name='MithLuin' timestamp='1306419927' post='2246187']
...female ...
[/quote]
That explains so much.

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1306419375' post='2246185']
I am not sure even if there was a need, which I don't think there was, is, or will be, that I would like the idea or practice of having female altar servers.
[/quote]
I think I agree.

[dominicansoul]

Unless it is a convent, i'd like to see only males in the Altar area...

[Cam42]

My response was in light of the 1994 legislation which allows for females to serve if there is a particular need. As it stands, I agree with Kolbe...I don't think that there ever was a need for them to begin with. I think that they were forced upon us by the American and German Conferences which are both notoriously liberal.

That being said, this is not an issue of dogma, nor is it an issue of doctrine. It is a matter of discipline, one which can be revoked at any time. And any pastor can do this. He is not bound by his bishop. I think that it would go along way to fostering vocations if the pastors of the parishes would simply create a sodality for the girls currently serving and have them serve Holy Mother Church in that way, rather than giving them false hope that their service at the altar might lead someplace more meaningful.

This idea of emasculating the Mass is blase and it is outdated. It reflects an incorrect Sacramental theology and it gives false hope to those who should not wish to hope for that which cannot come to pass. This incorrect theological stance is an easy fix....we just need the parents of Catholic girls to stand up and say no, this is not right for my little girl. We need pastors to stand up and say no, this is not right for my little girls. We need the Church to correct the discipline and return to a mode of altar service which promotes priestly vocations 100%, without the distraction of long hair, make up and non-authentic feminism.

[Cam42]

[quote name='dominicansoul' timestamp='1306422514' post='2246205']
Unless it is a convent, i'd like to see only males in the Altar area...
[/quote]

Even in a convent...Mother Abbess (prioress, etc....) would not "serve" the Mass. She would make the responses and ring the bell, whilst kneeling at the rail. This was assuming that a male couldn't make it to serve. Service at the altar should remain for those who have the proper characteristics to do so. Females do not have that characteristic.

[FutureSister2009]

I was an Altar Server for three years. I stopped before I started high school. More and more boys are becoming Altar Servers and less girls are. I don't have an issue with girls serving but I can understand why boys are preferred. Sometimes I do prefer the boys. I do miss Altar Serving and I wish I could go back but I am too old. We had great outfits for the girls to wear. They were like Sisters habits. We were called Adorers of the Precious Blood and the boys are the Knights of the Altar.

[dUSt]

If the question is how to respond to the priest, then I think it would be a better use of time and energy to think of ways to reply to the fact that he see's no benefit in exposition of the Holy Eucharist, or the fact that he shows no interest in adoration. Maybe it's just me, but this issue seems way more important than the female altar server issue--and I would think that if the priest starts to embrace Christ's True Presence in the Eucharist, true orthodoxy in other matters will quickly follow.

On the other hand, I highly doubt that arguing with the priest about the validity of female altar servers will lead him any closer to the Blessed Sacrament.

[Cam42]

[quote name='dUSt' timestamp='1306424114' post='2246218']
If the question is how to respond to the priest, then I think it would be a better use of time and energy to think of ways to reply to the fact that he see's no benefit in exposition of the Holy Eucharist, or the fact that he shows no interest in adoration. Maybe it's just me, but this issue seems way more important than the female altar server issue--and I would think that if the priests starts to embrace Christ's True Presence in the Eucharist, true orthodoxy in other matters will quickly follow.

On the other hand, I highly doubt that arguing with the priest about the validity of female altar servers will lead him any closer to the Blessed Sacrament.
[/quote]

I disagree...the issue of female altar servers is just as important. If we continue to emasculate the Liturgy and undermine vocations in this manner, then there won't be any priests left to confect the Blessed Sacrament. Then there will be NO adoration at all.

The Church has been "promoting" Eucharistic adoration, to a much greater extent (perpetual adoration was not commonplace before the 1980s) and still heterodoxy remains strong. Eliminating heterodoxy takes more than prayer, it takes action. The removal of an impediment to vocations (ie. girls in the sanctuary) is a strong and step toward the continuation of the filling of seminaries....

Like I said, there are important places in the Church for females, just not in the sanctuary.

[dUSt]

[quote name='Cam42' timestamp='1306424760' post='2246220']
I disagree...the issue of female altar servers is just as important. If we continue to emasculate the Liturgy and undermine vocations in this manner, then there won't be any priests left to confect the Blessed Sacrament. Then there will be NO adoration at all.

The Church has been "promoting" Eucharistic adoration, to a much greater extent (perpetual adoration was not commonplace before the 1980s) and still heterodoxy remains strong. Eliminating heterodoxy takes more than prayer, it takes action. The removal of an impediment to vocations (ie. girls in the sanctuary) is a strong and step toward the continuation of the filling of seminaries....

Like I said, there are important places in the Church for females, just not in the sanctuary.
[/quote]
You're preaching to the choir. But, the fact is, the church allows female altar servers. Get over it.

You have to pick your battles, and in the above case, a priest who does not embrace Christ's True Presence in the Holy Eucharist is a [b]far[/b] greater concern than a priest who allows female altar servers.

If you do not see this, then I'm afraid you're blinded by your obsession with all things liturgical--and in my opinion, are doing more harm than good if your intent is to glorify Christ's One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.

[dominicansoul]

[quote name='Cam42' timestamp='1306423199' post='2246209']
Even in a convent...Mother Abbess (prioress, etc....) would not "serve" the Mass. She would make the responses and ring the bell, whilst kneeling at the rail. This was assuming that a male couldn't make it to serve. Service at the altar should remain for those who have the proper characteristics to do so. Females do not have that characteristic.
[/quote]

I agree.

[Jaime]

[quote name='Cam42' timestamp='1306424760' post='2246220']
I disagree...the issue of female altar servers is just as important. If we continue to emasculate the Liturgy and undermine vocations in this manner, then there won't be any priests left to confect the Blessed Sacrament. Then there will be NO adoration at all.

The Church has been "promoting" Eucharistic adoration, to a much greater extent (perpetual adoration was not commonplace before the 1980s) and still heterodoxy remains strong. Eliminating heterodoxy takes more than prayer, it takes action. The removal of an impediment to vocations (ie. girls in the sanctuary) is a strong and step toward the continuation of the filling of seminaries....

Like I said, there are important places in the Church for females, just not in the sanctuary.
[/quote]

That is patently untrue. There will never be a situation Camster where there won't be any priests left to confect the Blessed Sacrament.. If we were without priests, we would be without Church and we will always have the Church. That has been promised to us.

And I would tweak your statement that the Church has been promoting Eucharistic adoration. I'd say it's been promoting it badly and could promote it better. The churches in our Church have been distracted by other things than heterodoxy. They have been distracted by lack of funding. They have been distracted by the over sensationalism of abusive priests. They have become distracted to the point of almost saying "Yes adoration would be great but we need to take care of these things first". While it is my firm belief... Actually i would say I KNOW this to be true in my heart, that if 24 hour adoration was occurring at every parish, the rest of our problems with abuses in the liturgy, funding, etc. would all but disappear.

[Cam42]

[quote name='dUSt' timestamp='1306426127' post='2246223']
You're preaching to the choir. But, the fact is, the church allows female altar servers. Get over it.

You have to pick your battles, and in the above case, a priest who does not embrace Christ's True Presence in the Holy Eucharist is a [b]far[/b] greater concern than a priest who allows female altar servers.

If you do not see this, then I'm afraid you're blinded by your obsession with all things liturgical--and in my opinion, are doing more harm than good if your intent is to glorify Christ's One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.
[/quote]

Nope, I will not "get over it."

You're right I have to pick my battles and liturgical ones are the ones I choose to fight, FIRST! Mainly because 99% Catholics view being Catholic through the lens of the liturgy. FACT. So, I will fight this battle in the way I see best to do it.

Without the liturgy, we would not have the Blessed Sacrament. And my "obsession with all things liturgical" is not out place in a liturgical Church. Duh. The Liturgy is the source and summit of our Faith. Bottom Line. Perhaps you need to get that plank out of your eye, dUSt.